Sixers Draft Day Move
If Wiggins (the understood prime Sixers target), is off the board.
Parker and his lack of defense are suspect.
How about this among all the other possibilities.
Sixers Draft Joel Embiid with their first pick.
They then trade Nerlens Noel and the 10th pick to move to #6. They take Noah Vonleh.
They trade pick 32 and Thaddeus Young to Pheonix and take Zach Lavine at pick 21.
MCW - Lavine - ________ - Vonleh - Embiid.
Noel is worth the 6th pick by himself so I would never trade the 10th pick with him.
I love Embiid and would be willing to trade Noel if we drafted him, but I think that I wouldn't trade Noel for Vonleh. I would want Parker or Exum.
Still, I don't think we should be trading Noel even if we do draft Embiid. Let's see how it works, and let Noel have a solid healthy year. If we ultimately decide that they are both centers and Embiid is the franchise player then Noel can be traded. If he shows the skills that we expect from him and proves that he is healthy teams will be fighting each other to trade for him.
We should be patient. An elite rim protector that doesn't need the ball will slide in to most lineups in the nba.
I don't think Noel alone will get you the 6th pick. The fact that he played 0 games coming off major knee surgery from a fluky injury is why. He also has no offensive skill (running, jumping, and dunking are not skills to me.)
I don't think Noel and the 10th pick are enough to get you Exum or Parker. You're talking Potential franchise changing players there. You woudln't trade a rim-protector and a solid contributor (10th pick) for a potential franchise changer on a bad team.
Vonleh is in the next tier, and he happens to be an ideal 4. So I think that 10 and Noel would allow you to move to 6 to grab Vonleh.
You would have ideal size and defense with good offensive output from the 1, 4, and 5 positions.
Noel and Embiid, I think can work as long as the offense runs through Embiid, but both of their games have to mature for that. Embiid is not a go-to guy like Shaq or Hakeem at this point. And ideally your 4 (vonleh to me, or maybe Noel to you), would be able to get out to hit some shots and spread the floor for Embiid to go to work and not get double-teamed. Floor spacing and offensive potential is why I prefer Vonleh to Noel.
I don't think MCW is a great offensive player. Noel definitely is not. Embiid will be decent. So I think the Sixers definitely need more scoring. MCW, Embiid, Vonleh is much better offensively than MCW, Noel, Embiid.
I agree that right now, with Noel coming off the injury, that he probably isn't going to get you Exum or Parker, but if he establishes himself this year I think that he has that type of value.
Basically, I think trading him eventually due to issues with Embiid is something to think about, but I would need more than just Vonleh and definitely more than Vonleh and the 10th pick.
If we get the second pick in the draft this year, my prefernence would be to just take Embiid and figure out the rest later.
I could be fine with just taking Parker in that situation though too.
I dont see that happening. There's just no point in trading a player who was injured for a whole year. The value of Noel will increase after every each game he plays. The next thing is that Brett Brown and even the CEO - Scott O'Neil openly talked about the fact that they are build a high pace, running team relying heavily on analitycs. You dont start building a running team by drafting centers in consecutive years. I think that it's a high probability that is the 76ers draft Embiid he will be moved. They are targeting either Wiggins or Parker for sure. Wiggins fits perfectly to the running style. If they draft Parker I'm quite confident that Brett Brown plays him at the 4.
The 76ers are also quite open about talking that they are looking for a star player in this draft. If they fall to either 4 or 5 and miss on either Wiggins or Parker do you see a scenario in which they pack their own pick ( 4 or 5 ) and the Pelicans pick to move up for either Parker or Wiggins ? The next thing is that do you see a team willing to trade their top 3 pick for a such package?
Assuming they want Wiggins, and he fits that super-athletic team they want to build. I'm not sure that is championship basketball. I think OKC has the offensive superstar in Durant, and they run the super-athletic offense, that team still is not good enough to win a championship. OKC has Durant, and yet they run no set plays and rely completely on energy to win. Thats not good enough to win in the NBA. You have to play in a system with smart players and run plays. Did you see Memphis run that nice set play out of the timeout where they hit Randolph for the easy layup. Anyway, I just don't think the super-athletic team that doesn't play smart basketball is the way to go. You want long guys that play sound defense and spread the ball around.
The Sixers would not even have a Durant-type. Wiggins is nowehre near Durant offensively. And then there is definitely no Westbrook, and Noel after a year's work put in, Brett Brown is still saying he is "far off". I dont' think Noel is the brightest bulb. I was watching that insane practice video where Noel was dunking like it was a 3-foot rim, but Jeff Foster was trying to teach him a post-up move. It was pretty simple, and Noel coudln't do it. I think he is offensively very challenged.
So if athleticism is the way they want to go, they are doomed, at least to me. They need to play system basketball, and they have the opportunity to get the right pieces since they are starting from scratch.
