[kanyedabestParticipant]

I was just on espn and noticed robert griffin ( QB of Baylor ) has officially made mel kipers "big board" but its an espn insider article. Anyone with espn insider that could post that article? It would be greatly appreciated

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft2012/story?id=7092755&_slug_=2012-nfl-draft-big-board-adds-robert-griffin-iii&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl%2fdraft2012%2fstory%3fid%3d7092755%26_slug_%3d2012-nfl-draft-big-board-adds-robert-griffin-iii

[ilike.panochasParticipant]

R.Griffin is an incredible QB prospect. We’ve seen elite athlete playing QBs in college before such as Vick, Vince Young, Cam Newton, etc, but this guy has become a pocket passer who just happens to run sub 4.4. He relies on his arm more than his legs and he’s a pretty darn good passer, almost to Andrew Luck’s level as a passer.

[Lotto StudParticipant]

I don’t have the insider, but I do have Kiper’s updated BB if it helps anyone who does not have it also.

1-Andrew Luck
2-Quinton Coples
3-Matt Kalil
4-Landry Jones
5-Justin Blackmon
6-Jonathan Martin
7-Trent Richardson
8-Riley Reiff
9-Alshon Jeffery
10-Matt Barkley
11-Vontaze Burfict
12-Morris Claiborne
13-Manti T’eo
14-Luke Kuechly
15-Brandon Thompson
16-Jerel Worthy
17-Ronnell Lewis
18-Jared Crick
19-Cordy Glenn
20-Courtney Upshaw
21-Janoris Jenkins
22-Bruce Irvin
23-Dre Kirkpatrick
24-Brandon Jenkins
25-Stephon Gilmore

 

 

[apb540Participant]

Is that your opinion of RGIII or is it something Kiper said? Cuz who ever said it, I disagree with the statement about his passing compared to Luck’s.

[TRC1991Participant]

why cant u make the comparison?

 

Griffin: 1520 yards, 19 td, 1 int, 80% completion

Luck: 1383 yards, 14 td, 2 int, 73% completion

[ilike.panochasParticipant]

It’s my opinion from what I’ve seen from his games, and it’s echoed by pretty much every NFL draft scouts. Griffin may not surpass Luck as the #1 QB in this class, but he has pretty much locked up the #2 position as the 2nd best QB in this draft. If you want to know how accurate a passer Griffin is, consider this, his biggest strengths as a passer is his deep ball and intermediate passes, which is what is required to be a starting NFL QB, he’s different from other spread offense QBs (Cam Newton, Vince Young, Tebow, Colt McCoy) because he has no problem driving the ball down the field with great accuracy. Andrew Luck has better pocket precense than Griffin, but if you were to ask me who is more accurate, I would say Luck, but not by much.

[frogmanParticipant]

Almost to Andrew Luck’s level as a passer? are u insane? If that was indeed the case Griffin would be the most hyped prospect in NFL history with his athletic ability.  1st of all he actually spends about 5% of his plays passing from the pocket and i don’t think hes ever taken the ball from under center.  He’s good but come on.  The fact that Cam Newton has adapted so well to the NFL will help is draft stock though

[ilike.panochasParticipant]

College QBs not taking the ball under center are still BIG issues when playing in the NFL? Guys like Sam Bradford, Colt McCoy, Cam Newton, Andy Dalton to name a few have adjusted just fine despite limited training camp due to lockout. If you can throw the ball, it doesn’t matter wether you snap the ball under center or shotgun, that is something that can be taught and make adjustments.

If you ask me who has better deep ball,Luck or Griffin, I will tell you Griffin is better. Intermediate throws, both are about equal, and pocket awareness I will give the edge to Luck. Luck is better passer, but not by a wide margin as everyone makes it out to be. As far as hype, Griffin is just now getting recognition, because he wasn’t exactly on everyone’s preseason Heisman list to begin the year, so ofcourse he doesn’t bring the same hype as Luck, who has build up his name since last season.

