[HandDownManDown13Participant]

 We all heard a ton about Wiggins’ electrifying athleticism coming into this season. Parker’s athleticism , on the otherhand, was one of his knocks. At this point in the season, I think it has become clear that there isn’t that much difference between the two, as Wiggins is slightly less explosive than expected, and Parker is vastly more explosive than expected. 

I’d make a bet that Parker actually has more Dunks this season than Wigins (can’t seem to find Data for this). From what i’ve seen, Wiggins tries to use his speed and jumping ability to get good looks through contact, while Parker looks to finish dump-offs using his length with a dunk whenever possible. 

I find it interesting that the "less athletic" player is turning out to be the more powerful finisher at this point in the season. 

 

 

[HandDownManDown13Participant]

 Just to be clear I don’t think Parker is a better athlete than wiggins (wiggins is much faster in general, especially laterally). I just think they have a more similar vertical explosiveness than we expected. 

[HandDownManDown13Participant]

 Just to be clear I don’t think Parker is a better athlete than wiggins (wiggins is much faster in general, especially laterally). I just think they have a more similar vertical explosiveness than we expected. 

[mplsrawkusParticipant]

 i agree with HDMD13. i don’t know why every body is on wiggins dick about being a freak athlete. i haven’t seen one dunk this season that impressed me. if he’s such a freak athlete he should be head level with the rim on most of his dunks (like gerald green) but he’s not even close. i know on all his h.s. mix tapes he has dunks where he is up there but none in college.

 

[mplsrawkusParticipant]

 i agree with HDMD13. i don’t know why every body is on wiggins dick about being a freak athlete. i haven’t seen one dunk this season that impressed me. if he’s such a freak athlete he should be head level with the rim on most of his dunks (like gerald green) but he’s not even close. i know on all his h.s. mix tapes he has dunks where he is up there but none in college.

 

[LA12Participant]

 A lot of Parker’s dunks come more from his length. Yes, he’s surprised me with more bounce in his step than I thought he had, but Wiggins is still clearly the superior vertical leaper. He’s like a pogo stick, just wait until the combine and you’ll see it’s really not that close.

[LA12Participant]

 A lot of Parker’s dunks come more from his length. Yes, he’s surprised me with more bounce in his step than I thought he had, but Wiggins is still clearly the superior vertical leaper. He’s like a pogo stick, just wait until the combine and you’ll see it’s really not that close.

[jwall1Participant]

Wiggins is still a freak athlete, and Parker is not. I do think however that Parker is underrated athletically…

[jwall1Participant]

Wiggins is still a freak athlete, and Parker is not. I do think however that Parker is underrated athletically…

[roni3Participant]

 Honestly it comes down do how you truly define athletism as, to me you have to break it down to subcategories such as: initial first step, followed by straight forward speed, than comes the vertical and lastly the lift or airtime someone gets on their shot. With regards to Wiggins he has an elite first step, really fast straight forward speed, and about a 40′ vertical, his lift on his jump shot is average. Overall Wiggins is as athletic as they come. Parker on the other hand, has a decisive first step, unbelievable straight forward speed as seen through his varies fast breaks running last 2-3 defenders, the most underrated thing is his vertical which was made out to be average when really it’s probably around 35-38′, lastly his airtime on his shot in as good as unstoppable in terms of not being able to block him. I hate when people assume someone cannot have a great career because he is an average athlete. Examples of this would be Curry, Kyrie, Harden, Love, Lamarcus, etc. I would rather have a way more polished and skilled player than a player who is really athletic yet really raw knowing that he had more potential to become a bust. 

[roni3Participant]

 Honestly it comes down do how you truly define athletism as, to me you have to break it down to subcategories such as: initial first step, followed by straight forward speed, than comes the vertical and lastly the lift or airtime someone gets on their shot. With regards to Wiggins he has an elite first step, really fast straight forward speed, and about a 40′ vertical, his lift on his jump shot is average. Overall Wiggins is as athletic as they come. Parker on the other hand, has a decisive first step, unbelievable straight forward speed as seen through his varies fast breaks running last 2-3 defenders, the most underrated thing is his vertical which was made out to be average when really it’s probably around 35-38′, lastly his airtime on his shot in as good as unstoppable in terms of not being able to block him. I hate when people assume someone cannot have a great career because he is an average athlete. Examples of this would be Curry, Kyrie, Harden, Love, Lamarcus, etc. I would rather have a way more polished and skilled player than a player who is really athletic yet really raw knowing that he had more potential to become a bust. 

[DukeBlue22Participant]

 10-16 versus Iowa State and then 2-12 versus Kansas. He needs to be more consistant, his vertical and speed will get him far, but it is not going to come with great ease in the NBA. I think he needs another year to develop and create his own shot. 

Jabari has great length and can clearly board. I believe he has more ready then Wiggins to make the jump to the pros.

 

[DukeBlue22Participant]

 10-16 versus Iowa State and then 2-12 versus Kansas. He needs to be more consistant, his vertical and speed will get him far, but it is not going to come with great ease in the NBA. I think he needs another year to develop and create his own shot. 

Jabari has great length and can clearly board. I believe he has more ready then Wiggins to make the jump to the pros.

 

[DukeBlue22Participant]

Heard that he will stay another year at Duke. Would love to see what he can do as a TRUE SF which Okafor and Jefferson playing C and PF. 

[DukeBlue22Participant]

Heard that he will stay another year at Duke. Would love to see what he can do as a TRUE SF which Okafor and Jefferson playing C and PF. 

[DukeBlue22Participant]

I also feel Wiggins games go quietless. He is that good and can sometimes make going to the hoop effortless. Bright Future Ahead

[DukeBlue22Participant]

I also feel Wiggins games go quietless. He is that good and can sometimes make going to the hoop effortless. Bright Future Ahead

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

Parker is playing the 4/5 for Duke on a more than consistent basis. Wiggins has been a 2/3 for Kansas. My guess is post touches, opportunities near the basket favor Parker being closer to the hoop. Not to mention that at this point, Parker definitely is stronger as far as having about 30 pounds on Wiggins.

So, for dunks, am guessing you are right. Wiggins had a few nice ones today, though Parker has been crushing more post touches. What I will say is that when it comes to shooting near the basket, Wiggins seems to be at least as or even slightly more efficient. I know that Wiggins has done really well in transition this year and am guessing he should thrive in those scenarios at the next level.

According to Hoop-Math.com (great site, they have even more stats with membership, but without they are still awesome), Parker is 74-127 (58.3%) on "shots at the rim" (shots that would be considered lay-ups or dunks, close to the basket). That is of course not based on today, where he played a definitely outmatched Boston College team whose been ravaged by injuries inside (not saying he was still not impressive, just stating that he was at an advantage). Wiggins is at 53-92 (57.6%), though through much of the season was ahead of Parker.

Still, not a major difference and Parker has had a lot more of those close shots assisted. Not to mention, much more of his jumpshots have been assisted as well, which to me is a sign of Wiggins maybe having to create more of those opportunities from the perimeter. For most teams, I am sure they would be getting Wiggins more looks and shots at the basket. I believe he is being challenged to be a perimeter player and while he still obviously has work to do, this should end up being highly advantageous down the line.

Lateral quickness I think is the major separation between the two. Wiggins is faster and his vertical is higher, Parker is stronger which I believe has helped him make the transition to the post rather seamlessly. What I will say is that Wiggins has guarded quick guards pretty damn well and when he is set to lock down a shooter, he gives them incredibly little breathing room. Think this is where the Paul George comparisons really come to fruition, as George was called to lock up Damian Lillard in last nights win over Portland. Wiggins seems to be in line to provide that type of versatility as a defender, he is so quick and long, he shows huge potential as a perimeter defender.

What Wiggins does need to do is gain upper body strength. He sometimes avoids contact and while he is not weak, he misses some of those close opportunities probably due to his only being 200 or so pounds. Still, from where he has been playing and getting the ball, along with having to usually make space for post players like Joel Embiid and Perry Ellis, am guessing Wiggins is getting around a dunk or so a game. Parker may be getting a couple, usually how it works when a player is given the opportunity to play closer to the basket. 

If Wiggins does build up his body, than watch out. It is still an "if" and Parker still does have the opportunity to trim down. Both are guys I see causing mismatches down the line and Parker is still a solid athlete, if not spectacular. Still, one needs to get through Kenneth Faried, Terrence Jones, Miles Plumlee and Timofey Mozgove before getting to Paul George amongst NBA dunk leaders (as of when this was posted). Wish their was a same way to find a list for college dunk leaders, though I know Parker is helped by his strength and where he tends to play on offense as opposed to Wiggins being helped by his incredible ups. This shouldn’t be confused with Parker therefore being on his level as an overall athlete, though he of course is going to challenge him as a player and prospect for reasons beyond dunking.

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

Parker is playing the 4/5 for Duke on a more than consistent basis. Wiggins has been a 2/3 for Kansas. My guess is post touches, opportunities near the basket favor Parker being closer to the hoop. Not to mention that at this point, Parker definitely is stronger as far as having about 30 pounds on Wiggins.

So, for dunks, am guessing you are right. Wiggins had a few nice ones today, though Parker has been crushing more post touches. What I will say is that when it comes to shooting near the basket, Wiggins seems to be at least as or even slightly more efficient. I know that Wiggins has done really well in transition this year and am guessing he should thrive in those scenarios at the next level.

According to Hoop-Math.com (great site, they have even more stats with membership, but without they are still awesome), Parker is 74-127 (58.3%) on "shots at the rim" (shots that would be considered lay-ups or dunks, close to the basket). That is of course not based on today, where he played a definitely outmatched Boston College team whose been ravaged by injuries inside (not saying he was still not impressive, just stating that he was at an advantage). Wiggins is at 53-92 (57.6%), though through much of the season was ahead of Parker.

Still, not a major difference and Parker has had a lot more of those close shots assisted. Not to mention, much more of his jumpshots have been assisted as well, which to me is a sign of Wiggins maybe having to create more of those opportunities from the perimeter. For most teams, I am sure they would be getting Wiggins more looks and shots at the basket. I believe he is being challenged to be a perimeter player and while he still obviously has work to do, this should end up being highly advantageous down the line.

