[AderitoParticipant]

Ah, Vince Carter. My 2nd favorite player (My favorite player is Dirk Nowitzki) as a kid, and its a toss up if he’s still 2nd my favorite player now. I had NBA Live 2004 for PS2, when he was the cover athlete. I would go into the player rosters and edit Vinsanity stats all the way up to 99.

At a point in time, he was in the conversation with the likes of Kobe, AI, T-Mac, etc.

VC at his prime was a consistent top 3 SG. He was Rookie of the Year, and was top 10 in scoring during his prime, with around a 24/5/5 average then (his prime). In my opinion, his best season was 2000-2001 with the Raptors when he averaged 27.6pts, 1.1blks, 1.5stls, 3.9ast, 5.5rbs, 40.8 percent from three and 46.0 percent from the field. Not many players can boast those kind of averages. However, his legacy (and career) will forever be tarnished by his injuries and his time in Toronto. Also, he’s never averaged less than 10pts for a season in his career. His career average for points hovers over 20pts. Great player…

In the NBA when you think about dunkers, three players come to mind: Dominique Wilkins, Michael Jordan, and Vince Carter. His athleticism, vertical, and dunking ability was unmatched. Pure joy to watch play. His play in the clutch is also underrated.

Many doesn’t know but he in the 7th place in terms of NBA all time career leaders in 3-Pt Field Goals made with 1809 3pts made over his career. He only have Ray Allen (2973), Reggie Miller (2560), Jason Kidd (1988), Jason Terry (1950), Paul Pierce (1935), Chauncey Billups (1830) in front of him…

After his stint with the Nets, he went to the Magic,Suns, Mavericks and now he is in the Grizzlies. At this phase, it was firmly established Vince’s career was on the wind-down. A typical player that’s role is to shoot 3s and even with that Vince Carter is such a good player, even at his older age. He can still take over games sometimes..

So, where does VC rank as an all-time SG? For me, he has to at least be in the top 10. His work ethic was the downfall of his stardom… would he be an all-time great if he had the work ethic of Kobe? Who knows.

[juves4783Participant]

 no doubt top 15.  i think you could argue top 10 but i could see mj, kobe, wade, drexler, reggie millter, ray allen, earl monroe, pistol pete, allen iverson, havlicek, george gervin, jerry west and maybe joe dumars all being ahead of him.

[juves4783Participant]

 no doubt top 15.  i think you could argue top 10 but i could see mj, kobe, wade, drexler, reggie millter, ray allen, earl monroe, pistol pete, allen iverson, havlicek, george gervin, jerry west and maybe joe dumars all being ahead of him.

[tuck243Participant]

I thought he was a PG? 

[tuck243Participant]

I thought he was a PG? 

[terrancebowerParticipant]

Havlicek was a SF

[juves4783Participant]

well, then sam jones would replace him on the list.

[terrancebowerParticipant]

Fair enough. Maybe throw in Hal Greer too if we’re talking about old timers?

[terrancebowerParticipant]

Fair enough. Maybe throw in Hal Greer too if we’re talking about old timers?

[juves4783Participant]

well, then sam jones would replace him on the list.

[terrancebowerParticipant]

Havlicek was a SF

[BogDon_KryptParticipant]

When it’s all said and done, I think its safe to say VC is the great shooting guard ever on NBA 2k.  Even today on NBA 2K15, he can take over exhibition games.  In fact, last night he scored 38 points on 12/19 shooting.  Although his assist level low at 2, his +- for the game was 8. 

[BogDon_KryptParticipant]

When it’s all said and done, I think its safe to say VC is the great shooting guard ever on NBA 2k.  Even today on NBA 2K15, he can take over exhibition games.  In fact, last night he scored 38 points on 12/19 shooting.  Although his assist level low at 2, his +- for the game was 8. 

[OhCanada-Participant]

 I will always remember him as the most exciting player to ever play an NBA basketball game. Now to an NBA athlete of his level that may not be saying much. These guys love competing and Im sure that he wouldve loved being ranked up there with Kobe and Jordan on the Alltime greatest list. Yet in my humble opinion being the most exciting player to play the sport holds its own greatness in itself because at the end we watch the game to be enticed and excited while watching the best competitively go at it. VC made it look so easy as well.