[kanyedabestParticipant]

and actually griffin has been a star since his freshman year, so its not like hes coming out of no where… ask a big 12 fan and they will tell you hes been wrecking havoc for a while now, had it not been for a torn acl he would have been in the national spotlight way earlier.

and @ mess ee, its good to see another person with a good football  mind

[JNixonParticipant]

 Yeah Robert Griffin is a great talent. He’s been very good since he stepped foot on Baylor’s campus, and he’s been a darkhorse Heisman candidate since he was a Soph. (more and more people are looking out for him now though). I watched him against TCU and about 2 weeks ago against KState. I will say this.  He throws the deep ball as well as any QB in the country that I’ve seen, with GREAT touch, accuracy, and more than enough arm strength. Him and Kendall Wright (a thin, but really quick receiver) have a really good chemistry and they can attack you at all 3 levels. He’s an athletic pocket passer, which is something I’d want from my QB especially since he looks to throw more than take off and make plays with his feet and he’s patient in his reads (at times to a fault). He does a great job of reading the safety, but he has a raw understanding of how to attack the 2nd level of the D at times and if his 1st option on intermediate throws gets cut off or well defended he can hold the ball too long at times, although he has the athleticism to scramble for yardage more often than not. His field vision is decent, but not great right now, and sometimes he doesn’t sense backside pressure well which can neutralize his athleticism and speed at times and lead to unnecessary sacks. He also needs to spend more time in the weight room, as he doesn’t have the frame to take a bunch of hits and it could cause him to be injury prone in either the short or long term. I think he’s the 2nd best QB prospect for this upcoming class, him or Landry Jones probably.

[Cardinal_FanParticipant]

 I’m a big fan of RGIII and also believe he is on the same level as Luck as of right now. Imo RGIII plays in a tougher conference and also put up better numbers with less talent. And it is amazuing that he has turned him self from a run 1st guy 2 a very accurate QB with a very good arm. Im not here 2 say that he will challenege luck for the #1 spot but i am willing to go otut on a limb an say ecspecially with the play of Cam Newton that he will surpass Matt Barkely as the #2 QB prospect. When the combine comes and workouts and interviews follow and people get 2 sit RGIII down and see what a great kid he is 2 his stock will rise.

[llperez]

so who do you guys like to be the better pro between griffin and luck?

[Hi its BenParticipant]

lol and i thought Iggy was only an amazing nba prospect evaluator

[JNixonParticipant]

 I actually might know football better than basketball lol, I’ve been around football my whole life basically and I come from a football family, even though I’ve never played organized football in my life.

But I think Andrew Luck is going to be in for a better NFL career between him and Griffin III. Luck has a better understanding of how to read the defense at all 3 levels and he’s more effective in reading the D at more than just the deep half of the field. Luck’s feel for the pocket will make him a better QB in the long run, his understanding of the game and IQ will allow him to be the best QB in the class. He should be an elite QB in the NFL in time. He’s also an athletic pocket passer, but with NFL ready size too.

[WizardofOzParticipant]

 RGIII is the closest thing to Michaell Vick, but he doesn’t have Vick’s freakish arm strength.

[Lotto StudParticipant]

"RGIII is the closest thing to Michaell Vick, but he doesn’t have Vick’s freakish arm strength"

HELL F*CKIN NO!!!!! Tyrod "T-Mobile" Taylor is the closest thing to Vick! That’s his protege`

[JNixonParticipant]

 Tyrod Taylor is not even close to Mike Vick. Robert Griffin is more comparable than Taylor is, especially in regards to their NFL futures.

[providencefriars1Participant]

Tyrod Taylor is like a poor mans Troy Smith. As Jnix said not even close to Vick

[mikeyvthedonParticipant]

He is having an absolutely tremendous season, that is for sure. Close to 80% passing and a 22/2 ratio, this kid can ball. But, I do not see the Vick comparisons. The guy is fast, he was great at track in HS, but I think that Vick’s speed was just on another level. As WizardofOz said, Griffin does not have the arm strength of Vick either, but he does not have Vick’s speed. That being said, Griffin’s accuracy and pocket ability have been fantastic, which is one thing Vick has had trouble with. Vick was great at this last year for the most part, but he has struggled this year.

Still, I am pretty apprehensive in calling Griffin a QB of Vick’s caliber. I realize Baylor’s offense is incredibly different from the option based offense Vick played in college, but you have not really seen Griffin kill people with his legs. Quite obviously you do not want to have to run to much as a QB, but if he is not running a lot in college, how is he going to do it any more or more efficiently in the NFL?