Lateral quickness I think is the major separation between the two. Wiggins is faster and his vertical is higher, Parker is stronger which I believe has helped him make the transition to the post rather seamlessly. What I will say is that Wiggins has guarded quick guards pretty damn well and when he is set to lock down a shooter, he gives them incredibly little breathing room. Think this is where the Paul George comparisons really come to fruition, as George was called to lock up Damian Lillard in last nights win over Portland. Wiggins seems to be in line to provide that type of versatility as a defender, he is so quick and long, he shows huge potential as a perimeter defender.

What Wiggins does need to do is gain upper body strength. He sometimes avoids contact and while he is not weak, he misses some of those close opportunities probably due to his only being 200 or so pounds. Still, from where he has been playing and getting the ball, along with having to usually make space for post players like Joel Embiid and Perry Ellis, am guessing Wiggins is getting around a dunk or so a game. Parker may be getting a couple, usually how it works when a player is given the opportunity to play closer to the basket. 

If Wiggins does build up his body, than watch out. It is still an "if" and Parker still does have the opportunity to trim down. Both are guys I see causing mismatches down the line and Parker is still a solid athlete, if not spectacular. Still, one needs to get through Kenneth Faried, Terrence Jones, Miles Plumlee and Timofey Mozgove before getting to Paul George amongst NBA dunk leaders (as of when this was posted). Wish their was a same way to find a list for college dunk leaders, though I know Parker is helped by his strength and where he tends to play on offense as opposed to Wiggins being helped by his incredible ups. This shouldn’t be confused with Parker therefore being on his level as an overall athlete, though he of course is going to challenge him as a player and prospect for reasons beyond dunking.

[The Scare Crow RisesParticipant]

I hate this tired debate between Parker/Wiggins…

Right Now Who’s the better NBA player???  

Who are you taking with the top pick in June??? 

 

  

[The Scare Crow RisesParticipant]

I hate this tired debate between Parker/Wiggins…

Right Now Who’s the better NBA player???  

Who are you taking with the top pick in June??? 

 

  

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

 lol you should start getting used to it cus they’re going to be compared their whole careers.especially if Parker doesnt stay another year at Duke.

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

 lol you should start getting used to it cus they’re going to be compared their whole careers.especially if Parker doesnt stay another year at Duke.

[runBruceParticipant]

 Wiggins

[runBruceParticipant]

 Wiggins

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

You say "right now" and basing it off that is ridiculous. That is why I still go with Wiggins. You know you are my boy Scarecrow, just do not always agree with your take on draft picks and the logic behind it. Hate to do this, but you were a massive proponent of Brandon Knight over Kyrie Irving because "Kyrie had not played/proved enough", among other reasons. "Proving enough" is something you ultimately would love to see, though it does not necessarily make someone a better NBA prospect.

Jabari Parker is the better player right now, which does not necessarily mean that Andrew Wiggins does not potentially become the better NBA player. Parker’s body is obviously much more college ready, think the strength portion is a huge reason for his being a more effective player at this point. His ball skills are more refined and he is a better shooter. However, Wiggins is a much better on ball defender, especially on the perimeter. Wiggins also has athleticism that is incredibly special, enough so to see flashes of things that translate to the NBA.

With Parker, you definitely see things that translate as well. What you don’t know is how well he will defend and what will happen with his body. Conditioning wise, it definitely appears that Parker will have to tighten up his body to reach the potential he possesses. We have seen in the past that Jabari can indeed gain weight pretty easily, much more so than Wiggins. Looks like Wiggins can definitely needs to gain upper body strength, though he appears to have some ability to do so and I do not think you will ever have to worry about him as far as conditioning.

For as effective Parker has been, you have to love that Wiggins is playing huge minutes. He is on a better team where he does not necessarily have to be in kill mode, though has gotten much more aggressive as the year has progressed. He gets to the line quite a bit, his shot has shown progress and he has a nice release. The upside is there and while people worry about his mentality, I think he still has more to learn and has shown an ability to be coached.

Guessing the NBA may actually be a fantastic level of competition and really bring out the best in Wiggins. Call me a homer, though I honestly usually am not biased towards Canadians in the least (think people here can go back and see my thoughts on Anthony Bennett if they want proof, this was before he played in the NBA). I think he and Parker are both great prospects, can understand why some people like Parker more.

Feel the difference is not as large as people feel and that while Parker is "playing out of position" (the guy has been more physically dominant than anyone forever, think the stretch 4 is not necessarily a killer), Wiggins is being challenged even more so with new things. You can think he is overrated or not living up to the hype, to me he has done pretty much what I expected. He has some things to improve on, but I see some great things in this kid. Could be idealizing him for what I want him to be, though I truly do feel that this debate will be ongoing and it is not killing me yet.

While some may be completely sold on Parker having proved more, Andrew Wiggins does have something to him that can make one see him thriving as a NBA player. For as much as people write him off as only being an athlete, dude can ball, gets and create shots and has gotten better as the season has progressed on both ends of the floor. Parker obviously has killed his last couple games and one can see him being amongst the NBA’s elite scorers, though I am not so sure Andrew Wiggins can’t be up their either. Wiggins has led KU in scoring and he has a lot of ways to get to you. Has been really solid in distriguting where he scores from and ultimately has been a guy who has been a good teammate. I see your apprehension about him, but I think you can understand why I maybe see something different. Plus, while I am not asking you to like him more than Parker, maybe realize that getting this guy is going to make some team really happy and for good reason.

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

You say "right now" and basing it off that is ridiculous. That is why I still go with Wiggins. You know you are my boy Scarecrow, just do not always agree with your take on draft picks and the logic behind it. Hate to do this, but you were a massive proponent of Brandon Knight over Kyrie Irving because "Kyrie had not played/proved enough", among other reasons. "Proving enough" is something you ultimately would love to see, though it does not necessarily make someone a better NBA prospect.

Jabari Parker is the better player right now, which does not necessarily mean that Andrew Wiggins does not potentially become the better NBA player. Parker’s body is obviously much more college ready, think the strength portion is a huge reason for his being a more effective player at this point. His ball skills are more refined and he is a better shooter. However, Wiggins is a much better on ball defender, especially on the perimeter. Wiggins also has athleticism that is incredibly special, enough so to see flashes of things that translate to the NBA.

With Parker, you definitely see things that translate as well. What you don’t know is how well he will defend and what will happen with his body. Conditioning wise, it definitely appears that Parker will have to tighten up his body to reach the potential he possesses. We have seen in the past that Jabari can indeed gain weight pretty easily, much more so than Wiggins. Looks like Wiggins can definitely needs to gain upper body strength, though he appears to have some ability to do so and I do not think you will ever have to worry about him as far as conditioning.

For as effective Parker has been, you have to love that Wiggins is playing huge minutes. He is on a better team where he does not necessarily have to be in kill mode, though has gotten much more aggressive as the year has progressed. He gets to the line quite a bit, his shot has shown progress and he has a nice release. The upside is there and while people worry about his mentality, I think he still has more to learn and has shown an ability to be coached.

Guessing the NBA may actually be a fantastic level of competition and really bring out the best in Wiggins. Call me a homer, though I honestly usually am not biased towards Canadians in the least (think people here can go back and see my thoughts on Anthony Bennett if they want proof, this was before he played in the NBA). I think he and Parker are both great prospects, can understand why some people like Parker more.

Feel the difference is not as large as people feel and that while Parker is "playing out of position" (the guy has been more physically dominant than anyone forever, think the stretch 4 is not necessarily a killer), Wiggins is being challenged even more so with new things. You can think he is overrated or not living up to the hype, to me he has done pretty much what I expected. He has some things to improve on, but I see some great things in this kid. Could be idealizing him for what I want him to be, though I truly do feel that this debate will be ongoing and it is not killing me yet.

While some may be completely sold on Parker having proved more, Andrew Wiggins does have something to him that can make one see him thriving as a NBA player. For as much as people write him off as only being an athlete, dude can ball, gets and create shots and has gotten better as the season has progressed on both ends of the floor. Parker obviously has killed his last couple games and one can see him being amongst the NBA’s elite scorers, though I am not so sure Andrew Wiggins can’t be up their either. Wiggins has led KU in scoring and he has a lot of ways to get to you. Has been really solid in distriguting where he scores from and ultimately has been a guy who has been a good teammate. I see your apprehension about him, but I think you can understand why I maybe see something different. Plus, while I am not asking you to like him more than Parker, maybe realize that getting this guy is going to make some team really happy and for good reason.

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

i dont agree with you.

theres a big difference in their athletcism. including their lateral movement and overall explosiveness to the basketball.

Parker has more dunks since he’s playing the 4/5 for Duke. Wiggins is spending more time on the perimiter and the college game is more tight due to the zone and closer 3 point line. in the NBA,with a more open court, his athleticism will be in full display.

 

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

i dont agree with you.

theres a big difference in their athletcism. including their lateral movement and overall explosiveness to the basketball.

Parker has more dunks since he’s playing the 4/5 for Duke. Wiggins is spending more time on the perimiter and the college game is more tight due to the zone and closer 3 point line. in the NBA,with a more open court, his athleticism will be in full display.

 

[ThepessimestParticipant]

…..is that Wiggins’ athleticism requires room to be evident. He does not appear to explode in tight spaces/crowds. Also; he is more athletic but does not appear to know how to use his athleticism to score. Parker on the other hand is a very good athlete who can improve. He looks more lean but can even become leaner. He understands how to use his body and athleticismm to finish in crowds; which is what basketball is about.

Being able to jump is great…being fast is great…but if it does not translate (i.e.) you cannot use it in a basketball type of way consistently then its really not something to argue over.

Wiggins is a pogo stick and can run effortlessly….but the original poster is correct in that when he attacks the rim he does not finish consistently and at this moment does not use his athleticism to finish over defenders. He appears to flick the ball at the rim and really does not finish well in traffic.

Parker; while being less of an athlete, tries to finish over and through defenders. The positions they play is not important when observing the mindset of when they attack.

