what is causing the discrepancy between Ford and NBADRAFT.NET on Jrue?
I hate to bring Jrue up again, but what is causing Chad Ford to continually RAVE about this guy, when another comparably "IN" source (Aran, or someone else on this site) sees him as such a marginal player?
In Ford's latest "Tiers" article, which organizes players into different tiers (he has griffin on tier 1 by himself, tier 2 has rubio, thabeet, harden, etc.) he has Holiday on tier 3 and Blair on tier 4 and he goes on to say that this tier system would keep a team from reaching for blair because he fits a need and instead take Holiday who is the better player.... Personally, I think Jrue is going to be very solid at a minimum, though I think he has a limited ceiling... But I certainly don't think he's better than Blair. (maybe he's a better prospect, but that's different than being a better player)
but more importantly, why does he think that holiday is so great? and why does Aran think he sucks so much and is completely overhyped? How does that happen? Aran thinks Jrue belongs somewhere in the late teens or early 20s and Ford seems to think Holiday is going 4... seriously, what's the deal
Aran is wrong and Chad is right.
We just need to stop this putting Jrue Holiday out the lottery biz. He will go top 14 regardless of what people say. Sacramento, Washington, Golden State, New York among other lottery teams like him and his Gary Payton like upside.
do you think it's just a difference of opinion on him? or does chad ford just have better contacts with NBA? (you'd think he would since he is E S P N) but i donno, aran seems connected too
I think on Aran's part (no disrespect) he is in somewhat of a disbelief that Holiday will get drafted top 14. I even read that he's the front runner for the Kings at 4.
i also wonder if possibly GMs and teams use Ford to put out what they want everyone to THINK they are doing... like a big chess match... and maybe aran will be right and people were just using Jrue as a decoy
lol, what if ford is just a pawn in the grand scheme of things...
LOL...Maybe...But I think many people underestimate ford.
ok i tried and tried and tried not to say anything but i just have to..first of all..the arans wrong and chads right arugument is just plain dumb..i also strongly dont agree him being gary payton..delonte west yes gary payton helllllllllll no..hes shown nothing to even remotley think that he will be gary payton.......id go with the in source rather then a guy who just happens to like a player..there really is no prediction with this guy as far as being good or being a bust because against actually competetion(college) he didnt show to be a potenial good player nor did he show hed be a complete bum he just showned he could possible be a average player
so you think it's just in chad's opinion that he'll be good? or do you think that it's just aran's opinion that he's overhyped? basically why is chad for so high on him? because all the GMs arE?
yeah ive looked up some past drafts and noticed that chad pretty much goes with what some gms may say...for the most part when i look more closely at the ones that arennt real high on a player then ones that are extremly high on a player..but not someone who is very low on a player..the answer is usually somewhere in the middle
I'm not gonna get into where he will be drafted because I have gone down that road plenty of times already. But I do find it wierd the complete discrepency between this site and some others.
Ford has him top 5, Gottlieb has him top 5, but Aran I believe has him 18 right now, which is actually an improvement since he has had had him in the mid 20's most the time. Also, I remember right after they did some drills at the combine, many sites were raving about Holiday and saying that many GM's confirmed he sealed himself as a top 14 pick. After that very same workout, Aran said he was unimpressive and did nothing to stand out. I guess it all depends on what you are looknig for.
People should keep in mind though that Jrue is only 18 and still has plenty of upside.
Holiday is going top 10....that is a fact.
yeah ive heard that his workout wasnt any different then other players....i think its the hype machine and the fact that someone likes him so much that he cant do no wrong....he might go top 10 since some people will buy into the hype just like mullins will go earlier then he should
Yeah I wouldn't be surprised to see Mullens & Daye both sneaking into the top 18.
I have seen some mocks with Daye going as high as 13. That seems like a reach to me
Personally, I don't think Jrue will be drafted as a lottery pick. Does anyone think, if he slips out of the lottery, the 76ers would draft him at 17 since they need a PG??
i'd say there's a 95%+ chance that daye goes top 20, otherwise he'd have pulled out.