Robert Griffin has run pretty darn well during his college career, and even for more yards than Vick ever did in his freshman year. The thing is, he does not do it as efficiently. His yards per carry have always been under 5, where as Vick and Cam Newton were well over that total. Vick is always a complete threat, and if Griffin runs a 4.4, than Vick probably runs in the low 4.3’s. Either way, Vick has a burst no other QB who could play the position at the NFL level ever has had. Newton of course has ridiculous size and has shown early ability in running the football at the NFL level, which surprised me, but he has been very impressive. My question is, will Griffin really be the same type of threat as either of these players, who he seems to have been compared to due to his speed?

Griffin more than likely will leave after this year, and I have a feeling he is looking at the first round or close to that range. Still, I feel like Andrew Luck is far and away the best QB prospect. My brother and I refer to Luck as "Jake Locker if he did something in college". This guy is not just a great QB, he is a monster athlete. He will not be a major runner in the Vick or Newton angle, but he should get his Aaron Rodgers scramble on every once in a while. The guy is built like a LB as well, he can dish it out.

Whether Griffin is better than guys like Landry Jones and Matt Barkley, I am not sure. As of right now, both of those guys look to be really high draft picks and have a fantastic pocket presence. I do not see Griffin as a Vick, Newton or Young though, and I guess I am weary of his sub 4.4 speed. Even if he has it, his arm is the most important thing for his draft position. I know that Terrelle Pryor was right in the 4.4 range, and is huge, but he just does not have the strongest of arms. Griffin seems to be a very intriguing QB prospect, but I guess I am not completely sold that he is a NFL prospect on the level of QB’s who were seen as dual threats. Ridiculous college player, but that does not necessarily translate to the NFL level directly. I am definitely rooting for him, but I guess I am not totally sold on him being in the class of two guys picked #1 and another picked #3.

[JayhawkFan23Participant]

Originally Published: October 12, 2011

Big Board adds Robert Griffin III

The Baylor quarterback is getting Heisman love, but NFL scouts are also impressed

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By Mel Kiper
ESPN Insider
Archive

People like to make a big deal about completion percentage. And they should, to the extent that you know the kinds of throws a quarterback is making. And while some may point to Robert Griffin III completing an astonishing 80.3 percent of passes this year as evidence of a dramatic jump in his accuracy, I’d point out something else: accuracy was never a big issue. After all, last year Griffin was at 67.0 percent, and was well above 60 percent for his career headed into this year. What has changed is an improved delivery, and the demonstration that he can throw the deep ball accurately. In some college offenses, short passing completely dominates, and the stats can tell you close to nothing. You really have to go through a lot of tape and see what kinds of throws a kid can make. For Griffin, even the stats back it up: his YPA has jumped to 10.70. He was never higher than 7.83 going into 2011.

 

 

Combine Griffin’s overall growth with his brilliant athleticism, leadership and smarts and you have a prospect on the rise. He makes his first Big Board appearance this week, and is a guy on the radar of NFL scouts. He now has some showcase games to back it up. Read on and let me know who you think should be higher. As always, juniors and draft-eligible sophomores are noted with an asterisk.

 

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1

Andrew Luck *

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 9/12/89

HT: 6-4

WT: 235

POS: QB

 

 

Comp 106

Att 145

Pct 73.1

Yds 1,383

TD 14

Int 2

A great year so far, but even he is probably dying for a challenge. Schedule really light thus far. He’s the total package. Arm strength, size, smarts, demeanor. A safe bet to be No. 1 overall.

LAST WEEK: 1 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

 

2

Quinton Coples

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 6/22/90

HT: 6-6

WT: 285

POS: DE

 

 

Tkl 22

Sack 2.5

Int 0

Sack totals aren’t piling up, but the blocking attention is, and they’re off to a good start. He’s a gifted pass-rusher suited to be a pure 4-3 defensive end at the next level.

LAST WEEK: 2 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

 

 

3

Matt Kalil *

 

AGE: 22

DOB: 7/6/89

HT: 6-7

WT: 295

POS: OT

 

 

GP 5

GS 5

Kalil has the size, athleticism, footwork and bloodlines. He projects as a blindside tackle. Unfortunately, beyond him, the USC offensive line has looked really inexperienced so far this season; still manages to look good.

LAST WEEK: 3 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

 

4

Landry Jones *

 

AGE: 22

DOB: 4/22/89

HT: 6-4

WT: 229

POS: QB

 

 

Comp 142

Att 205

Pct 69.3

Yds 1,814

TD 13

Int 5

Great showcase game in Dallas. Jones has been a big numbers producer, but I like the way he’s battled in some tough games so far in 2011. He has good size and a strong arm and has fantastic accuracy.

