[The GoatParticipant]

 With the way the game has evolved, do you think we will see another defensively challenged, offensively skilled big man without an outside shot be drafted in the high lottery again?

I think we hit the moment the league has gone from Beta to VHS, from CD to mp3. 

I don’t think I have seen the value of a consensus can’t miss big like Jahlil Okafor plummet like this before. 

Okafor, Monroe, Jefferson, Kanter and Vucevic would be on this list if he couldn’t step out a bit. I think they’ll have roles going forward, but could you still take a guy like this with a high pick?

 

 

 

 

 

[festar35Participant]

I do think that we will see them still taking high in lottery, but it won’t be as franchise players anymore.

What I have noticed about these guys is they are shifting more into 6th man roles and still putting up good numbers in doing so. I can truly see a guy in the style of the list above one day coming out with a 6th man award as I think they will still pick apart 2nd units.

In saying that with regards to Okafor I still think he can be an All-Star piece, unfortunately he is being treated like a Yo-Yo in Philly. He has shown an OK ability to protect the rim and has potential to at least develop a solid mid-range game to keep tems honest, I just think he needs the right situation.

[Andv1 WaitingParticipant]

Taking  a player like Kanter,Okafor or Monroe(the High picks on your list)  with a high pick really all depends on two factors: How weak is the draft and do they fit your overall team…

If it is a weak draft(2011) like Kanters was considered at the time you have to consider taking the BPA to fill a need(Though Kyrie,Kawhi,Kemba,Jimmy B and Klay all came out of this draft). 

However the easiest ways to fully answer the question is this who is the coach,what is there system and  what is the personal..

Positive example(When you could take a player like Kanter etc): Lets say OKC(a fully formed team) drafted Kanter with a top 3 pick in 2015 this move could work as we had the personal to make this move work with having a defensive Big that has a high IQ that can work well with him(Steve Adams) and a stretch 4 that could play defense that can space the floor while Kanter worked off the block..See Spurs series to how it can work and GSW series-the only team that really takes the Kanters of the NBA out of the game.

or

If you have no talent what so ever and can build fully around those strengthes like: Houston finally did around Harden this year(also defensively really average). However the two keys are right coach and right players put around them.

 

Negative examples(When you shouldn’t take a player like Jahlil): 76ers or Bucks 

The 76ers draft was taking BPA in a very strong draft:2015 

If you looked at the 76ers team as it was assembled when Jahlil got drafted that was a horrible horrible rebuilding fit at the time. 

The 76ers had a C/PF who cant play to far away from the basket(Noel) top 6 pick also and isn’t exactly a high IQ player from what I can tell(sorry if I am wrong) and is a horrible fit next to Jahlil who also needs to be close to the basket also. However it will be interesting to see if they try Embiid and Jahlil if that works all may not be lost/it stil may work. Personally I could have seen Jahlil working with Knicks if they ran the Triangle go figure(still top 4 pick)..

Then there is Monroe with the Bucks where he went to a team the team may fit him but where the System just didn’t fit him …So he is now off the bench.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[HitsterParticipant]

 Good points by Andy1 so +1 from me. Okafor would have been a nice fit for the Knicks playing the triangle but not as nice a fit as Porz would have been at Philly. Porz at PF and Embeast at C with Simmons as point forward would have been damn right scary.

Monroe was drafted in later top 10 as compared to other guys much nearer the top of the draft, so his limitations were probably better known.

With so many bigs able to shoot from range this days, players have to be mobile enough to defend these guys or cannot just rely on mixing it in the paint.

A guy like Shaq would have still thrived and been as dominant or probably more dominant with his post game in today’s NBA so his lack of speed on defence would not have been an issue. He’d have planted himself in the paint and said shoot over or around me.

 

 

 

 

[The GoatParticipant]

Its interesting.. does a tweener who can defend a wing now have as much value as a big that doesn’t protect the rim? Anyway, I started this thread cos I saw Monroe getting less than 10 mins the last 3 games and I’m really not sure what the Bucks can/will do with him. 

[Andv1 WaitingParticipant]

Three options:

Keep him in a 6th man/bench role to let him help lift your bench scoring and either cover his defense or except he is going to give up some points,as long as its not as much as he scores you are fine.

Try Trade him but I don’t if you would get much back for him/the market is that great for him-They could try Portland,NOLA or WIZ thats all I could think of right now.. 

or

Let him walk if he declines player option next season. Monroe also better hope he goes to a team with a Serge Ibaka type player that can space the floor for him and cover his defense or whatever team Ibaka goes to outside of Orlando lol(If Ibaka bails)..

The only 3 teams I could possibly see him working on though: NOLA(assuming the moved Asik somewhere),Portland maybe with Meyers if he can play defense and maybe Washington with Morris playing beside him. Other than those teams I don’t know what else you can do with him really..

 As that is now two teams he hasn’t really suited and has resulted in two teams not making the playoffs: Left Detroit makes playoffs(Clearly wasn’t working there with Drummond) and Signs with Bucks and they fall out of the playoff race..

As for your tweener question: As long as they: Handle the ball to a reasonable standard, Can shoot the ball/score at a reasonable rate and they can defend at least one postion(It makes them more versatile option). Example of a tweener: Jabari/Harrison Barnes

They are more valuable than a big that can’t defend anyone as The two maybe 3 things a big can usually do:Score,Defend and Pass. Because if the can’t Defend and Scoring then you have to hope they score more than the oppositions Bigs which is not always possible especially if theirs are two way players. Example of this would be Kanter vs GSW

 

 

 

 

[ChoppyParticipant]

 Someone earlier mentioned that Okafor would work in The NY triangle. Could Monroe have success if he went to NY as he is a similar player? I was hearing that during his free agency it came down to the bucks or Knicks and he chose bucks. Do you think he regrets that decision now? 

[Andv1 WaitingParticipant]

If Monroe went to the Knicks in 2015 yes he could have possibly worked: Especially if they were deadset on running the Triangle(You could have him play the Bynum role and Kristaps play the Pau role).. However not so much now, well unless they moved Noah,I don’t know who would want his contract though as that is worse than Monroes(He has one last year left after this one) .. Personally I bet he regrets the move alot he went to the team to be a starter and is now a bench player…He better opt in this offseason as no one is going to pay him that money this coming offseason lol.

[holefillers1Participant]

 Thad young used to be the wrong kind if tweeter. Jerami Grant is in that mold as well. I believe if you can defend multiple positions it keeps you in the court in the crunch.  The league has taken a negative (tweener) and turned it into a positive (stretch).  Even guys like Thad are considered stretch players because of there ability to guard the perimeter, not so much with their shooting.

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