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Russell Westbrook for Chris Paul?

BKKnicksfan
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Russell Westbrook for Chris Paul?

Chris Broussard is throwing this idea out, what do you think of a potential Chris Paul for Russell Westbrook idea?

The salaries don't match up, but the ideal deal would be IMO is:

Russell Westbrook, Nate Robinson, B.J. Mullens and 2012 1st round pick for Chris Paul

New Orleans gets a 22 year old star to replace Paul in New Orleans, Nate Robinson as a backup guard/exp contract and B.J. Mullens as a young potential big. Also, New Orleans gets a 2012 1st round pick which will give New Orleans another 1st round pick in a potential deep draft.

Oklahoma City now get a better lead guard in Paul. Not only does he help Durant, he helps Ibaka, who could be his next potential Chandler and Harden, who can be a better scorer. Throw in Perkins in the frontcourt and Oklahoma City has a monster five with Maynor, Thabo, Mohammed and Collison off the bench.

Thoughts? Again, this wasn't my idea, I just expanded on it with my own thoughts.


RUDEBOY_
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I've said it for the past 2

I've said it for the past 2 years that Westbrook is better suited to play shooting guard...He's like Wade who also has the talent to play the point,but is better when he's attacking the basket..

If OKC throw in Harden instead of Nate,Alrich instead of Mullens.. The Hornets might do that deal...

BKKnicksfan
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If OKC throw in Harden

If OKC throw in Harden instead of Nate,Alrich instead of Mullens.. The Hornets might do that deal...

He's my counter to this: What other deal out there is even as good as this deal? Realisticaly

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Let's say that original offer

Let's say that original offer is on the table for OKC... is it more of a risk to do the deal or not to do it?

So many factors... Westbrook is still only 22 and getting better, will Westbrook accept the role of Robin to Durant's Batman, can Paul stay healthy and keep up the high level of play he displayed in this years playoffs, it would make OKC a little older, would Westbrook resign with NO, would Paul resign with OKC, would Presti move away from his slow development model even more (Green for Perk deal)? etc

Also, I think OKC would rather have Westbrook + Harden than Paul.

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CP3 brings so many

CP3 brings so many intangibles to a team you cant teach...It'll be easy to replace a guy like Harden....

BKKnicksfan
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But why give up Harden....you

But why give up Harden....you probably don't have to.

Memphis Madness
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Westbrook is the second

Westbrook is the second scorer because he is one of two guys on his team that can create his own shot.

Bringing in Chris Paul won't change that. CP3 will be the second option. Paul is the better passer but Westbrook might be a better scorer. Westbrook, at this point has more upside.

I think Westbrook-Paul trade straight up would be a fair trade.

The Thunder need a third scorer (13 or 14 points a game). I really like Harden off the bench.

Durant-Westbrook-Ibaka-Harden is a great core. I would put another veteran in there, another young player, and a third big man.

This would be an interesting trade for 2 good big men off the bench (8-10 points each and a few rebounds a game). Cole, Mullens, their 1st round pick, and a future first round pick for Jeff Green and Big Baby. I think the Celtics really want to rebuild, and I am not sure that Big Baby is in their plans.

Davis, Green, Harden, Collison, and Maynor would be a great bench. That would add two good pieces without messing with the core. All of those guys can give them 10 to 15 points off the bench and would take pressure off of Durant and Westbrook. Use the superstars as their main scorers again and try to get Ibaka going early. Finish games with KD, Russell, Ibaka (for defense) and whichever other two guys are hot. That's a deep bench who can put other teams away.

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I just think you do whatever

I just think you do whatever it takes to get Chris Paul and Kevin Durant on the same team. However, if Westbrook and Durant go on to the Finals or even win the championship this year why would anyone want to mess with that.

James Harden is a very good young player but I think there are alot of guys in the league that can take his spot he is not irreplaceable. Obviously if you don't need to give him up you wouldn't though.

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BK

I agree with you wholeheartedly in your second post; Why trade Harden, when you realistically don't have to?

I like the trade as first proposed.

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The Thunder clearly get the

The Thunder clearly get the better value, i think you have to throw there James Harden to make this trade reasonable, but then it's much less yummy for OKC.

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the thing is Chris Paul might

the thing is Chris Paul might just leave and NOH won't get anything, so if they do a trade their not going to get equal value back in return.

kobyz
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still think they could get

still think they could get better, if Hornets gonna give Chris Paul for much less valuable player, they should get at least one more quality piece for the future.