When Parker goes to the rim he goes with a mindset to finish and/or create contact. When Wiggins goes to the rim I have not yet seem him dunk on someone or finish through contact.

There cannot be an argument that Parker is close to Wiggins athletically…but there is an argument that Parker knows how to use whatever athleticism he has better than Wiggins knows how to use his.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

[ThepessimestParticipant]

…..is that Wiggins’ athleticism requires room to be evident. He does not appear to explode in tight spaces/crowds. Also; he is more athletic but does not appear to know how to use his athleticism to score. Parker on the other hand is a very good athlete who can improve. He looks more lean but can even become leaner. He understands how to use his body and athleticismm to finish in crowds; which is what basketball is about.

Being able to jump is great…being fast is great…but if it does not translate (i.e.) you cannot use it in a basketball type of way consistently then its really not something to argue over.

Wiggins is a pogo stick and can run effortlessly….but the original poster is correct in that when he attacks the rim he does not finish consistently and at this moment does not use his athleticism to finish over defenders. He appears to flick the ball at the rim and really does not finish well in traffic.

Parker; while being less of an athlete, tries to finish over and through defenders. The positions they play is not important when observing the mindset of when they attack.

When Parker goes to the rim he goes with a mindset to finish and/or create contact. When Wiggins goes to the rim I have not yet seem him dunk on someone or finish through contact.

There cannot be an argument that Parker is close to Wiggins athletically…but there is an argument that Parker knows how to use whatever athleticism he has better than Wiggins knows how to use his.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

 I’m not buying that Parker is staying another year.  When you’re guaranteed millions, it seems a little silly to talk about coming back. I don’t care if Parker is seen as a good kid.  As far as athletically, Wiggins lateral quickness is far superior to Parker.  Parker is a good athlete and much more skilled.than Wiggins.  Wiggins is special athletically.

[TarHeelRavenParticipant]

 I’m not buying that Parker is staying another year.  When you’re guaranteed millions, it seems a little silly to talk about coming back. I don’t care if Parker is seen as a good kid.  As far as athletically, Wiggins lateral quickness is far superior to Parker.  Parker is a good athlete and much more skilled.than Wiggins.  Wiggins is special athletically.

[Ghost01Participant]

 What I don’t understand is this….

Why do people have the idea Wiggins has more potential than Parker? Aren’t they both under 20? Aren’t they both freshmen in college? Why does a player’s style or athletic traits determine "potential".

I get the Embiid talk, because A. He’s over seven feet tall, and B. He hasn’t even scratched the surface in terms of what he is able to do. 

Parker and Wiggins are both basketball players. So Wiggins can jump a bit higher, what does that really matter?

Parker is better, by far, at getting around his man. Whether it be in the post or on the perimeter. That is because Wiggins has a very weak handle and looks uncomfortable dribbling. We know Wiggins is a better defender than Parker, but as I have stated time and time again, I’m not that worried about a 19 year old wing man who isn’t a stud defender yet. It’s great Wiggins can guard. He still won’t have any luck against the LBJs, PGs, and KDs of the world if he doesn’t have a rim protector behind him. 

I just don’t get why we are supposed to ignore the current skills of these players because Wiggins is a better athlete. Has anyone seen Wiggins do ANYTHING this year athletically that was uncommon by NBA standards? Blake Griffin type stuff? Because I sure haven’t. Two handed jams are nice, but its run of the mill in the NBA.

Parker has been a better player than Wiggins. People who favor Wiggins are putting too much weight on expectations and too much weight on what exactly athletic ability brings you. There are very few athletic guys that suddenly  figure out how to be a good at a number of things on the court. And of course, the one who has, Paul George, is the guy everyone instantly compares Wiggins to. Well, Wiggins shot, and off-the-dribble ability have a LONG way to go before that is even vaguely a conversation. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

Jabari Parker has played 8 games against RPI top 50 teams (4 in conference, 4 out of conference). Andrew Wiggins has played 15 games against RPI top 50 teams (8 in conference, 7 out of conference). That could be part of the reason you feel Parker is that much better than Wiggins. Just know that in those 8 games, Parker has shot 36.3% from the field. Wiggins is not much better, at 42.5%, though that is higher and he has played more good teams.

As much as you dislike Wiggins shot, it has not exactly been uneffective. Do you see something wrong with his stroke that makes you believe it cannot improve? A trend that seems to go on with you take the "wait and see" approach. It works for the time being, however their is definitely projection involved here. That is where some see Andrew Wiggins projecting to be better down the line. Paul George was not always Paul George.

To me, Parker and Wiggins both need work. Wiggins needs more work as a player, however he has tools, instincts and ability that lead many to believe he has a tremendous upside. Parker needs work on his body and conditioning at the next level, not to mention perimeter defense and shot selection. For as great as Parker has been, what makes it seem that he will have a flawless transition to the NBA opposed to Wiggins? Will Wiggins not get more space at the next level as well? Because that is why there are more isolation opportunities, because defenders can be drawn out and big men need to worry about a 3 second rule as opposed to parking themselves in the paint in college.

Andrew Wiggins has been really hard to stop in transition and while his handle needs work, it is not at all beyond repair. What makes you say Parker is better at getting around players? You mean around the PF’s he has been guarded by for most of the year? Is that going to happen as much in the NBA, or will he be guarded by perimeter players like Wiggins actually has been for the whole year. I am not one to say Parker will be at a major disadvantage, though I do think this is the reason you claim Parker is better at getting around others, because he has been set up to be by playing "out of position" (when in reality, you and I both know he is a killer college 4 due to his size and ability).

Jabari Parker absolutely has potential as well. The thing with this potential is it goes along with his body and conditioning, which to me is just as much of a gamble as building ones skills. Saying he has done nothing crazy athletically is just showing that you are going out of your way to not like him. Again, this could pay off, however their is a reason people see potential in his combination of athleticism, size and skill set. He does have one and I think he has shown it, though not as consistently as one might hope. Still, when you have the quick twitch ability and instinct that he has shown, one can see major upside. You just do not see athletes at his position with his type of ability to defend and potentially get shots off at will. He is not even close to as bad off the bounce as you hope, though it needs work. What I will say is I don’t think Parker is as much better at this point as you may hope, plus when you factor NBA guys in as well, most of what you say about Wiggins would apply to Parker just the same.

[jwall1Participant]

This post is too overblown for Wiggins. Wiggins is a freak athlete who has a decent shot and is a decent defender, but his offensive game, specificially his iso game, are lackluster. What bothers me more is his inconsistency and his tendecy to drift and seemingly lose interested in lapses during a given game. A guy with Wiggins’ athleticism should be dominating on a consistent basis in college, and he simply has not been. Jabari has his things to work on too, but he has the offensive talent and versatility that Wiggins does not have, just as Wiggins has the athleticism Jabari does not have. Also, although he may need to loose 10 pounds or so, his body and conditioning are not as bad as you portray them to be, and when he gets to the NBA he will have some of the best trainers in the world to slim him down. 

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

I am saying it is at least a major thing he has to work on to reach his potential. Carmelo Anthony is in rather fantastic condition, yet everyone seems to want him to get in slightly better condition to maybe help him that much more. Why can the same not be said for Parker? In the games where he has not played well, or when he had his little ACC slump, was his conditioning not thought to be a factor?

Also, if people remember, when he got hurt during his senior year in HS (where it became popular for everyone other than Parker to be the next best player after Wiggins, yet I still stood pat on him being the next best prospect), he got into pretty damn bad shape. Yes, he has used this as motivation to never get there again, yet he could have a tough time getting his body to its optimal level. Kevin Love is proof that one can do amazing things if they train hard and I will not put that completely past happening for Parker. Still is at least a possible concern.

As far as working with the best trainers in the world, this is where I could see Wiggins getting quite a bit better due to a frame that appears to be able to add muscle. In the mean time, if you are looking at a guy more ready to play long minutes, it looks like Wiggins is there. Plus, just from watching Andrew Wiggins, he has been a great defender already. The potential there is huge, he covers so much of the court and at times looks like an albatross guarding those smaller guards. That is versatility right there.

In the end, you have your opinion, I have mine. They both have work to do and it ultimately comes down more to projecting what they could be as opposed to everything they are right now. That is why drafts do not always turn out to be as clear cut as one might think. Jabari has a tighter handle and a better outside shot right now, just do not think their is as much of a glaring difference as one might think. When it comes down to the NBA, they both possess qualities you want and I think their is a reason it is a debate. You can say I am slighted towards one side, definitely feel the same way with your argument. Both have things that are correctable and will take hard work, guess I just have more faith in Wiggins at this point in time. I may be wrong, though you are taking the same chance.

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

I am saying it is at least a major thing he has to work on to reach his potential. Carmelo Anthony is in rather fantastic condition, yet everyone seems to want him to get in slightly better condition to maybe help him that much more. Why can the same not be said for Parker? In the games where he has not played well, or when he had his little ACC slump, was his conditioning not thought to be a factor?

Also, if people remember, when he got hurt during his senior year in HS (where it became popular for everyone other than Parker to be the next best player after Wiggins, yet I still stood pat on him being the next best prospect), he got into pretty damn bad shape. Yes, he has used this as motivation to never get there again, yet he could have a tough time getting his body to its optimal level. Kevin Love is proof that one can do amazing things if they train hard and I will not put that completely past happening for Parker. Still is at least a possible concern.

As far as working with the best trainers in the world, this is where I could see Wiggins getting quite a bit better due to a frame that appears to be able to add muscle. In the mean time, if you are looking at a guy more ready to play long minutes, it looks like Wiggins is there. Plus, just from watching Andrew Wiggins, he has been a great defender already. The potential there is huge, he covers so much of the court and at times looks like an albatross guarding those smaller guards. That is versatility right there.

In the end, you have your opinion, I have mine. They both have work to do and it ultimately comes down more to projecting what they could be as opposed to everything they are right now. That is why drafts do not always turn out to be as clear cut as one might think. Jabari has a tighter handle and a better outside shot right now, just do not think their is as much of a glaring difference as one might think. When it comes down to the NBA, they both possess qualities you want and I think their is a reason it is a debate. You can say I am slighted towards one side, definitely feel the same way with your argument. Both have things that are correctable and will take hard work, guess I just have more faith in Wiggins at this point in time. I may be wrong, though you are taking the same chance.