[OhCanada-Participant]

 I will always remember him as the most exciting player to ever play an NBA basketball game. Now to an NBA athlete of his level that may not be saying much. These guys love competing and Im sure that he wouldve loved being ranked up there with Kobe and Jordan on the Alltime greatest list. Yet in my humble opinion being the most exciting player to play the sport holds its own greatness in itself because at the end we watch the game to be enticed and excited while watching the best competitively go at it. VC made it look so easy as well.

[GrandmamaParticipant]

Probably in the 15-20 range of best SG’s ever.  Definitely not a top 10 SG.

[capecodderParticipant]

 Too much of ratings are based on dunking and Sports Center highlights….if you discount the highlight reels, he may be top 25…..if you base it on talent and spectacular showtime assets…..top 10

[capecodderParticipant]

 Too much of ratings are based on dunking and Sports Center highlights….if you discount the highlight reels, he may be top 25…..if you base it on talent and spectacular showtime assets…..top 10

[GrandmamaParticipant]

Probably in the 15-20 range of best SG’s ever.  Definitely not a top 10 SG.

[ropeParticipant]

Where does he rank all time? HOF in the first few ballots. He is an all timer. Trying to rank them 1 thru 5 (or 15 or whatever) is too tough. There are so many great players in the history of the game and very few people have seen most of them. As far as Maravich, he was a guard, just like the Frazier / Monroe backcourt were just guards. You had to have a variety of skills and complement each other to form a good backcourt. I know Cousy is credited for inventing the position, but the strict designations didn’t show up until way later. PS – I am a huge Pistons fan and loved the Bad Boys, but Joe Dumars was a good player who really doesn’t belong in this discussion. I really don’t think he was even in the next tier down.

[ropeParticipant]

This is a really great article on Maravich from the SI archives.

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/10/23/si-60-curry-kirkpatrick-pete-maravich-no-one-can-cap-pistol

[ropeParticipant]

This is a really great article on Maravich from the SI archives.

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/10/23/si-60-curry-kirkpatrick-pete-maravich-no-one-can-cap-pistol

[ropeParticipant]

Where does he rank all time? HOF in the first few ballots. He is an all timer. Trying to rank them 1 thru 5 (or 15 or whatever) is too tough. There are so many great players in the history of the game and very few people have seen most of them. As far as Maravich, he was a guard, just like the Frazier / Monroe backcourt were just guards. You had to have a variety of skills and complement each other to form a good backcourt. I know Cousy is credited for inventing the position, but the strict designations didn’t show up until way later. PS – I am a huge Pistons fan and loved the Bad Boys, but Joe Dumars was a good player who really doesn’t belong in this discussion. I really don’t think he was even in the next tier down.

[thparadoxParticipant]

Not top 10. Probably around 15th.

Jordan

Jerry West

Kobe

Reggie Miller

Ray Allen

Manu Ginobili

Wade

Clyde Drexler

Tracy McGrady (better peak years. stopped by injuries)

That’s already 9.

Guys on a similar level / Shortened careers:

Eddie Jones

Sidney Moncrief

George Gervin

Sam Jones (could be in the higher group, but hard to adjust for era)

James Harden’s first 5 years are better than VC’s first 5.

That adds to 14.

Vince was also not a pure SG. He played a lot of SF. Paul Pierce was his direct competition, and had a much better career than him.

 

If we want to add intangibles into the mix…. Vince was an incredible player early in his career, performing at a superstar level in his third year at the age of 24. He lead the Raptors to the Eastern Conference Finals where they lost to the 76ers in 7 games. On his way to being a strong MVP candidate.

The following season, he was riddled with what was called "jumpers knee".

Then, for some reason, VC spent the next 2.5 years of his prime in Toronto jogging up the court and settling for "fall away" jumpers.

At first it was probably just discomfort coming back from injury…

But when he was dropped from the team in 2004-2005 after 20 games of just jacking fallaway jumpers, racking up a .068 WS/48, he immediately hit his 3rd year level again on the Nets, putting up a .184 WS/48 over the remainder of the year.

So he spent somewhere between 0.5 and 2.5 seasons playing far below his abilities, in an attempt to get traded.

I don’t know about you, but for me he gets knocked down a few pegs for that.