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still think they could get

still think they could get better, if Hornets gonna give Chris Paul for much less valuable player, they should get at least one more quality piece for the future.

Make up a more realistic trade then? That's all I ask.....

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There is no way OKC gives up

There is no way OKC gives up Westbrook AND Harden. Harden is a very special player. I dont see any other team giving up someone as young and talented as Westbrook is either. Its Westbrook + salary fillers (Nate and Mullens)

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With Paul, the Thunder will

With Paul, the Thunder will STILL only have two legit scorers in the starting lineup with Harden being a solid 6th man off the bench with Serge Ibaka as a wildcard.

Putting Thabo off the bench would give the Thunder less scoring punch off it.

Westbrook is more explosive and better around the rim than Chris Paul. He is the league's only potential answer for Derrick Rose.

They would still need a 3rd scorer either starting or bringing off the bench. With Perkins and Thabo they start two guys who can't really score. And Ibaka is spotty.

I think they need to look at bringing back Jeff Green and Big Baby to bolster their bench.

What they really need is a player like Iggy or Josh Smith. Not to swap one top 5 point guard (on the rise) for another top 5 point guard (on the decline).

One weakness they do have is a real lack of a scoring threat inside. Ibaka, Perkins, and Collison aren't really guys that you double team. They have great wing scorers (Durant, Westbrook, Harden, Cook) with Durant and Cook also being great outside shooters but they lack a guy they can go to inside to get them some points. ... Big Baby would help inside and they might not have to give up a whole lot to get him. Jeff Green would be a decent sub to go along with the Harden/Big Baby unit off the bench. Good 8 man rotation there. ... they could also use a veteran point guard to come in off the bench for 10-15 minutes a night, handle the ball and hit jumpers. They need to ask about Derek Fisher. Maybe throw 2 or 3 second round picks and some cash LA's way.

BKKnicksfan
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Disagree 100 percent Memphis,

Disagree 100 percent Memphis, here's why:

Chris Paul is more pure point guard. He'd average maybe around 20 and then help boost the scoring of Ibaka, using him as a Chandler type and Harden, who could be a 15-17 point scorer.

Thabo comes off the bench, but don't forget about DaQuan Cook, who could be a 5-7 point scorer off the bench as well.

Westbrook might be the answer against Derrick Rose, but he and Durant are clearly having issues, and you have to at least consider him.

Again, you can do Thabo starting and have Harden and Cook as scorers off the bench, or find a solid scorer in the 2011 draft and/or FA

They don't need Big Baby NOR Jeff Green. Someone cheaper.

Chris Paul is NOWHERE near the decline son.

They lack scoring inside because Ibaka is young. He's developing.

Don't need Derek Fisher.

kobyz
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"Make up a more realistic

"Make up a more realistic trade then? That's all I ask....."

maybe the Grizzlis will offer Rudy Gay and Mike Conley...

BKKnicksfan
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maybe the Grizzlis will offer

maybe the Grizzlis will offer Rudy Gay and Mike Conley...

Niether of them are better then Russell Westbrook.

kobyz
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"Niether of them are better

"Niether of them are better then Russell Westbrook."

i'm not sure Rudy Gay is that far from him but anyway it's clearly a much better package than the Westbrook package!!!

BKKnicksfan
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i'm not sure Rudy Gay is that

i'm not sure Rudy Gay is that far from him but anyway it's clearly a much better package than the Westbrook package!!!

No it's not. With the Westbrook package, you get cap space, a 1st round pick and a 22 year old star. Why lock yourself with Gay's 5 year contract and Conley's 6 year contract? Westbrook would be safer and allows NOH to save up some cap and rebuild around Westbrook.

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@Knicksboy This is the most

@Knicksboy

This is the most points you ever recieved from a trade idea lol

BKKnicksfan
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I know. I still think that

I know. I still think that other deal was good, but I'll let it go lol

Calipari
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Interesting

As a Thunder fan, I would at least ponder the initial scenario, but you throw in Harden and no way. People forget he merited selection 3rd overall in a strong draft. Some like to say that he hasn't panned out, but he's not the flashy type, and he will continually gain more responsibility. In this manner, the development of Harden will also aid Westbrook's development, so giving up on both for Paul would be over-the top. Paul could help Ibaka, but offense would still be squarely on Durant's shoulders. Remember, this is the Thunder's second playoff appearance, and Westbrook and the core are all still incredibly young. If I'm Sam Presti I can't even consider making a major shakeup until after next season. This trade scenarion is interesting but unlikely, and might not really aid either team. Give the Thunder some time.