[jwall1Participant]

This post is too overblown for Wiggins. Wiggins is a freak athlete who has a decent shot and is a decent defender, but his offensive game, specificially his iso game, are lackluster. What bothers me more is his inconsistency and his tendecy to drift and seemingly lose interested in lapses during a given game. A guy with Wiggins’ athleticism should be dominating on a consistent basis in college, and he simply has not been. Jabari has his things to work on too, but he has the offensive talent and versatility that Wiggins does not have, just as Wiggins has the athleticism Jabari does not have. Also, although he may need to loose 10 pounds or so, his body and conditioning are not as bad as you portray them to be, and when he gets to the NBA he will have some of the best trainers in the world to slim him down. 

[Ghost01Participant]

 

So here is my series of responses to what you said:

1. I don’t care if Wiggins stroke looks good. If the shots aren’t going in, they aren’t going in. The last time I checked, Reggie Miller’s form wasn’t exact textbook and he was one of the best shooters ever. Form = extremely overrated. Most NBA level players have good form.

2. What exactly are these "tpols, instincts, and abilities"? I get instincts actually, he does move well without he ball. As far as tools and abilities, what? Name one tool or ability he has right now that is elite by NBA terms. Not "athleticism".

3. I never ever ever ever ever said Parker will have an easy/simple transition to the NBA. I think his skills are going to transition better than Wiggins. That is all. I think his transition will be easier, not simple/no problem/ he’s an all star day 1 while Wiggins is in the D League. That is not what I said. 

[Ghost01Participant]

 

So here is my series of responses to what you said:

1. I don’t care if Wiggins stroke looks good. If the shots aren’t going in, they aren’t going in. The last time I checked, Reggie Miller’s form wasn’t exact textbook and he was one of the best shooters ever. Form = extremely overrated. Most NBA level players have good form.

2. What exactly are these "tpols, instincts, and abilities"? I get instincts actually, he does move well without he ball. As far as tools and abilities, what? Name one tool or ability he has right now that is elite by NBA terms. Not "athleticism".

3. I never ever ever ever ever said Parker will have an easy/simple transition to the NBA. I think his skills are going to transition better than Wiggins. That is all. I think his transition will be easier, not simple/no problem/ he’s an all star day 1 while Wiggins is in the D League. That is not what I said. 

[Ghost01Participant]

4. Wiggins can have all the isolation opportunities in the world, there is ZERO evidence at the college level he is a good iso player. ZERO.

 

5. Saying that conditioning is as a gamble as developing skill is ludacris. Parker isn’t out of shape, and if he is, well damn he’s been pretty productive. Can he improve his shape? 100% absolutely. But saying that is as big a gamble as developing skills is just wrong.

6. What makes you think Parker won’t play a lot of 4 in the NBA? He has a similiar body as Melo, and would be a tough matchup down there. He also is gaining experience this year guarding bigger guys. 

 

I want everyone to understand. I don’t hate Wiggins. What I hate it people defending him at every turn for anything wrong with his game. There are no perfect prospects in this class, but at least I have an idea in my head of what Parker can do at the next level. Wiggins still has so much developing to do that pointing at his stats and saying "See! He’s good!" is just lazy. 

 

[Ghost01Participant]

4. Wiggins can have all the isolation opportunities in the world, there is ZERO evidence at the college level he is a good iso player. ZERO.

 

5. Saying that conditioning is as a gamble as developing skill is ludacris. Parker isn’t out of shape, and if he is, well damn he’s been pretty productive. Can he improve his shape? 100% absolutely. But saying that is as big a gamble as developing skills is just wrong.

6. What makes you think Parker won’t play a lot of 4 in the NBA? He has a similiar body as Melo, and would be a tough matchup down there. He also is gaining experience this year guarding bigger guys. 

 

I want everyone to understand. I don’t hate Wiggins. What I hate it people defending him at every turn for anything wrong with his game. There are no perfect prospects in this class, but at least I have an idea in my head of what Parker can do at the next level. Wiggins still has so much developing to do that pointing at his stats and saying "See! He’s good!" is just lazy. 

 

[jwall1Participant]

 Completely agree. People on here are so hyped on Wiggins they use his stats as their argument and feel since he is more athletic and is averaging close to what Parker is averaging, he is automatically the better choice with an "unlimited ceiling." I have seen almost every televised Kansas and Duke game. Wiggins has not impressed me. With how dominant he was in highschool, he should have a better iso game and be able to score in a variety of ways. He relies way to much on his athleticism and oftentimes drifts out of games. Parker has had his bad games to, but the skill he has showcased has been absolutely impressive, unlike Wiggins. This defensive talk is B.S., Parker not a bad defender, and Wiggins is not this amazing elite defender he is made out to be on here. 

[jwall1Participant]

 Completely agree. People on here are so hyped on Wiggins they use his stats as their argument and feel since he is more athletic and is averaging close to what Parker is averaging, he is automatically the better choice with an "unlimited ceiling." I have seen almost every televised Kansas and Duke game. Wiggins has not impressed me. With how dominant he was in highschool, he should have a better iso game and be able to score in a variety of ways. He relies way to much on his athleticism and oftentimes drifts out of games. Parker has had his bad games to, but the skill he has showcased has been absolutely impressive, unlike Wiggins. This defensive talk is B.S., Parker not a bad defender, and Wiggins is not this amazing elite defender he is made out to be on here. 

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

4. How is there zero evidence? That is completely subjective in my mind. I think Jabari Parker is a better isolation player, though I think Wiggins has at least shown some ability to go against one-on-one defense. Plus, I do believe he is better than Parker in transition. Again, wish I had Synergy to show the stats and maybe some film on this, though I am guessing you don’t have it either. Can just take your word for it, though I know what I have seen and also that most players do not get more than 30% of their offense from isolation. Plus, does he show no (I know you hate this word) potential as an isolation player? Seriously, just know what I see and I am guessing he gets more of his points from isolation type situations than you think. Am not seeing games where he is spoon fed near the basket and through cuts as much as you are seeing them, I guess.

5. Let me say, I found the "ludacris" thing hilarious. I did not know that Ludacris had changed the spelling of the word "ludicrous". Seriously, I got what you were saying and I do not mean to insult you, just really did get a laugh. Though to my point, ask Anthony Bennett if conditioning is not important. Yeah, he and Jabari are different players, I like Jabari’s skill set a hell of a lot more. Still, see NO similarity in the way Parker gained weight when he was hurt to that of Bennett? Plus, he will be going to the NBA.

I think Parker has a great work ethic and is a great kid, yet do you not think a large part of his living up to his potential is firming up his body? Is that not a gamble that has been dealt with in the draft before? That is what I am saying. Yes, conditioning matters, a lot. Jabari’s not doing to bad, but do you not see a lot of room for improvement? I think it is something that is at least a bit of a gamble, plus an area I see Wiggins having an advantage in. Getting in and staying in great shape can be a struggle and I think it could be more of one for Parker than Wiggins. Not at least some possibility there? You may not think so, though it is something I think about. You claim I discount things for Wiggins, think this is being discounted for Parker. Lord knows he can hit the weights and be a killer. Still think Wiggins can develop his skills and be the same. Both are things you are gambling on and have many cases for/against in the past.

6. He may. Just think that most envision him on the wing and that is where he likely ends up. Certainly has shown some versatility to play either forward spot at times, just do believe he will more than likely be better off covering the perimeter as opposed to likely bigger guys. Still, Wiggins has shown ability to guard the wing quite well. So, both have versatility. Wiggins is gaining experience guarding small, quick guards. He has been as much of a guard as Wayne Selden. So, that is saying something. Has also improved as a passer and playmaker as the year has progressed.

You seem to at least sort of dislike Wiggins. The things you say about him are really black and white, without much evidence. My biggest thing is I think some of what you say has very little basis to back it up and am worried people might take this as fact. Everyone has their own opinion on a player and that is fine. The big thing I see with your analysis on Wiggins is that you seemingly look to find flaws and than pretty much write off whatever he does. This happens more with Wiggins than any other prospect I ever see you bring up.

To me, these arguments are just as lazy as anything people say about Wiggins to counter. It makes it seem like you only watch highlights and a few games, or see some bad things, than write off with the ultimate "can’t shoot, can’t dribble, gets easy baskets". The thing you do with these prospects is project what they can become. Look at some of the best players in the NBA and see what they did as college freshmen. Not all of them were as ready as a Carmelo Anthony or Kevin Durant.

However, I think Andrew Wiggins has shown things that make him look like a player and prospect that could end up being better than Jabari Parker. I have seen players get better, it happens. Sometimes it doesn’t, but it does indeed happen. If you are saying you see none of those tools in Andrew Wiggins, than so be it. It is fine you like Parker more as a prospect, though I do believe that the things you point out in Parker are nothing compared to the things you point out in Wiggins.

What it comes down to is that I believe you are making statements that are meant to be absolute though do not necessarily have statistics or even pass the eye test. Not sure we are watching the same thing and it is why I feel a need to carry on this debate. Things like disregarding statistics or not using them correctly, plus going by eye test rather than giving specific percentages or plays, is what I see as a lazy argument.

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

4. How is there zero evidence? That is completely subjective in my mind. I think Jabari Parker is a better isolation player, though I think Wiggins has at least shown some ability to go against one-on-one defense. Plus, I do believe he is better than Parker in transition. Again, wish I had Synergy to show the stats and maybe some film on this, though I am guessing you don’t have it either. Can just take your word for it, though I know what I have seen and also that most players do not get more than 30% of their offense from isolation. Plus, does he show no (I know you hate this word) potential as an isolation player? Seriously, just know what I see and I am guessing he gets more of his points from isolation type situations than you think. Am not seeing games where he is spoon fed near the basket and through cuts as much as you are seeing them, I guess.