So no, I would not trade the 4 or 5 AND the 10 to get Wiggins. That leaves you with MCW, Wiggins, and Noel, and there is no offense there. That is not close to Westbrook, Durant, Ibaka. I think MCW, Vonleh, and Embiid would be a much better foundation to build off of.
It's crazy the amount of options the sixers will have this offseason as far as trades. I think you could be right about packaging Young and some second rounders for an additional first rounder. The sixers really need to see what they have in Noel before doing anything with him though. Also, even though Wiggins would be the number 1 choice, I would be more than happy to settle for an NBA ready Parker.
It's fun to play off-season fantasy GM but teams just don't make that many moves at once...even ones that lost 26 straight. Part of me wishes they would - would make April to October more exciting for those of us with teams eliminated in January.
Man you 76er fans are relentless with your draft day dreams.
We don't have much else to be excited about right now so cut us some slack. LOL
Nerlens Noel is the player no team seems to want. He was meant to go #1 remember. Nothing has changed "theoretically" so the assumption should be that he's going to be a great player?
Then why are teams so uninterested in him?
Parker and G.Harris
But you are missing defense at the 3 and 4.
I still like my hypothetical. I think MCW-Lavine/Stauskas-FA- Vonleh- Embiid destroys that team in 3 years.
I don't think so, simply because Noel MCW harris and Young are good defender. And harris/parker are ready to play tomorrow.
Embiid and Vonleh vs Noel and Thad Young? Have you seen Thad Young try to defend a legitimate PF? Noel might be able to help on one...but Noel will not touch Embiid. Embiid has been playing ball for two years. Thats my prediction: Embiid will DOMINATE Chicken-Leg Noel. And Thad has no shot guarding Vonleh in 3 years.
Parker is a strong offensive player but a FA defender will be able to slow him down.
And Lavine vs. Harris....that was the reason I joined the forum, haha. Most people know where I stand on that. I will live and die by that prediction. Though I think Harris is a good role player, Lavine to me has far more upside. In 3 years I think with spacing and opportunity, Lavine will be a top 5 player from this draft.
i think you're scenario is nice defensively but offensively, vonleh and embiid are huge question marks. vonleh attempted 7 shots a game and most were outside the box. he really doesn't have a refined post game. embiid was a giant among college centers and only took 6 shots a game. these guys can bully college bigs but the nba is going chew them up and spit them out.
i think your analysis on parker is off because if he can't score in nba, then nobody in this class will. he's the best offensive player in the draft!!!!
i'll give you lavine has a higher ceiling that harris, but 76ers can't continue to put crap on the court. harris is a year older and can play right away. lavine is good, but shot selection and weight will prevent him from ever stepping on the court.
a team of embiid, vonleh, -, lavine and mcw is going to average 60 ppg.
I would not give Noel & pick 10 for pick 6, I don't care who falls to 6.
Phx. does not have pick 21.
Thad & 32 will likely not be enough for pick 21.
Lastly, Lavine will be gone before pick 21.
many mock drafts bro!
the mock draft I saw I guess on bleacher report was that PHX had 21.
But I agree with you Thad plus 32 probably isn't enough to jump up 9 spots.
However, PHX will not want all 3 of their first round contract picks I assume. And they woudln't be willing to give up their first pick at 16, so you go for the 2nd one IF Lavine is available, and he's dropped off quite a bit on many mocks, and he doesn't seem like a rising pick. I assumed they'd trade Thad and 32 for either PHX or Chicago's picks...and frankly both could use him, unless CHI signs Carmelo. He'd be a great offensive punch for CHI and he'd fit right in with PHX, so I can see it happen.
I would give up Noel and 10 for 6 if 6 was a guaranteed piece for the future. Vonleh next to Embiid would be a great frontline playing together for the next 6 years. Surely we can find a 3 in FA that would want to play with Vonleh, Embiid, and MCW in 3 years.
i read chad ford's draft chat transcript and he indicated if noel was in this years' draft even with the injury, he'd be the 5th best prospect behind exum, embiid, parker and wiggins. trading him with the 10 for the 6 would be outrageous.
you of all people have lavine falling to 21???? i don't think he'll get past the nuggets who can afford to swing for the fences with all the depth they have. even phoenix at 14 would probably take a swing at lavine. definitey chicago at 16 or 19 too.
i agree with the dude that had parker and harris. harris is known as a 2-way player and his size isn't as bad next to mcw. also, both can play right away.
my last thought is for a team rebuilding, why take a chance on embiid? 2015 draft is the draft for centers. there are no wing players with the size/skill combo of wiggins or parker in next years' draft. 76ers would be crazy to pass on wiggins or parker for embiid.
There are some good center prospects for next year, but none of them are in Embiid's class imo. He can be dominant on both ends of the court.