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People forget he merited

People forget he merited selection 3rd overall in a strong draft.

No he didn't. In fact, he was a lock pick there. One, that draft was considered weak until the season started and Jennings/Evans blew up early. Two, Harden was a stud, who many people forget stocked dropped, then went back up because he crapped himself in two NCAA games, one against Syracuse.

Calipari
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?

Wait, wait? You quote me stating Harden's merit in being picked, disagree, then state that he was a lock pick? The contradiction in your statement is nearly hysterical, and only goes to showcase someone who is hellbent on, for some reason, disagreeing and arguing with others. Again, you state the draft class was weak until the season started, but we now have the luxury of further evaluating the draft class because its been two &$#%#&@! years since it happened. Again, you state that "Harden was a stud", whose stock dropped, resulting in selection 3rd overall? Are you proposing that he was worthy of consideration along with Blake Griffin for the first overall selection? Because if your not, then you have not just me, but everyone lost. I'm not sure what type of basketball you follow, but it is clearly not the same game that everyone else is. Or the other possibility, as mentioned earlier, is your determination to quote others in a negative manner, with no backing or support whatsoever. I have never seen contructive contributions from your account to any meaningful discussion, and I am appaled to see you spend time in such a pointless, and pitiful manner. Please get your facts straight, take a clear position, and contribute something worthy to a discussion for once.

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I think it would take

I think it would take Westbrook and Harden. But OKC should still absolutely do it, and New Orleans should absolutely consider it. Westbrook isnt even close to CP3 but he could potentially carry a team on his own and hes the best "consolation prize" you can get for him most likely.

BKKnicksfan
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I think it would take

I think it would take Westbrook and Harden.

I keep asking this: Why?

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CP3 is alot better than

CP3 is alot better than Westbrook.

Not hard to figure out...

BKKnicksfan
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Yes, but Paul isn't that much

Yes, but Paul isn't that much better that it would take another young player to get him.

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Yes he is. Throwing in BJ

Yes he is. Throwing in BJ Mullins and Nate Rob is just throwing in dead weight.

New Orleans isnt stupid. They arent just gonna swap a straight downgrade. CP3 dominates the PG position, is the best passer in the league, is clutch, and an excellent defender. Westbrook is nothing more than the homeless man's Derrick Rose.

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Yes he is. Throwing in BJ

Yes he is. Throwing in BJ Mullins and Nate Rob is just throwing in dead weight.

- No he is not. Also, Robinson is a exp contract next season that you can get a good draft pick and/or another decent player for and Mullins is a potential big down the line.

New Orleans isnt stupid. They arent just gonna swap a straight downgrade. CP3 dominates the PG position, is the best passer in the league, is clutch, and an excellent defender. Westbrook is nothing more than the homeless man's Derrick Rose.

- You don't downgrade by doing that, you rebuild. Rebuilding with one of the top 20 players in the league under a rookie contract WITH cap space and TWO picks in a loaded draft isn't downgrading at all.

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Really dude? OKC's 2012 pick?

Really dude? OKC's 2012 pick? Whats that gonna be? 27-30? BJ Mullins is a clown...you cant show me anything since high school that proves otherwise. And yea Westbrook is on a rookie contract. Going into his 4th season. You think hes gonna resign with this team? Do you not understand how horrible New Orlean's roster is 2-12?

BKKnicksfan
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Really dude? OKC's 2012 pick?

Really dude? OKC's 2012 pick? Whats that gonna be? 27-30? BJ Mullins is a clown...you cant show me anything since high school that proves otherwise. And yea Westbrook is on a rookie contract. Going into his 4th season. You think hes gonna resign with this team? Do you not understand how horrible New Orlean's roster is 2-12?

But a extra 2012 pick is a extra pick. Should we look in the past 5-10 seasons of late 1st/2nd round guys who contritbuted and still do work in the NBA? Mullins hasn't played in the NBA much, he's a project, but so was guys like Aaron Gray and such. Development is key. Oklahoma City has 4-5 good bigs, he isn't gonna play for them, might as well ask for him and see if he can pay off. Westbrook is going into his 4th season, in a league where you can offer him the most money with him as a recristed FA ( so you're gonna keep him anyway) and potentially a franchise tag.