5. Let me say, I found the "ludacris" thing hilarious. I did not know that Ludacris had changed the spelling of the word "ludicrous". Seriously, I got what you were saying and I do not mean to insult you, just really did get a laugh. Though to my point, ask Anthony Bennett if conditioning is not important. Yeah, he and Jabari are different players, I like Jabari’s skill set a hell of a lot more. Still, see NO similarity in the way Parker gained weight when he was hurt to that of Bennett? Plus, he will be going to the NBA.

I think Parker has a great work ethic and is a great kid, yet do you not think a large part of his living up to his potential is firming up his body? Is that not a gamble that has been dealt with in the draft before? That is what I am saying. Yes, conditioning matters, a lot. Jabari’s not doing to bad, but do you not see a lot of room for improvement? I think it is something that is at least a bit of a gamble, plus an area I see Wiggins having an advantage in. Getting in and staying in great shape can be a struggle and I think it could be more of one for Parker than Wiggins. Not at least some possibility there? You may not think so, though it is something I think about. You claim I discount things for Wiggins, think this is being discounted for Parker. Lord knows he can hit the weights and be a killer. Still think Wiggins can develop his skills and be the same. Both are things you are gambling on and have many cases for/against in the past.

6. He may. Just think that most envision him on the wing and that is where he likely ends up. Certainly has shown some versatility to play either forward spot at times, just do believe he will more than likely be better off covering the perimeter as opposed to likely bigger guys. Still, Wiggins has shown ability to guard the wing quite well. So, both have versatility. Wiggins is gaining experience guarding small, quick guards. He has been as much of a guard as Wayne Selden. So, that is saying something. Has also improved as a passer and playmaker as the year has progressed.

You seem to at least sort of dislike Wiggins. The things you say about him are really black and white, without much evidence. My biggest thing is I think some of what you say has very little basis to back it up and am worried people might take this as fact. Everyone has their own opinion on a player and that is fine. The big thing I see with your analysis on Wiggins is that you seemingly look to find flaws and than pretty much write off whatever he does. This happens more with Wiggins than any other prospect I ever see you bring up.

To me, these arguments are just as lazy as anything people say about Wiggins to counter. It makes it seem like you only watch highlights and a few games, or see some bad things, than write off with the ultimate "can’t shoot, can’t dribble, gets easy baskets". The thing you do with these prospects is project what they can become. Look at some of the best players in the NBA and see what they did as college freshmen. Not all of them were as ready as a Carmelo Anthony or Kevin Durant.

However, I think Andrew Wiggins has shown things that make him look like a player and prospect that could end up being better than Jabari Parker. I have seen players get better, it happens. Sometimes it doesn’t, but it does indeed happen. If you are saying you see none of those tools in Andrew Wiggins, than so be it. It is fine you like Parker more as a prospect, though I do believe that the things you point out in Parker are nothing compared to the things you point out in Wiggins.

What it comes down to is that I believe you are making statements that are meant to be absolute though do not necessarily have statistics or even pass the eye test. Not sure we are watching the same thing and it is why I feel a need to carry on this debate. Things like disregarding statistics or not using them correctly, plus going by eye test rather than giving specific percentages or plays, is what I see as a lazy argument.

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

1. Really? You don’t care about shooting form, at all? Like the fact that while Reggie Miller’s form was not traditional, it was super consistent and the ball came off his fingers with a nice guiding structure. OK. Well, let me say, Wiggins shot does not look broken to me. Plus, I do not think he is NEARLY as bad of a shooter as you believe. He has shot well from the FT stripe and I don’t think his shots "aren’t going in" at nearly the rate you seem to think. Want to know something? Jabari Parker AND Andrew Wiggins are 29-79 (36.7%) from 3 for the season as I write this post. Parker is a better jump shooter, yet I have seen major improvement from Wiggins here. You say his shot is broken or not good, I don’t necessarily agree. The statistics don’t necessarily kill Wiggins in this one and I think that counts for something.

2. I don’t know what "tpols" are or what they are supposed to represent. As far as instincts, I think Wiggins has a good idea of where to be on the court and how to react to certain situations. This is a reason I believe he has separated himself from being "just another athlete". The guy has played well against good competition for a while and though he has not been consistent in college, he shows flashes of what he can bring once he really puts it together. Some people say it is mentality, I think it is confidence and coaching. Either way, think that we have seen improvement here from Day 1 of the season until now.

With abilities, I think he has impressive lateral quickness. He can indeed put the ball on the floor and while he has struggled in tight spaces, in open space he is very difficult to contain. His spin move is incredibly quick and while people are realizing how to defend it in a double team, against individual defense it is tricky. Also see potential as a shooter and think his perimeter defense has been very impressive. It is not perfect and he still needs to improve his off ball awareness, just see a lot more defensive ability than a typical 18 year old. You can shrug it off and say it is an overrated quality, or stick with him being unable to ISO, dribble or shoot. I am not going that far at all and see potential there based on what I have seen watching him play quite a bit.

3. I guess "flawless" was not the right word to use. Nonetheless, I am not sure his skills transition to the NBA that much more than Wiggins when you talk about a game being played faster. Speed can kill in the NBA and Wiggins has incredible speed for his size. Not that Jabari does not have skill that will translate well and maybe have a body that will have him more prepared physically. Just that I see things in Wiggins that I believe will help him transition and not be as far behind Jabari as you seem to think. You discount them as being skills and see "no evidence of Wiggins being an ISO player", though I will say the NBA is more spread out and that can really help when you have his type of athleticism. Again, to you it is nothing special and he does nothing special, just do not really agree. Doubt I am changing your mind, you really haven’t changed mine either with your "evidence" to the contrary.

 

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

1. Really? You don’t care about shooting form, at all? Like the fact that while Reggie Miller’s form was not traditional, it was super consistent and the ball came off his fingers with a nice guiding structure. OK. Well, let me say, Wiggins shot does not look broken to me. Plus, I do not think he is NEARLY as bad of a shooter as you believe. He has shot well from the FT stripe and I don’t think his shots "aren’t going in" at nearly the rate you seem to think. Want to know something? Jabari Parker AND Andrew Wiggins are 29-79 (36.7%) from 3 for the season as I write this post. Parker is a better jump shooter, yet I have seen major improvement from Wiggins here. You say his shot is broken or not good, I don’t necessarily agree. The statistics don’t necessarily kill Wiggins in this one and I think that counts for something.

2. I don’t know what "tpols" are or what they are supposed to represent. As far as instincts, I think Wiggins has a good idea of where to be on the court and how to react to certain situations. This is a reason I believe he has separated himself from being "just another athlete". The guy has played well against good competition for a while and though he has not been consistent in college, he shows flashes of what he can bring once he really puts it together. Some people say it is mentality, I think it is confidence and coaching. Either way, think that we have seen improvement here from Day 1 of the season until now.

With abilities, I think he has impressive lateral quickness. He can indeed put the ball on the floor and while he has struggled in tight spaces, in open space he is very difficult to contain. His spin move is incredibly quick and while people are realizing how to defend it in a double team, against individual defense it is tricky. Also see potential as a shooter and think his perimeter defense has been very impressive. It is not perfect and he still needs to improve his off ball awareness, just see a lot more defensive ability than a typical 18 year old. You can shrug it off and say it is an overrated quality, or stick with him being unable to ISO, dribble or shoot. I am not going that far at all and see potential there based on what I have seen watching him play quite a bit.

3. I guess "flawless" was not the right word to use. Nonetheless, I am not sure his skills transition to the NBA that much more than Wiggins when you talk about a game being played faster. Speed can kill in the NBA and Wiggins has incredible speed for his size. Not that Jabari does not have skill that will translate well and maybe have a body that will have him more prepared physically. Just that I see things in Wiggins that I believe will help him transition and not be as far behind Jabari as you seem to think. You discount them as being skills and see "no evidence of Wiggins being an ISO player", though I will say the NBA is more spread out and that can really help when you have his type of athleticism. Again, to you it is nothing special and he does nothing special, just do not really agree. Doubt I am changing your mind, you really haven’t changed mine either with your "evidence" to the contrary.

 

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

Jabari Parker has played 8 games against RPI top 50 teams (4 in conference, 4 out of conference). Andrew Wiggins has played 15 games against RPI top 50 teams (8 in conference, 7 out of conference). That could be part of the reason you feel Parker is that much better than Wiggins. Just know that in those 8 games, Parker has shot 36.3% from the field. Wiggins is not much better, at 42.5%, though that is higher and he has played more good teams.

As much as you dislike Wiggins shot, it has not exactly been uneffective. Do you see something wrong with his stroke that makes you believe it cannot improve? A trend that seems to go on with you take the "wait and see" approach. It works for the time being, however their is definitely projection involved here. That is where some see Andrew Wiggins projecting to be better down the line. Paul George was not always Paul George.

To me, Parker and Wiggins both need work. Wiggins needs more work as a player, however he has tools, instincts and ability that lead many to believe he has a tremendous upside. Parker needs work on his body and conditioning at the next level, not to mention perimeter defense and shot selection. For as great as Parker has been, what makes it seem that he will have a flawless transition to the NBA opposed to Wiggins? Will Wiggins not get more space at the next level as well? Because that is why there are more isolation opportunities, because defenders can be drawn out and big men need to worry about a 3 second rule as opposed to parking themselves in the paint in college.

Andrew Wiggins has been really hard to stop in transition and while his handle needs work, it is not at all beyond repair. What makes you say Parker is better at getting around players? You mean around the PF’s he has been guarded by for most of the year? Is that going to happen as much in the NBA, or will he be guarded by perimeter players like Wiggins actually has been for the whole year. I am not one to say Parker will be at a major disadvantage, though I do think this is the reason you claim Parker is better at getting around others, because he has been set up to be by playing "out of position" (when in reality, you and I both know he is a killer college 4 due to his size and ability).

Jabari Parker absolutely has potential as well. The thing with this potential is it goes along with his body and conditioning, which to me is just as much of a gamble as building ones skills. Saying he has done nothing crazy athletically is just showing that you are going out of your way to not like him. Again, this could pay off, however their is a reason people see potential in his combination of athleticism, size and skill set. He does have one and I think he has shown it, though not as consistently as one might hope. Still, when you have the quick twitch ability and instinct that he has shown, one can see major upside. You just do not see athletes at his position with his type of ability to defend and potentially get shots off at will. He is not even close to as bad off the bounce as you hope, though it needs work. What I will say is I don’t think Parker is as much better at this point as you may hope, plus when you factor NBA guys in as well, most of what you say about Wiggins would apply to Parker just the same.