I'd also say there's a 95% chance that holiday goes lottery, otherwise he'd have also pulled out. i'm pretty sure it's NOT a fact, though, that he'll go top 10
Rumor has it the 76ers are pretty much stuck on drafting Maynor. Holiday has to be a lottery pick. The Kings, Warriors, Knicks, Bucks, Bobcats, Pacers all have serious interest in Jrue.
The Pacers also like Maynor though. I could see Maynor not being around when Philly picks at 17.
That is true but I think Maynor will be there at 17...just my guess.
Will he go top 10?
Holiday has a lot of potential he just didn't have a great year at UCLA from what I hear.
I am one of those guys who thinks BJ Mullens will be next in a long line of gifted athletes who were big on potential, but never made it in the NBA.
Nonetheless, putting aside my personal opinion on Mullens, I would think the last team who would want to draft this LONG TERM PROJECT is Detroit. I'm sure Joe Dumars has vivid memories of the Darko Milicic selection and doesn't want to make the same mistake twice. Dumars is a very smart guy and he doesn't want to absorb the kind of criticism he took as a result of the Milicic selection. Dumars doesn't want to answer never ending questions while he waits 2-3 years for Mullens to possibly develop.
Therefore, I would say Detroit is probably one team that will not put BJ Mullens on their list. I can't understand why NBADraft.net has him in that slot.
Can someone please tell me where Chad Ford has Mullens?
I think Ford had Mullens going #16 to Chicago
I think one key difference between a darko/mullens selection would be #2 vs. #15, and the pistons overall situation.
With the #2 pick, there's a lot more pressure to take a good/proven player (especially in a draft that was filled with SO much talent) I think as you get further and further down the board, you get more and more leeway as far as taking a project vs a proven player.
Another thing, the Pistons were WAY better when they picked Millicic than they are now... they are in much more of a rebuilding mode than they were back then, so picking a guy who may blossom in a few years is also much more acceptable.
That said, I doubt they're taking him. I see them packaging 15 with Amir Johnson, as has been reported elsewhere. Or taking someone like Earl Clark who is a little more NBA ready
one other thing, this thread is about JRUE HOLIDAY, not Mullens.... when I come to this thread i want to read about Holiday NOT Mullens. If I wanted to read about Mullens I would go to a thread about him! LOL ;) at least you played on the ford nbadraft.net differences in perception, though apparently there isn't much of a discrepancy. just giving you a hard time
I don't know if Holliday will be a Payton clone, or even close. I do know that even Gary Payton wasn't Gary Payton until his 3rd season & Holliday is only 18.
xbadgerhustler, I thought the thread was about the discrepancy between Ford and NBADraft.net. I didn't notice the words "On Jrue" at the very end of the thread title. My fault!
By the way, I thought you made some excellent points about Detroit's position today versus when they had the number 2 selection. Having said that, I have a strong feeling Dumars just doesn't want to go through that again.
rtbt, rules do have a soothing affect on me- i'll give you that. just makes me feel more at ease! lol
Hey xbadgerhustler, any time you need some soothing and a "rules massage", just let me know.
Aran says what he thinks should happen while Ford says what he thinks will happen.
I agree ZK. I agree completely. That's basically what I was trying to gauge...and get other people's opinion to see if I was off.
rtbt, just keep patrolling the forum! that works well enough. lol.
actually gary payton was freshman of the year in the pac-10 and was damn good..so theres a pretty big difference on top of him going back to get better and him never having confidence issues.....also im not sure if peple have noticed but every year gms and sources will tell the media that a player is doing very werll in the hopes that someother team picks that player and the player the team really wants drops to them..for the most part a team isnt gonna let it be known who they real want...one main reason is that a team can pick that player then use it to trade with that team to get there draft pick and a player on there roster...its like poker