LAST WEEK: 4 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

 

5

Justin Blackmon *

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 1/9/90

HT: 6-1

WT: 208

POS: WR

 

 

Rec 46

Yds 534

Avg 11.6

TD 6

Huge games await for Blackmon, a better prospect than recent OSU star Dez Bryant. Versatile and explosive and really works to get open. Great ball skills; breaks tackles. Exceptional work ethic; keeps getting better.

LAST WEEK: 5 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

 

 

 

6

Jonathan Martin *

 

AGE: 22

DOB: 7/6/89

HT: 6-6

WT: 304

POS: OT

 

 

GP 5

GS 5

Watched all year as the guy protecting the back of the likely No. 1 overall pick, Martin is more an athlete now than a run-blocker. Great feet for the left side, however, and not lacking power.

LAST WEEK: 6 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

7

Trent Richardson *

 

AGE: 20

DOB: 7/10/91

HT: 5-11

WT: 224

POS: RB

 

 

Car 115

Yds 729

Avg 6.3

TD 11

Shot to be a rare top-10 pick at running back. Developing consistency and improving in reading blocks while using better pad level. Powerful through the hole; bounces off tackles with ease.

LAST WEEK: 7 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

8

Riley Reiff *

 

AGE: 22

DOB: 12/1/88

HT: 6-6

WT: 300

POS: OT

 

 

GP 5

GS 5

Reiff has been solid so far in 2011 and has probably the best tape of any left tackle so far. Durable, he has played from day one at Iowa. Gets under the pads of defenders very effectively. Complete player.

LAST WEEK: 8 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

9

Alshon Jeffery *

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 2/14/90

HT: 6-4

WT: 233

POS: WR

 

 

Rec 25

Yds 427

Avg 17.1

TD 4

Has shined through quarterback mess down there. An imposing presence, he’s a matchup nightmare. Phenomenal hands, surprising burst for a long strider — not quick, but doesn’t get run down from behind.

LAST WEEK: 9 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

10

Matt Barkley *

 

AGE: 20

DOB: 9/8/90

HT: 6-2

WT: 220

POS: QB

 

 

Comp 133

Att 188

Pct 70.7

Yds 1,587

TD 14

Int 4

I like his overall accuracy, and he had a nice bounce-back game this week. He has shown a great growth curve in his three years, and throws a nice ball, particularly on the move. Good, not great, arm.

LAST WEEK: 10 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

11

Luke Kuechly *

 

AGE: 20

DOB: 4/20/91

HT: 6-3

WT: 237

POS: LB

 

 

Tkl 99

Sack 0.0

Int 1

Currently No. 1 interior linebacker. Kuechly has been good amid a disappointing season. Dependable, a tackling machine, he makes great reads, sees the play develop and sheds blockers well. Exceptional instincts.

LAST WEEK: 14 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

12

Morris Claiborne *

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 2/7/90

HT: 6-1

WT: 185

POS: CB

 

 

Tkl 24

Sack 0

Int 2

Great so far in 2011, he’s jumped more than any corner. There’s no way around it. He’s just an exceptional pure cover corner with impeccable instincts at the position. He’s not a total burner but should run well.

LAST WEEK: 12 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

13

Manti Te’o *

 

AGE: 20

DOB: 1/26/91

HT: 6-2

WT: 255

POS: LB

 

 

Tkl 54

Sack 4.0

Int 0

Te’o has risen this year and is challenging Burfict for top interior linebacker. He’s making a ton of tackles in the middle of the field but with range to the sideline, and he has added blitzing skills. A rugged player with ideal size.

LAST WEEK: 13 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

14

Vontaze Burfict *

 

AGE: 20

DOB: 9/24/90

HT: 6-3

WT: 250

POS: LB

 

 

Tkl 29

Sack 4.0

Int 1

Huge game in Eugene for Burfict. He has great instincts, makes plays sideline to sideline and is far more disciplined than he gets credit for. Has a ton of experience since landing at ASU.

LAST WEEK: 11 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

15

Brandon Thompson

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 10/19/89

HT: 6-2

WT: 310

POS: DT

 

 

Tkl 22

Sack 0.5

Int 0

Has been consistent as Clemson has gotten off to an exciting start. Scheme-versatile, Thompson might not get the sacks but can get his share of penetration. Excels at reading, plugging running lanes.