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

jus LOL.

first off, Wiggins has more potential due to being more athletic and averaging 15.9ppg,6rpg and shooting 44% from the field without a polsihed offensive game. he’s getting that due to his raw abilites. imagine when he improves/develops a jumper, post moves,creating off the dribble,and his handles???

Wiggins,jus like Embiid, isnt even scracting the surface in terms of what he can do.

Parker is somwhat close to his ceiling already. 

Wiggins two way upside is way higher than Parker,who’s not and wont be as good of a defender as Wiggins. Wiggins has the tools to be an elite wing defender.
 

[jwall1Participant]

This ceiling talk is ridiculous. Nobody knows how high any given players ceiling is, because so much of it has to do with their mentality and work ethic. Wiggins gets the majority of his baskets on uncontested shots, and he will not be getting nearly that amount in the NBA. Wiggins simply does not have the scoring talent of Jabari Parker, just as a guy like Lebron does not have as much scoring talent as Melo. Not trying to make any comparisons, but just as Wiggins has unteachable athleticsm, Parker has an unteachable natural offensive talent.

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

 obviously nobody knows whether a player hits his ceiling or not since alot of factors go in it. but ceiling talk is not ridiculous ,especially in a draft. 

Wiggins potential is heightened due to his two way play. he’s already a better defender than Parker right now and with improvement he can become an elite wing defender. thats somthing Parker will not be.theres more to the game than jus offense. 

Also, i find it ironic you bring up lebron and melo offensive game when Lebron actually has a higher ppg total than Melo lol.Lebron career ppg 27.1. Melo career ppg.25.2. not to mention lebron has a better around game than Melo, which is the reason people say he’s better than him.

Wiggins averaging basically 16 ppg. right now shows he can get his buckets,2 less ppg than the "unteachable  natural offensive talent" Parker.which is not such a big difference.

 

[Ghost01Participant]

 Looking at PPG numbers is foolish.

Look at the way Wiggins gets most of his buckets. Uncontested dunks and basket cuts…

No one is talking about LBJ or Melo. If that was supposed to be some kind of reference to how Parker is like Melo and Wiggins is like LBJ, please for the love of god stop having a computer. 

Explain to me this great "elite wing defender" thing. First of all name one NBA player he’s guarded this year other than Rod Hood? Secondly, show me one elite wing defender that can stop the best of the best 1 v 1. There isn’t one. 

 

 

 

 

[Ghost01Participant]

 Looking at PPG numbers is foolish.

Look at the way Wiggins gets most of his buckets. Uncontested dunks and basket cuts…

No one is talking about LBJ or Melo. If that was supposed to be some kind of reference to how Parker is like Melo and Wiggins is like LBJ, please for the love of god stop having a computer. 

Explain to me this great "elite wing defender" thing. First of all name one NBA player he’s guarded this year other than Rod Hood? Secondly, show me one elite wing defender that can stop the best of the best 1 v 1. There isn’t one. 

 

 

 

 

[HaleParticipant]

When are you going to drop your agenda with Wiggins? It gets more and more ridiculous (along with being completely false) every time you say Wiggins basically only gets open layups. You don’t have to call him an offensive arsenal but he’s shooting 37% from deep, getting the line at a good pace (77% there too) and can/has hit plenty of midrange jumpers. If you think Parker is better that’s fine, but enough with the blatant discrediting of anything Wiggins does well to fit your agenda, it’s annoying and borderline trolling.

[HaleParticipant]

When are you going to drop your agenda with Wiggins? It gets more and more ridiculous (along with being completely false) every time you say Wiggins basically only gets open layups. You don’t have to call him an offensive arsenal but he’s shooting 37% from deep, getting the line at a good pace (77% there too) and can/has hit plenty of midrange jumpers. If you think Parker is better that’s fine, but enough with the blatant discrediting of anything Wiggins does well to fit your agenda, it’s annoying and borderline trolling.

[Ghost01Participant]

 I’m not trolling at all, and I have no agenda. Almost every post I have made discussing Wiggins/Parker has been in respone of someone else starting a thread "Wiggins vs Parker" and followed with someone clamoring to Wiggins and defending his deficiencies. I don’t start topics about it, and I did my own assessment of the lottery and had him at No.3 only one spot behind Parker at No.2. I am only responding to the constant excuses that are made for everything Wiggins does and why it is still better than Parker, even if anything from statistics to eye test to skill have shown Parker has been better.

I never have said Wiggins gets all of his shots on layups. He isn’t productive in half court offense. Yes, he absolutely scores baskets in the half court. But he doesn’t do it well. And that is my point. You can look at his shooting percentages but I would wonder what his shooting percentage is in non-fast break situations. You make a correct point that Wiggins does do an outstanding job getting to the line, which is a skill I admit I have underrated. 

Every defense of Wiggins play is that:

"He will get better because he has upside because he’s athletic. He is a great perimeter defender and Parker is not. He hit a step back jumper against Duke to seal the game. That was clutch. His handles, shooting, and everything else will improve, but Parker who is a few months older than him is almost done improving."

And that argument is so lazy, so innacurate, and foolish, and that is basically all I see get said.

How does it make any sense that Parker isn’t going to continue to improve? Athletic abilities give Wiggins an edge on defense, and give him and edge going up against NBA speed. But they don’t mean he will improve shooting, fundamentals, rebounding, passing, basketball IQ, or anything else better than Parker will. 

This is going to be an awesome discussion for years to come to see who’s better. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ghost01Participant]

 I’m not trolling at all, and I have no agenda. Almost every post I have made discussing Wiggins/Parker has been in respone of someone else starting a thread "Wiggins vs Parker" and followed with someone clamoring to Wiggins and defending his deficiencies. I don’t start topics about it, and I did my own assessment of the lottery and had him at No.3 only one spot behind Parker at No.2. I am only responding to the constant excuses that are made for everything Wiggins does and why it is still better than Parker, even if anything from statistics to eye test to skill have shown Parker has been better.

I never have said Wiggins gets all of his shots on layups. He isn’t productive in half court offense. Yes, he absolutely scores baskets in the half court. But he doesn’t do it well. And that is my point. You can look at his shooting percentages but I would wonder what his shooting percentage is in non-fast break situations. You make a correct point that Wiggins does do an outstanding job getting to the line, which is a skill I admit I have underrated. 

Every defense of Wiggins play is that:

"He will get better because he has upside because he’s athletic. He is a great perimeter defender and Parker is not. He hit a step back jumper against Duke to seal the game. That was clutch. His handles, shooting, and everything else will improve, but Parker who is a few months older than him is almost done improving."

And that argument is so lazy, so innacurate, and foolish, and that is basically all I see get said.

How does it make any sense that Parker isn’t going to continue to improve? Athletic abilities give Wiggins an edge on defense, and give him and edge going up against NBA speed. But they don’t mean he will improve shooting, fundamentals, rebounding, passing, basketball IQ, or anything else better than Parker will. 

This is going to be an awesome discussion for years to come to see who’s better. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[HaleParticipant]

I’m not criticizing your entire argument. I’m saying the "he only gets uncontested shots at the rim" line you constantly use is annoying and misinformed and you have said that A LOT. Outside of that I don’t care what you say about the dude. He does need work in the half-court, but he also shows on a nightly basis he doesn’t just score off unconstested shots at the rim. 

[HaleParticipant]

I’m not criticizing your entire argument. I’m saying the "he only gets uncontested shots at the rim" line you constantly use is annoying and misinformed and you have said that A LOT. Outside of that I don’t care what you say about the dude. He does need work in the half-court, but he also shows on a nightly basis he doesn’t just score off unconstested shots at the rim. 

[jwall1Participant]

 The only thing I am comparing Lebron with Melo is scoring ability. Melo is a better scorer and can score in more ways than Lebron, the ppg does not mean anything. Lebron for the most part uses his body and athleticism to score, while Melo uses his versatility and skill. Ofcourse Lebron does everything else better than Melo, but he is not a better scorer. The 2 ppg difference between Parker and Wiggins means nothing, Parker is without a doubt a better scorer and anyone can see that based on watching him play. 

[jwall1Participant]

 The only thing I am comparing Lebron with Melo is scoring ability. Melo is a better scorer and can score in more ways than Lebron, the ppg does not mean anything. Lebron for the most part uses his body and athleticism to score, while Melo uses his versatility and skill. Ofcourse Lebron does everything else better than Melo, but he is not a better scorer. The 2 ppg difference between Parker and Wiggins means nothing, Parker is without a doubt a better scorer and anyone can see that based on watching him play. 

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

 obviously nobody knows whether a player hits his ceiling or not since alot of factors go in it. but ceiling talk is not ridiculous ,especially in a draft. 

Wiggins potential is heightened due to his two way play. he’s already a better defender than Parker right now and with improvement he can become an elite wing defender. thats somthing Parker will not be.theres more to the game than jus offense. 

Also, i find it ironic you bring up lebron and melo offensive game when Lebron actually has a higher ppg total than Melo lol.Lebron career ppg 27.1. Melo career ppg.25.2. not to mention lebron has a better around game than Melo, which is the reason people say he’s better than him.

Wiggins averaging basically 16 ppg. right now shows he can get his buckets,2 less ppg than the "unteachable  natural offensive talent" Parker.which is not such a big difference.

 

[surveParticipant]

 when I say ceiling, all I am saying is, I think Wiggins will be a much better pro than he is a college player.  Parker is going to be good, but how much better will he be in the league than he is now?  He is going to struggle defensively and some on offense too, especially on the perimeter.  this is not to knock Parker but you just proved it yourself when you said Lebron doesnt have as much scoring talent as Melo.  

rotflmao….yet, Lebron avg 27, 7, and 7 for his career and Melo avg 25, 6, and 3 for his.  And we know who is the better player.

please dont think I am saying Wiggins is the next Lebron.  what I am saying is, you contradicted yourself.  if you give Parker the edge in the pros over Wiggins and cant see why some people value Wiggins over Parker then why did you just make that Lebron/Melo comparison???