Also, David West, Emaka Okafor, Jarrett Jack aren't bad players. Throw in Westbrook, maybe a high 2012 pick and a low 2012 pick and a couple cap steals, New Orleans could be back on the road to rebuilding.

kobyz
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"No it's not. With the

"No it's not. With the Westbrook package, you get cap space, a 1st round pick and a 22 year old star. Why lock yourself with Gay's 5 year contract and Conley's 6 year contract? Westbrook would be safer and allows NOH to save up some cap and rebuild around Westbrook."

are you serious?! you react like Westbrook is somthing bigger then what he is, you forgot he has significants holes to his game, to take him from being the sidekick of Durant and to put him as a team franchise player will only reveal more of his weaknesses.

Mike Conley is much more pure PG, better leader, made a huge progress the last year and crack the top 10 nba PG list, his contract is very worthy.

Rudy Gay is a star player in this league few season already, this year until his injury he even show improvment from years past, you won't find much better talent than him on the wing, he is still very young and has room to grow, same for Conley.

you need to understand somthing, NOH, being from the smallest market, it's a good thing to lock themselves to long contracts of two young promise players who are proven and are great pieces for the future, for team like this it much better than cap space as it's not attractive place for free agents and probably they will not find better talent than this.

also Rudy Gay and Mike Conley are only the basis of my package, i also could throw a draft pick, or maybe even to add Trevor Ariza in extend for OJ Mayo, and then i would put together very strong team for the future for New Orleans, very pleased Hornets team post Chris Paul , much better than the Westbrook package could have made:

Mike Conley/Jarrett Jack
OJ Mayo/Marco Belinelli/Willie Green
Rudy Gay/Quincy Pondexter
David West/Carl Landry/David Andersen
Emeka Okafor/Jason Smith/Aaron Gray

BKKnicksfan
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All my opinion are BOLD are

All my opinion are BOLD

are you serious?! you react like Westbrook is somthing bigger then what he is, you forgot he has significants holes to his game, to take him from being the sidekick of Durant and to put him as a team franchise player will only reveal more of his weaknesses.

- Russell Westbrook is a top 15 player in the NBA, and better then both Gay and Conley. Yes he has weaknesses, but is more a complete package then Conley or Gay

Mike Conley is much more pure PG, better leader, made a huge progress the last year and crack the top 10 nba PG list, his contract is very worthy.

- One, pure point guard who isn't that good. He's still average IMO.

Also: Derrick Rose, Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Russell Westbrook, Brandon Jennings, Stephen Curry, John Wall, Rajon Rondo, Tony Parker, Steve Nash and Darren Collison are all better point guard then Conley

Rudy Gay is a star player in this league few season already, this year until his injury he even show improvment from years past, you won't find much better talent than him on the wing, he is still very young and has room to grow, same for Conley.

- Russell Westbrook has been a star for 3 seaosns now. He's 24 years old, his game is pretty much what it is now. Same for Conley, they are both solid players, Gay is a star, but that's about it. Conley will not be a all star at any point.

you need to understand somthing, NOH, being from the smallest market, it's a good thing to lock themselves to long contracts of two young promise players who are proven and are great pieces for the future, for team like this it much better than cap space as it's not attractive place for free agents and probably they will not find better talent than this.

- They don't need to lock into TWO big contracts. You can save with Westbrook THEN build around him and another set of players. Plus, you're gonna get Westbrook for another 5-7 seasons thanks to RFA and a potential franchise tag.

also Rudy Gay and Mike Conley are only the basis of my package, i also could throw a draft pick, or maybe even to add Trevor Ariza in extend for OJ Mayo, and then i would put together very strong team for the future for New Orleans, very pleased Hornets team post Chris Paul , much better than the Westbrook package could have made:

- Memphis can do better then Ariza for Mayo.

BKKnicksfan
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Wait, wait? You quote me

Wait, wait? You quote me stating Harden's merit in being picked, disagree, then state that he was a lock pick? The contradiction in your statement is nearly hysterical, and only goes to showcase someone who is hellbent on, for some reason, disagreeing and arguing with others

- I honestly couldn't change it. What I meant was this:

Harden was the 3rd pick, not because he was the 3rd best player in the draft, but because he was the best fit, and the safest pick for Oklahoma City. He had 2 stud like seasons, but he struggled in his NCAA Tourney game, in which his stock dropped. Then, he didn't have any great workouts, but his stock went right back up because guys like Greg Monroe, Al Faoqu Aminu, Ed Davis ( who had top 5 status back then) Evan Turner and Cole Aldrich stayed in school. He was never the 3rd best guy, just the best fit. Sorry for the confusion.