I was just opening up a hypothetical discussion. I love that team I assembled with Embiid Vonleh and MCW, I think they are three ideal guys at their positions.
Lavine at 21 is because so many drafts have him falling there, the so-called experts. Lavine did nothing to help his case in March. He's a pure potential pick but I agree with you many teams would take a shot at him (I hope its the Sixers with the 10th pick).
I also strongly agree with you about there being no 3's in next year's draft, but I was saying IF we don't land Wiggins, then we should go the Embiid route and make the moves I stated. And land the 3 in FA.
Next year's draft is strong for Big Men....I like Okafor (even though I cringed at his name but when I saw him play liked him a lot). I don't think Towns is gonna be a good pro. I'd go with Myles Turner, but next to Noel, that would be perhaps the softest front court in the history of the NBA (i exaggerate).
Now as far as Noel being the 5th best prospect, I don't think so. I think he is a glorified Cauley-Stein. Noel is terrible at offense from all the film and games I've seen. He's a tall shot blocker yes. But there is no way he will improve his "J" like Ibaka. Have you seen Noel's legs? If yes, were you surprised he tore up his knee on that fluky injury? His legs are pencils bro.
Too many rookies, don't you think? You can't develop that much talent in just a year or two. Noel is a rookie as well since he didn't play in 13-14.
Brett Brown is a development guy. Charles Barkley said he LOVED what the Sixers were doing and said they'd be a destination for FA in a few years. This is just my way of doing it even better than what they have now!
An intelligent basketball player, would want to play with MCW, Embiid, and Vonleh. You add a 3 that can shoot, a Shawn Marion type, even a Rudy Gay or Iggy type, and a 2 that can get his own shot and slash, and you'll win some championships.
Oh and draft Thanasis, bring him off the bench if you want to run!
I wasn't the biggest fan of noel but at one point he was considered to be the number 1 prospect of his draft.
I increased my bench by 100 plus lbs in my first 8 months winging it. Noel has pro trainers, physical therapist and dietitians the thing I was big on was he lack of strength I saw him around November and he was cut up I know he has to made huge gains by now tobias harris put on 30 pounds just last off season by next year noel would have had ample amount of time to increase his body. that was his biggest issue to me. next thing was his basketball IQ.
I say you see what noel has to offer you made the investment and it netted you a high pick in this year draft, this wouldn't be possible without the noel trade that's what started the rebuild.
listen one thing you cant deny is a player capable of scoring in half court sets from anywhere on the floor
so if wiggins is gone you take parker . if parker is gone you take wiggins as mentioned before parker can paly either the 3 or the 4 depending on what the coach wants to do.
As a sixers fan im more concerned about what we do with our second pick , all the second round picks, thad young, and how do we get another lottery pick in next years draft this time less protected lets keep that trend going.
The dumbest thing I ever heard. I wouldn't trade Noel for Vonleh straight up let alone give up an extra pick to do so.
Are you stupid or something ?
Also we have time if we learned anything from okc its not to rush it no matter what success you have when building through draft.
3 years 4 lottery picks 3 all stars but they only retained two because they rushed to get a center for a win now status and was left with little to no cap flexibility. they could have had green and harden and still signed a nice free agent maybe a big to put along with ibaka or maybe they could have drafted another good player and packaged him with green and landed a superstar .......howard got traded and okc could have been a team with a package for him but they rushed it.
pacers a small market team took a long time to rebuild and put together a nice team with a great starting 5 minus the pg at times. made some ok acquisitions also.
I just feel like they need to take it slow because the sixers franchised never seemwsto understand the concept of rebuilding.
Draft Parker. Draft Harris. Sign Monroe.
I think Monroe and Harris would compliment Parker perfectly.
1st. The Sixers will draft Parker or Wiggins at 1or 2, after that they'll take the Best Player Available @ 10(which could be Noah Vonleh or Gary Harris IMO)
2nd. Thad Young is worth the Suns or Bulls lowest pick in the Top 20 by himself, you 'd want us to trade him and the 32nd pick for a huge Question Mark @ 17 or 19...Just a terrible Idea all around considering the 32nd pick could be as good as the player taken in that 16-20 range
O.K. - So I get that your goal is to have Embiid, Vonleh and MCW as the core going forward.
I still don't see how you get Lavine as well. I don't think Thad plus any combo. of other assets gets you into the area Lavine will be taken.
If you think Lavine is going to be one of the top 5 players from this draft, why not just take him at 10 ?
The core would than be Embiid, Noel, Lavine and MCW.
Just play it out with Embiid and Noel and see what you have. They could each get 24 minutes per game at the 5, and no doubt there will be other situations within a game where each could get 30 minutes per game.
Just my thoughts, as a fellow sixers fan I love your passion for our team !