 

 

[surveParticipant]

 when I say ceiling, all I am saying is, I think Wiggins will be a much better pro than he is a college player.  Parker is going to be good, but how much better will he be in the league than he is now?  He is going to struggle defensively and some on offense too, especially on the perimeter.  this is not to knock Parker but you just proved it yourself when you said Lebron doesnt have as much scoring talent as Melo.  

rotflmao….yet, Lebron avg 27, 7, and 7 for his career and Melo avg 25, 6, and 3 for his.  And we know who is the better player.

please dont think I am saying Wiggins is the next Lebron.  what I am saying is, you contradicted yourself.  if you give Parker the edge in the pros over Wiggins and cant see why some people value Wiggins over Parker then why did you just make that Lebron/Melo comparison???

 

 

[jwall1Participant]

This ceiling talk is ridiculous. Nobody knows how high any given players ceiling is, because so much of it has to do with their mentality and work ethic. Wiggins gets the majority of his baskets on uncontested shots, and he will not be getting nearly that amount in the NBA. Wiggins simply does not have the scoring talent of Jabari Parker, just as a guy like Lebron does not have as much scoring talent as Melo. Not trying to make any comparisons, but just as Wiggins has unteachable athleticsm, Parker has an unteachable natural offensive talent.

[Ghost01Participant]

 "jus LOL"

Seriously? You are LOLing at me and respond with this mostly incoherent nonsense?

Parker has almost reached his ceiling? How do you figure that? Is he actually 27 years old?

"imagine when he improves/develops a jumper, post moves,creating off the dribble,and his handles???"

Well imagine if Parker improves all of those things, most of which he’s already good at, then what?

Of course players can improve, but non of those things you just named are things Wiggins has any better chance of improving than Parker. 

The difference between Wiggins and Embiid is Wiggins has been playing basketball just as long as Parker. Why hasn’t he scratched the surface yet? And Embiid is over 7 feet tall. Just stop. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ghost01Participant]

 "jus LOL"

Seriously? You are LOLing at me and respond with this mostly incoherent nonsense?

Parker has almost reached his ceiling? How do you figure that? Is he actually 27 years old?

"imagine when he improves/develops a jumper, post moves,creating off the dribble,and his handles???"

Well imagine if Parker improves all of those things, most of which he’s already good at, then what?

Of course players can improve, but non of those things you just named are things Wiggins has any better chance of improving than Parker. 

The difference between Wiggins and Embiid is Wiggins has been playing basketball just as long as Parker. Why hasn’t he scratched the surface yet? And Embiid is over 7 feet tall. Just stop. 

 

 

 

 

 

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

jus LOL.

first off, Wiggins has more potential due to being more athletic and averaging 15.9ppg,6rpg and shooting 44% from the field without a polsihed offensive game. he’s getting that due to his raw abilites. imagine when he improves/develops a jumper, post moves,creating off the dribble,and his handles???

Wiggins,jus like Embiid, isnt even scracting the surface in terms of what he can do.

Parker is somwhat close to his ceiling already. 

Wiggins two way upside is way higher than Parker,who’s not and wont be as good of a defender as Wiggins. Wiggins has the tools to be an elite wing defender.
 

[jwall1Participant]

Solid post. The Wiggins and George comparisons are a little ridiculous.. Expecting Wiggins to come into the league raw and develop like Paul George in his 3rd season is unrealistic. Wiggins is a player that should be dominating more in college considering his elite athleticism. When he reaches the NBA, he will not be able to rely on his atleticism to become a dominant offensive player. Wiggins does not have the offensive talent Parker posesses, and he will have to work alot harder to develop his overall game. I would personally take Parker considering his overall versatility and skillset he posesses now. He is simply in my opinion too talented to pass up on for Wiggins. 

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

 im not comparing him to PG, and i think the people who are they’re giving an example of a player who came in with a similar skillset and developed into a real good two way player.people also use PG cus its the most recent example.players Like Kobe and Tmac came in the league with great athleticism and potential,started off slow and than developed into HOF players.

Wiggins is having a real good year. the hype he had coming into the year set him up to dissapoint.but he’s having a really good year.

Parker has his flaws as well,like having trouble to beat athletic wings off the dribble,his defense,especially on the perimeter,and is he a true SF? he’s been playing the 4 most of the year,which he’s been taking advantage of. he might have some tweener in him.his laterall movement doesnt suggest he can defend SFs in the NBA. he sure wont be scoring over NBA 4s on a regular bases like he is now in college.

Wggins is still the better Pro prospect imo.

[jwall1Participant]

 And thats fine, no problem that you disagree. They are both great prospects. I still think Parkers defense is underrated, he is not a bad defender, just not a great one. He may never become a dominant defensive player, but look at Melo, Pierce, Harden, Kevin Durant (he is not an elite defender), and etc. Defense is great, but being an elite defender is not necessarily a prerequisite for a superstar player. I think Parker will have a smoother transition into the NBA than Wiggins because he can flat out score the basketball. Wiggins will have to adjust more and develop a better iso game to become a decent scorer in the NBA. Who will be the better prospect, noone knows, but it should be interesting to see how they develop over the years. 

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

i see some tweener in Parker, i dont see it as smooth as you see it. Today he scored 29 points,all in the paint. he basically is playing PF in college. the rough patch he had during the season, he was staying on the perimter more and had trouble beating defenders off the dribble causing his FG% to plummet. 
 

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

i see some tweener in Parker, i dont see it as smooth as you see it. Today he scored 29 points,all in the paint. he basically is playing PF in college. the rough patch he had during the season, he was staying on the perimter more and had trouble beating defenders off the dribble causing his FG% to plummet. 
 

[jwall1Participant]

 And thats fine, no problem that you disagree. They are both great prospects. I still think Parkers defense is underrated, he is not a bad defender, just not a great one. He may never become a dominant defensive player, but look at Melo, Pierce, Harden, Kevin Durant (he is not an elite defender), and etc. Defense is great, but being an elite defender is not necessarily a prerequisite for a superstar player. I think Parker will have a smoother transition into the NBA than Wiggins because he can flat out score the basketball. Wiggins will have to adjust more and develop a better iso game to become a decent scorer in the NBA. Who will be the better prospect, noone knows, but it should be interesting to see how they develop over the years. 

[imAboutDatActionParticipant]

 im not comparing him to PG, and i think the people who are they’re giving an example of a player who came in with a similar skillset and developed into a real good two way player.people also use PG cus its the most recent example.players Like Kobe and Tmac came in the league with great athleticism and potential,started off slow and than developed into HOF players.

Wiggins is having a real good year. the hype he had coming into the year set him up to dissapoint.but he’s having a really good year.

Parker has his flaws as well,like having trouble to beat athletic wings off the dribble,his defense,especially on the perimeter,and is he a true SF? he’s been playing the 4 most of the year,which he’s been taking advantage of. he might have some tweener in him.his laterall movement doesnt suggest he can defend SFs in the NBA. he sure wont be scoring over NBA 4s on a regular bases like he is now in college.

Wggins is still the better Pro prospect imo.

[surveParticipant]

 I disagree that players, should dominate in college due to elite athleticism, especially Wiggins on a stacked team.  what does he average?  like 16ppg and 6rpg?  Fraschilla said something interesting.  he said Wiggins reminded him of Derozen.  Well, Derozen’s avgs at USC were lower than Wiggins and he was on a worse team.   The only pro player on Derozen’s team was Gibson.  

I just dont see how people use college as end all be all in terms of rating prospects when the pro game is a totally different game.  Parker is and always will be the better college player, if they played 4 years each.  Going into the league Parker will be the better player off bat.  To me though, Parker is about as close to his ceiling as he is gonna get.  I see a lot of the Pierce/Melo comparisons.  Parker is an alpha dog scorer but like Melo, I doubt he will ever be the best player or 1st option on a contender/champion.  Wiggins however, doesnt need to be.  I expect him to reach Derozen potential and probably surpass it, which is saying a lot.

I dont really get into the athleticism comparisons much as far as Parker/Wiggins.  Its easy to see who is the best, that shouldnt be up for debate.  One thing though….I am not sure if Parker can ever be a much better defender than Pierce or Melo.  Wiggins looks on his way to being a great defender…and his athleticism is a huge part of that.

 

 

[Ghost01Participant]

Explain to me how Parker is close to his ceiling. PLEASE DO. He is 19 years old. How is he close to his ceiling? Because he isn’t going to be a "great perimeter defender" like Wiggins? Is that really it? That’s the difference between having potential and not having potential. 

[Ghost01Participant]

Explain to me how Parker is close to his ceiling. PLEASE DO. He is 19 years old. How is he close to his ceiling? Because he isn’t going to be a "great perimeter defender" like Wiggins? Is that really it? That’s the difference between having potential and not having potential. 

[surveParticipant]

 he is close to (or closer to) his ceiling because his handle and his shot are about as good as they are going to get, likewise with offensive moves.  his awareness will improve, offensively and defensively, he will get stronger, etc.  still, Parker is as much of a close to finished product as anyone in the college game right now.  he is better than Grant Hill was as the same stage at Duke.  typically the higher your floor is the lower your ceiling.

[surveParticipant]

 he is close to (or closer to) his ceiling because his handle and his shot are about as good as they are going to get, likewise with offensive moves.  his awareness will improve, offensively and defensively, he will get stronger, etc.  still, Parker is as much of a close to finished product as anyone in the college game right now.  he is better than Grant Hill was as the same stage at Duke.  typically the higher your floor is the lower your ceiling.

[King CaluchaParticipant]

 Of course, because you enter the "edit player" option and check his potential rating, right? I thought so, too.

[King CaluchaParticipant]

 Of course, because you enter the "edit player" option and check his potential rating, right? I thought so, too.