Or the other possibility, as mentioned earlier, is your determination to quote others in a negative manner, with no backing or support whatsoever. I have never seen contructive contributions from your account to any meaningful discussion, and I am appaled to see you spend time in such a pointless, and pitiful manner. Please get your facts straight, take a clear position, and contribtue something worthy to a discussion for once.

I never contribute in conversations? Alright buddy, point is....you came back to debate with me. I must be doing something right I guess...

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I respect...

I'm thankful for the reply to clear up the confusion, as I understand your point. The second line in which you quote me is merely frustration related to your action of only quoting me and arguing, rather than providing and initiating other points of opinion. I am glad that both of us care enough to clear this debate up, and I can assure you that my return to revoke your statement towards me has greater motivation in my standing up and articulating my ideas rather than the need to simply argue with you. I hope to continue to discuss our opinions, and in referencing your contributions to the site I was showcasing dissapointment in what I perceived as mainly negative and sometimes abrasive rebuttals of other's ideas, for no reasons other than the sake of arguing.

Thank You

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"- One, pure point guard who

"- One, pure point guard who isn't that good. He's still average IMO.

Also: Derrick Rose, Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Russell Westbrook, Brandon Jennings, Stephen Curry, John Wall, Rajon Rondo, Tony Parker, Steve Nash and Darren Collison are all better point guard then Conley"

he is very good PG, maybe not flashy or superstar, but does all what PG should do, very complete PG, make winning plays and gets the job done, with him you get a qualty PG position without holes. and this is my top 10 btw:

1) Chris Paul

2) Derrick Rose

3) Deron Williams

4) Russell Westbrook

5) Rajon Rondo

6) Tony Parker

7) John Wall

8) Steve Nash

9) Mike Conley

10) Devin Harris

"- They don't need to lock into TWO big contracts. You can save with Westbrook THEN build around him and another set of players. Plus, you're gonna get Westbrook for another 5-7 seasons thanks to RFA and a potential franchise tag."

hard to belive as being from the smallest market they gonna get better set of players then what they get with my offer, also with Okafor contract on the book and re-sign David West, they will not have nuch money to spend.

"- Memphis can do better then Ariza for Mayo."

it's not Ariza for Mayo, it's part of a trade for Chris Paul, a top 3 player in the NBA.

BKKnicksfan
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Brandon Jennings, Stephen

Brandon Jennings, Stephen Curry and Darren Collison are better then Devin Harris and Mike Conley. Don't kid yourself.

They can sign West to a one year deal and see how he recovers from ACL surgery, and Okafor is coming off the books next offseason if I'm correct

Chris Paul isn't a top 3 player in the NBA, nor would Memphis give up Mayo for Ariza. Even then, Russell Westbrook is better then Mayo, Gay and Conley.

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so we disagree on a lot of

so we disagree on a lot of things

BKKnicksfan
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Yea, we disagree, but I feel

Yea, we disagree, but I feel you can't backup your statements to be honest.

How is Conley and Harris better then Collison,Curry and Jennings?

WHY would Memphis break up this team and move it's only potential star and a average point guard for a great point guard and in getting the great point guard, move the best piece to go with him?

Why would New Orleans want two players locked up, when they can go for the young franchise point guard, who will be there another 5-7 seasons?

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"How is Conley and Harris

"How is Conley and Harris better then Collison,Curry and Jennings?"

right now i feel Conley is better then those 3 second year players, they still somewhat raw and not complete players as Conley who has develop a great basketball understanding. as for Harris you can argue on that, but i think he has a little more impact.

"WHY would Memphis break up this team and move it's only potential star and a average point guard for a great point guard and in getting the great point guard, move the best piece to go with him?"

cause they become better, anytime you trade for a top 3 player you made sacrifices, but that give them a chance to become contender:

Chris Paul/Greivis Vasquez/Ishmael Smith
Tony Allen/Sam Young/Xavier Henry
Trevor Ariza/Shane Battier
Zach Randolph/Darrell Arthur/Leon Powe
Marc Gasol/Hamed Haddadi

"Why would New Orleans want two players locked up, when they can go for the young franchise point guard, who will be there another 5-7 seasons?"

i already answer so I will not return on this.

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Huh?

Why would New Orleans want two players locked up, when they can go for the young franchise point guard, who will be there another 5-7 seasons?

Wait, why have two players locked up already, when you can have one prospectively locked up?

What?

BKKnicksfan
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Wait, why have two players

Wait, why have two players locked up already, when you can have one prospectively locked up?

Yes, why have two players, both overpaid and one is a average player, when you can dish the money out other way and have instead one player under the max? I said it right.

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