LAST WEEK: 15 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

16

Ronnell Lewis *

 

AGE: 22

DOB: 1/1/89

HT: 6-2

WT: 244

POS: LB

 

 

Tkl 32

Sack 3.5

Int 0

Showed plenty against Texas after a so-so start to the year. A DE at Oklahoma, he’ll take his elite athleticism to outside linebacker at the next level. Too quick for many tackles, he should pile up sacks in a 3-4 scheme.

LAST WEEK: 17 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

17

Cordy Glenn

 

AGE: 22

DOB: 9/18/89

HT: 6-5

WT: 348

POS: T/G

 

 

GP 6

GS 6

Really experienced player who has lined up everywhere for the Bulldogs. Glenn is massive and athletic enough for tackle, but I can see him being moved inside as a potentially dominant guard.

LAST WEEK: 19 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

18

Courtney Upshaw

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 12/13/89

HT: 6-2

WT: 265

POS: LB

 

 

Tkl 18

Sack 1.5

Int 1

Moving up into discussion for top 10. Should convert to 3-4 outside linebacker at the next level. Great leverage player who uses hands well and battles well against the run. LaMarr Woodley is a comparison.

LAST WEEK: 20 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

19

Robert Griffin III *

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 2/12/90

HT: 6-1

WT: 220

POS: QB

 

 

Comp 114

Att 142

Pct 80.3

Yds 1,520

TD 19

Int 1

Super athletic and has altered and improved his delivery, resulting in better accuracy on downfield throws. Smart kid who will shine during interviews. No ill effects from 2009 knee injury. Showcase games await.

LAST WEEK: NR | PLAYER CARD

 

 

20

Jerel Worthy *

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 4/28/90

HT: 6-3

WT: 310

POS: DT

 

 

Tkl 10

Sack 2.0

Int 0

Had questioned him, but was dominant at Ohio State two weeks ago. Disruptive defensive tackle in a class that’s a little shallower. Has good size and is tough to move — just needs consistency.

LAST WEEK: 16 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

21

Janoris Jenkins

 

AGE: 22

DOB: 10/29/88

HT: 5-10

WT: 177

POS: CB

 

 

Tkl 35

Sack 0

Int 1

Quick as a cat with fluid hips and very good instincts for the position. He’s a man among boys now at the Division II level with 4.4-second 40 speed. Has been dynamic as a punt returner this year.

LAST WEEK: 21 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

22

Jared Crick

 

AGE: 22

DOB: 8/21/89

HT: 6-6

WT: 285

POS: DT

 

 

Tkl 22

Sack 1.0

Int 0

A chest injury will sideline the talented Crick for the year. It was just announced, so he’ll likely drop on this list. But will leave for now to reflect where he is at the time of injury.

LAST WEEK: 18 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

23

Dre Kirkpatrick *

 

AGE: 21

DOB: 10/26/89

HT: 6-3

WT: 192

POS: CB

 

 

Tkl 14

Sack 0

Int 0

A big, physical corner, he has long arms and strong hands. Also has great length for the position. Solid in run support but must work on turning his head in coverage. Solid week at Florida.

LAST WEEK: 23 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

24

Bruce Irvin

 

AGE: 20

DOB: 11/1/89

HT: 6-3

WT: 245

POS: LB

 

 

Tkl 21

Sack 2.5

Int 0

Among national leaders in sacks in 2010 with 14.0, Irvin is explosive up the field and has decent countermoves. He’s also seeing more attention. Fits as a 3-4 OLB at the next level.

LAST WEEK: 22 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

25

Stephon Gilmore *

 

AGE: 20

DOB: 9/19/90

HT: 6-1

WT: 193

POS: CB

 

 

Tkl 27

Sack 0

Int 2

Another SEC corner with good size, Gilmore has played well against some top competition. Well-schooled, he has a chance to move up my board this season.

LAST WEEK: 25 | PLAYER CARD

 

 

 

Mel Kiper has been the premier name in NFL draft prospect evaluations for more than three decades. He started putting out his annual draft guides in 1978 and started contributing to ESPN as an analyst in 1984. For more from Mel, check out his annual draft publications or his home page. He can also be found on Twitter here.

 

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[Lotto StudParticipant]

I am actually surprised that you posted on this thread without complaining that it is a bball forum & that he should have put this thread in another forum.

[Author]

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