[jwall1Participant]

 Yea, I was just reading the beginning of your post and stopped when you said how Parker is "as close to his ceiling as hes going to get." Are you kidding? lol

[jwall1Participant]

 Yea, I was just reading the beginning of your post and stopped when you said how Parker is "as close to his ceiling as hes going to get." Are you kidding? lol

[surveParticipant]

 I disagree that players, should dominate in college due to elite athleticism, especially Wiggins on a stacked team.  what does he average?  like 16ppg and 6rpg?  Fraschilla said something interesting.  he said Wiggins reminded him of Derozen.  Well, Derozen’s avgs at USC were lower than Wiggins and he was on a worse team.   The only pro player on Derozen’s team was Gibson.  

I just dont see how people use college as end all be all in terms of rating prospects when the pro game is a totally different game.  Parker is and always will be the better college player, if they played 4 years each.  Going into the league Parker will be the better player off bat.  To me though, Parker is about as close to his ceiling as he is gonna get.  I see a lot of the Pierce/Melo comparisons.  Parker is an alpha dog scorer but like Melo, I doubt he will ever be the best player or 1st option on a contender/champion.  Wiggins however, doesnt need to be.  I expect him to reach Derozen potential and probably surpass it, which is saying a lot.

I dont really get into the athleticism comparisons much as far as Parker/Wiggins.  Its easy to see who is the best, that shouldnt be up for debate.  One thing though….I am not sure if Parker can ever be a much better defender than Pierce or Melo.  Wiggins looks on his way to being a great defender…and his athleticism is a huge part of that.

 

 

[jwall1Participant]

Solid post. The Wiggins and George comparisons are a little ridiculous.. Expecting Wiggins to come into the league raw and develop like Paul George in his 3rd season is unrealistic. Wiggins is a player that should be dominating more in college considering his elite athleticism. When he reaches the NBA, he will not be able to rely on his atleticism to become a dominant offensive player. Wiggins does not have the offensive talent Parker posesses, and he will have to work alot harder to develop his overall game. I would personally take Parker considering his overall versatility and skillset he posesses now. He is simply in my opinion too talented to pass up on for Wiggins. 

[Ghost01Participant]

 What I don’t understand is this….

Why do people have the idea Wiggins has more potential than Parker? Aren’t they both under 20? Aren’t they both freshmen in college? Why does a player’s style or athletic traits determine "potential".

I get the Embiid talk, because A. He’s over seven feet tall, and B. He hasn’t even scratched the surface in terms of what he is able to do. 

Parker and Wiggins are both basketball players. So Wiggins can jump a bit higher, what does that really matter?

Parker is better, by far, at getting around his man. Whether it be in the post or on the perimeter. That is because Wiggins has a very weak handle and looks uncomfortable dribbling. We know Wiggins is a better defender than Parker, but as I have stated time and time again, I’m not that worried about a 19 year old wing man who isn’t a stud defender yet. It’s great Wiggins can guard. He still won’t have any luck against the LBJs, PGs, and KDs of the world if he doesn’t have a rim protector behind him. 

I just don’t get why we are supposed to ignore the current skills of these players because Wiggins is a better athlete. Has anyone seen Wiggins do ANYTHING this year athletically that was uncommon by NBA standards? Blake Griffin type stuff? Because I sure haven’t. Two handed jams are nice, but its run of the mill in the NBA.

Parker has been a better player than Wiggins. People who favor Wiggins are putting too much weight on expectations and too much weight on what exactly athletic ability brings you. There are very few athletic guys that suddenly  figure out how to be a good at a number of things on the court. And of course, the one who has, Paul George, is the guy everyone instantly compares Wiggins to. Well, Wiggins shot, and off-the-dribble ability have a LONG way to go before that is even vaguely a conversation. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Big_C_KUParticipant]

Wiggins is more athletic but Parker has better coordination and timing. Wiggins can jump higher and he’s faster than Parker but he doesn’t have as good of change of direction as Parker. Wiggins also has an issue with timing. He doesn’t seem to understand when it is the appropriate time to pick the ball up off the floor or when to begin his jump when attacking the basket. This is why it has looked awkward with him at times when going in for a layup. Instead of exploding to the basket with his leaping ability he’s trying to stretch over the defender to score or even make an open shot period at the basket because he’s left his feet too early. The timing issue along with trying to avoid contact on drives much of the year is a big reason why Wiggins hasn’t appeared as athletic. 

[Big_C_KUParticipant]

Wiggins is more athletic but Parker has better coordination and timing. Wiggins can jump higher and he’s faster than Parker but he doesn’t have as good of change of direction as Parker. Wiggins also has an issue with timing. He doesn’t seem to understand when it is the appropriate time to pick the ball up off the floor or when to begin his jump when attacking the basket. This is why it has looked awkward with him at times when going in for a layup. Instead of exploding to the basket with his leaping ability he’s trying to stretch over the defender to score or even make an open shot period at the basket because he’s left his feet too early. The timing issue along with trying to avoid contact on drives much of the year is a big reason why Wiggins hasn’t appeared as athletic. 

[lalailaParticipant]

as far as athleticism they can’t be mentioned in the same sentence..

Wiggins spin move, step back can become unguardable..

it’s only his mentality, Jabari looks to destroy the rim. If Wiggins would have that agressiveness he would be dunkig like T-Mac or Kobe in their young days..

I like what was said yesterday after Wiggins got fouled at the rimt on the fastbreak, he has his eyes down he didn’t even tried to dunk or finish it, seems like he only waited in the air for that contact to be fouled..

 

[Big_C_KUParticipant]

 Yeah I noticed that. He got his eyes on the rim by the time he released the shot but going up his eyes were definitely on the defender seeing where the contact is going to come from. 

[Big_C_KUParticipant]

 Yeah I noticed that. He got his eyes on the rim by the time he released the shot but going up his eyes were definitely on the defender seeing where the contact is going to come from. 

[lalailaParticipant]

as far as athleticism they can’t be mentioned in the same sentence..

Wiggins spin move, step back can become unguardable..

it’s only his mentality, Jabari looks to destroy the rim. If Wiggins would have that agressiveness he would be dunkig like T-Mac or Kobe in their young days..

I like what was said yesterday after Wiggins got fouled at the rimt on the fastbreak, he has his eyes down he didn’t even tried to dunk or finish it, seems like he only waited in the air for that contact to be fouled..

 

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 Jerami Grant is easily a better in game athlete than either.

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 Jerami Grant is easily a better in game athlete than either.

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 How do I get negs for the Jerami Grant comment? I want those begging to explain themselves…he easily leads the country in ridiculous put back dunks and athletic plays…somebody please tell me why I’m wrong other than that this site tells them that I am…so many sheep on here

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 How do I get negs for the Jerami Grant comment? I want those begging to explain themselves…he easily leads the country in ridiculous put back dunks and athletic plays…somebody please tell me why I’m wrong other than that this site tells them that I am…so many sheep on here

[TheLastWordParticipant]

Grant has grown to about 6’9" in shoes while Parker and Wiggins are closer to 6’8". Grant also has a freak wingspan advantage over them. It was last measured at 7’2.5" but probably closer to 7’4" now which dwarfs them both. He is a good athlete, but not a freak like Wiggins.

[TheLastWordParticipant]

Grant has grown to about 6’9" in shoes while Parker and Wiggins are closer to 6’8". Grant also has a freak wingspan advantage over them. It was last measured at 7’2.5" but probably closer to 7’4" now which dwarfs them both. He is a good athlete, but not a freak like Wiggins.

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 Probably the same people who used to call me an idiot for saying MKG would suck in the NBA on my other account. Not wrong about Grant. Deuces.

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 Probably the same people who used to call me an idiot for saying MKG would suck in the NBA on my other account. Not wrong about Grant. Deuces.

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 Anyone who negged my initial Grant comment either 1) hates Syracuse 2) doesn’t watch Syracuse or 3)  just regurgitates what they read somewhere. It’s honestly not even a debate. Nobody in country has half the highlight dunks that he has. Like literally you can ask sportscenter

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 Anyone who negged my initial Grant comment either 1) hates Syracuse 2) doesn’t watch Syracuse or 3)  just regurgitates what they read somewhere. It’s honestly not even a debate. Nobody in country has half the highlight dunks that he has. Like literally you can ask sportscenter

[flopdownD]

 I, with Mickey and surve on this one. Everything that I can say I have it.

jabari has less skills to improve, because he is already skilled. That shouldn’t affect his "ceiling" but his room for improvement. 

I like Wiggins but it is close, as I watch ny vs okc all I can think is Jabari would operate like Carmelo while wiggins WOULD OPERATE LIKE Kevin Durant with less three pointers.

DO NOT TWIST MY WORDS!!!!!!!!!!!

i like a Durant type of player.

[flopdownD]

 I, with Mickey and surve on this one. Everything that I can say I have it.

jabari has less skills to improve, because he is already skilled. That shouldn’t affect his "ceiling" but his room for improvement. 

I like Wiggins but it is close, as I watch ny vs okc all I can think is Jabari would operate like Carmelo while wiggins WOULD OPERATE LIKE Kevin Durant with less three pointers.

DO NOT TWIST MY WORDS!!!!!!!!!!!

i like a Durant type of player.

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 Jabari Parker is Evan Turner Andrew Wiggins is Terrence Ross

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

 Jabari Parker is Evan Turner Andrew Wiggins is Terrence Ross

[HyphMcgyphParticipant]

 Jabari Parker is a better athlete than Andrew Wiggins IMO…Wiggins has a ridiculous quick jump but Parker is smoother, stronger, and waaaaaay better off of one foot. Folks, I implore you to see what is in front of your faces and put Jabari Parker in front of Andrew Wiggins in your mocks. Size, skillset, mentality, all in Parker’s favor

[HyphMcgyphParticipant]

 Jabari Parker is a better athlete than Andrew Wiggins IMO…Wiggins has a ridiculous quick jump but Parker is smoother, stronger, and waaaaaay better off of one foot. Folks, I implore you to see what is in front of your faces and put Jabari Parker in front of Andrew Wiggins in your mocks. Size, skillset, mentality, all in Parker’s favor

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

http://youtu.be/-0HY30AY4QM  all from this year and only the half of it

[LambTheBeast03Participant]

http://youtu.be/-0HY30AY4QM  all from this year and only the half of it

[Author]

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