[ZachAttackParticipant]

 Here is a paper I found that was written fairly recently. It is pretty long but if you have time read the paper and tell me what you think about it…

The Van Exel Effect

Like I said… It’s really long but I found it kind of interesting especially since problems with the refs has been such a huge topic. Stats are having just as many problems, just not as many people know about it…

 

[Andrew1984Participant]

I’ve always felt that "two dribbles" is far too skimpy with regard to criteria for an assist. There are many instances in the average NBA game where a player passes to a teammate who catches it, turns, faces his defender, jab-steps, shot fakes, takes a dribble, jump-stops, shot fakes again, and then scores. Because he only took one dribble, the teammate who passed him the ball is awarded an assist.

The above situation has always utterly baffled me because in no way, shape, or form did the player who made the pass set up the basket, create the opportunity, or otherwise achieve anything that assisted on the made field goal, yet he is given an assist because the rule is two dribbles (although I suppose I could be wrong; I remember hearing somewhere that two dribbles is the rule, but I don’t recall the source of this information).

There is a degree of subjectivity involved, just like a scorekeeper in baseball deciding whether or not to charge an error. I like that. I think scorekeepers should be a little more stingy with them. When assists are awarded so freely, they have less meaning.

[Andrew1984Participant]

I’ve always felt that "two dribbles" is far too skimpy with regard to criteria for an assist. There are many instances in the average NBA game where a player passes to a teammate who catches it, turns, faces his defender, jab-steps, shot fakes, takes a dribble, jump-stops, shot fakes again, and then scores. Because he only took one dribble, the teammate who passed him the ball is awarded an assist.

The above situation has always utterly baffled me because in no way, shape, or form did the player who made the pass set up the basket, create the opportunity, or otherwise achieve anything that assisted on the made field goal, yet he is given an assist because the rule is two dribbles (although I suppose I could be wrong; I remember hearing somewhere that two dribbles is the rule, but I don’t recall the source of this information).

There is a degree of subjectivity involved, just like a scorekeeper in baseball deciding whether or not to charge an error. I like that. I think scorekeepers should be a little more stingy with them. When assists are awarded so freely, they have less meaning.

[terrancebowerParticipant]

I can definitely agree with most of what you’re saying, and have thought the same thing myself, but at the same time doesn’t that mean that the PG is getting the ball to his players in positions that they’re comfortable?

Let’s pretend the above situation applies to Rondo and Cousins just for the sake of example, if Rondo passes to Cousins who is in the post and is covered, but is only covered by one defender, and Rondo knows that it’s rare for Cousins to be so deep without a double team, I think that’s good recognition on Rondo’s part.

Cousins might pump fake and use a drop step to get a free shot off, but if Rondo hesitates in getting Cousins the ball, or feeds him too far from the basket, Cousins will either get blocked by a help defender or will be too far to score with 2 or less steps, unless he hits a jumper, in which case Rondo would absolutely deserve the assist.

I realize that’s a specific example, but I think it shows how it’s really subjective even on post ups. Maybe there could be a caveat that cancels out the assist if more than 2 fakes are used? I know that’s pretty specific, but they could easily track the stat just maybe not in real time.

The last thing I would consider, is that when a player makes a beautiful dish to an open teammate who inexplicably blows a wide open layup, dunk or jumper, the PG gets zero credit, so getting those cheap assists described above is maybe a way of evening it out? Statistical Karma?

[terrancebowerParticipant]

I can definitely agree with most of what you’re saying, and have thought the same thing myself, but at the same time doesn’t that mean that the PG is getting the ball to his players in positions that they’re comfortable?

Let’s pretend the above situation applies to Rondo and Cousins just for the sake of example, if Rondo passes to Cousins who is in the post and is covered, but is only covered by one defender, and Rondo knows that it’s rare for Cousins to be so deep without a double team, I think that’s good recognition on Rondo’s part.

Cousins might pump fake and use a drop step to get a free shot off, but if Rondo hesitates in getting Cousins the ball, or feeds him too far from the basket, Cousins will either get blocked by a help defender or will be too far to score with 2 or less steps, unless he hits a jumper, in which case Rondo would absolutely deserve the assist.

I realize that’s a specific example, but I think it shows how it’s really subjective even on post ups. Maybe there could be a caveat that cancels out the assist if more than 2 fakes are used? I know that’s pretty specific, but they could easily track the stat just maybe not in real time.

The last thing I would consider, is that when a player makes a beautiful dish to an open teammate who inexplicably blows a wide open layup, dunk or jumper, the PG gets zero credit, so getting those cheap assists described above is maybe a way of evening it out? Statistical Karma?

[Hype Machine]

 As a Utah Fan, Im not surprised this topic interests you. In the 80s and 90s, the Jazz had the most ridiculously bias scorekeepers.

All Time Single Season Assist record (by huge margin) – John Stockton

All time Single Season Blocks record ( by a huge margin) – Mark Eaton

Even that record breaking assist by Stockton is dubious. He dumped an entry pass into the post which was bobbled, followed by a turnaround jumper.

 

 

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

 As a Utah Fan, Im not surprised this topic interests you. In the 80s and 90s, the Jazz had the most ridiculously bias scorekeepers.

All Time Single Season Assist record (by huge margin) – John Stockton

All time Single Season Blocks record ( by a huge margin) – Mark Eaton

Even that record breaking assist by Stockton is dubious. He dumped an entry pass into the post which was bobbled, followed by a turnaround jumper.

 

 

 

 

 

[BogDon_KryptParticipant]

 The topic name intrigued me but I was disappointed to learn it wasn’t very interesting at all.  There should be more articles about free throw percentage in tbe 2nd quarter and how it affects the all star game.  

[BogDon_KryptParticipant]

 The topic name intrigued me but I was disappointed to learn it wasn’t very interesting at all.  There should be more articles about free throw percentage in tbe 2nd quarter and how it affects the all star game.  

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