 

[AderitoParticipant]

Vince Carter: Per Game (1998-99 to 2002-03)
24.1 PTS, 45.4 FG%, 38.7 3P%, 78.2 FT%, 3.7 AST, 5.4 TRB, 1.4 STL, 1.1 BLK, 2.2 TOV

James Harden: Per Game (2009-10 to 2013-14)
18.0 PTS, 44.5 FG%, 36.9 3P%, 84.9 FT%, 3.9 AST, 4.0 TRB, 1.3 STL, 0.3 BLK, 2.2 TOV

Vince Carter was way better than James Harden in the 1st years in the league

[AderitoParticipant]

Vince Carter: Per Game (1998-99 to 2002-03)
24.1 PTS, 45.4 FG%, 38.7 3P%, 78.2 FT%, 3.7 AST, 5.4 TRB, 1.4 STL, 1.1 BLK, 2.2 TOV

James Harden: Per Game (2009-10 to 2013-14)
18.0 PTS, 44.5 FG%, 36.9 3P%, 84.9 FT%, 3.9 AST, 4.0 TRB, 1.3 STL, 0.3 BLK, 2.2 TOV

Vince Carter was way better than James Harden in the 1st years in the league

[thparadoxParticipant]

Vince carter was way better because he averaged 6 more PPG??

Harden was 6th man on a stacked OKC team. He got his points with far fewer FGA than Vince did.

If you compare the advanced stats you’ll see what I’m talking about.

Harden’s last 2 years were better than Vince’s peak.

 

 

 

 

[thparadoxParticipant]

Vince carter was way better because he averaged 6 more PPG??

Harden was 6th man on a stacked OKC team. He got his points with far fewer FGA than Vince did.

If you compare the advanced stats you’ll see what I’m talking about.

Harden’s last 2 years were better than Vince’s peak.

 

 

 

 

[tuck243Participant]

You said James Harden first few years were better than VC…  Which isn’t true…   Also, Vince had a bigger impact on the game and literally put a$$es in those seats in Toronto… 

[tuck243Participant]

You said James Harden first few years were better than VC…  Which isn’t true…   Also, Vince had a bigger impact on the game and literally put a$$es in those seats in Toronto… 

[terrancebowerParticipant]

Defense, in case anyone had forgotten, is 50% of the game (to put simply, just as important as scoring). Vince was a way better defender than James Harden. Not that he was a crazy ballhawk or anything, but solid for sure. Not only is James Harden less than solid on that end, he is downright awful (purely an effort issue, has potential to be atleast average, but terrible effort on that end).

[terrancebowerParticipant]

Defense, in case anyone had forgotten, is 50% of the game (to put simply, just as important as scoring). Vince was a way better defender than James Harden. Not that he was a crazy ballhawk or anything, but solid for sure. Not only is James Harden less than solid on that end, he is downright awful (purely an effort issue, has potential to be atleast average, but terrible effort on that end).

[thparadoxParticipant]

Not top 10. Probably around 15th.

Jordan

Jerry West

Kobe

Reggie Miller

Ray Allen

Manu Ginobili

Wade

Clyde Drexler

Tracy McGrady (better peak years. stopped by injuries)

That’s already 9.

Guys on a similar level / Shortened careers:

Eddie Jones

Sidney Moncrief

George Gervin

Sam Jones (could be in the higher group, but hard to adjust for era)

James Harden’s first 5 years are better than VC’s first 5.

That adds to 14.

Vince was also not a pure SG. He played a lot of SF. Paul Pierce was his direct competition, and had a much better career than him.

 

If we want to add intangibles into the mix…. Vince was an incredible player early in his career, performing at a superstar level in his third year at the age of 24. He lead the Raptors to the Eastern Conference Finals where they lost to the 76ers in 7 games. On his way to being a strong MVP candidate.

The following season, he was riddled with what was called "jumpers knee".

Then, for some reason, VC spent the next 2.5 years of his prime in Toronto jogging up the court and settling for "fall away" jumpers.

At first it was probably just discomfort coming back from injury…

But when he was dropped from the team in 2004-2005 after 20 games of just jacking fallaway jumpers, racking up a .068 WS/48, he immediately hit his 3rd year level again on the Nets, putting up a .184 WS/48 over the remainder of the year.

So he spent somewhere between 0.5 and 2.5 seasons playing far below his abilities, in an attempt to get traded.

I don’t know about you, but for me he gets knocked down a few pegs for that.

 

[Author]

Posts