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PROOF That NBA Teams Don't Know Anything About Young European Players

European Baller
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PROOF That NBA Teams Don't Know Anything About Young European Players

Today, while I was watching the CSKA - Olympiacos Euroleague game, the announcers said,

"Some officials from CSKA told us that several NBA teams have offered contracts to Milos Teodosic and Alexey Shved, but only since after they were no longer eligible for the NBA Draft. When they were eligible for the NBA Draft, not a single NBA team showed any interest in them.

As the CSKA officials told us, this is typical of the NBA, they have no interest at all in any young European player unless he is presonally working out for them every summer, which is not even possible for players that are in playoff runs and have national team duties. Then after the fact, when they realize they missed on great players in the draft, they are always trying to get us to release them to them for nothing. We need to make some rules where this stops. If they can't have the knowledge to draft our best players, then they should not be allowed to grab them from us after the fact."

But, but, but, according to all NBA fans on this site, NBA scouts "never miss a single European prospect that can play in the NBA. If a European player was not drafted by the NBA, it is because he simply cannot play in the NBA."

Strange................how no NBA team drafted Teodosic and Shved, and they are saying in fact, not a single NBA team was even interested in drafting them.........but now NBA teams want them. How does this add up? If the BS spread in this forum is true that, "NBA scouts are expert talent evaluators that never miss a single European prospect".........

Yeah sure. Like I said, the NBA has no freaking clue about players in Europe. They draft Rubio 5th (due to Olympics and Youtube hype marketing) and players like Shved and Teodosic can't even get drafted.........

And I am being told here that any player that I ask why are they not in the draft, "would be there if he was good enough because NBA scouts are experts".............LMFAO

These "experts" that didn't even have any interest at all in players that they now try to get. Like I said, the NBA is a JOKE in how it drafts European players.


FastAndFurious
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Yo somebody get this dude a

Yo somebody get this dude a job as a scout! lmaoooooo he aint stopping!

JunkYardDog
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HE'SSSSSS BACKKKKKKKK

HE'SSSSSS BACKKKKKKKK !!!!!!!

welcome home EB.

I May Be Krypt
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WARNING! DO NOT FEED THE

WARNING! DO NOT FEED THE EUROPEAN TROLL!

He wants attention and thinks he's controversial. But's he neither and is quite annoying *kanye shrug*

aamir543
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^Thinks he's controversial,

^Thinks he's controversial, he's more controversial than OJ Simson.

Scottoant93
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To shut him up lets just

To shut him up lets just write a letter to david stern to convince him to make Olympiacos an nba expansion team

Nbanflguy
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Everyone just ignore this

Everyone just ignore this

FastAndFurious
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It's actually becoming

It's actually becoming entertaining because he's consitent lol everytime I see EURO or FIBA or one of those crazy 4 letter combinations now I automatically assume it's European Baller and 99% of the time i'm right.

mikeyvthedon
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European Baller

Who cares? You hate the NBA anyway. You don't think European teams go after some of the best undrafted American talent, or try to talk to 2nd round picks? Are we supposed to stick up for the practices of NBA front offices? I mean, get a life dude. Ever since you went on that ridiculous tirade about LeBron James and Derrick Rose not being able to be high level European players, you have lost all credibility.

Start your own site and have fun watching Euroleague. It is really good basketball, which is a game that we all love. If you think Euroleague is more real than the NBA, than let these guys make exhorbitant sums of money and play basketball in Europe. Many get to either stay home or being closer to home more often and they are still getting paid. One thing you have to admit is, the NBA business model gets there players paid a lot more. It is still basketball and the US still won the 2008 Gold Medal and the 2010 World Championship. So, why don't you go antogonize Draft Express?

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To shut him up lets just

To shut him up lets just write a letter to david stern to convince him to make Olympiacos an nba expansion team.

Why would I care if Olympiacos was an NBA team? What in the world would this matter to me?

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Oh Lord, did You send him to

Oh Lord, did You send him to punish us for our sins?

At least African Baller and Asian Baller haven't discovered NbaDraft yet.

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Ever since you went on that

Ever since you went on that ridiculous tirade about LeBron James and Derrick Rose not being able to be high level European players, you have lost all credibility.

The people like you, who refused to address all the reasons I gave for why LeBron and Rose would not "dominate the Euroleague" are the ones that "lost all credibility".

You obviously have very limited basketball knowledge and/or are just an NBA only fan.

Otherwise, you would have addressed the points I made, which you did not. It means you either know I am right, and just choose to taunt me, and promote the NBA no matter what (NBA only fan), or you simply don't know a thing about basketball.

Nbanflguy
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Why the f*ck are you here?

Why the f*ck are you here? This is a NBA forum!!!!!

mikeyvthedon
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Really?

Why would I care if Olympiacos was an NBA team? What in the world would this matter to me?

Than why are you posting on NBADraft.net. We have freaking NBA in the title. You clearly have no interest in making any of us less ignorant about the Euroleague? What is the point, besides writing many quotes in your original post that I have never seen anyone on here make?

But, but, but, according to all NBA fans on this site, NBA scouts "never miss a single European prospect that can play in the NBA. If a European player was not drafted by the NBA, it is because he simply cannot play in the NBA."

Who has said this? Find me a person on here who has made this statement. Sarunas Jasikevicius, Timofey Mozgov and Jose Calderon were a couple examples. Manu Ginobili actually was HOPING not to be drafted, that way he would have freedom to choose where he wanted to play. I have heard more and more about European players not necessarily caring about going to the NBA.

Those are more than likely the ones not good enough to make it, but even the best seem to have a take it or leave it attitude towards the NBA at times. Teams are definitely not perfect and sometimes miss out on some great players. Than again, some teams might be worried about contract buyouts, or people not coming over. Fran Vazquez, anyone?

Strange................how no NBA team drafted Teodosic and Shved, and they are saying in fact, not a single NBA team was even interested in drafting them.........but now NBA teams want them. How does this add up? If the BS spread in this forum is true that, "NBA scouts are expert talent evaluators that never miss a single European prospect".........

I know I had Shved on my Mock Draft. I think they both definitely had interest coming from the NBA. Could it be that the announcers were possibly, I don't know, full of $hit? I know NBA announcers tend to be, but, I guess I should expect more to even question the Euroleague announcers statements. Not to mention, isn't that exactly what a team like CSKA would want? Why do they want these guys to go to the NBA if they can help their team? For the buyout? Sounds like it definitely you are looking at the reflection side of a two way mirror.

Yeah sure. Like I said, the NBA has no freaking clue about players in Europe. They draft Rubio 5th (due to Olympics and Youtube hype marketing) and players like Shved and Teodosic can't even get drafted.........

And I am being told here that any player that I ask why are they not in the draft, "would be there if he was good enough because NBA scouts are experts".............LMFAO

These "experts" that didn't even have any interest at all in players that they now try to get. Like I said, the NBA is a JOKE in how it drafts European players.

I forgot, no European teams have ever made a mistake or signed someone to a bad deal. Thanks for refreshing my memory on that one. By the way, hate to say it but, Ricky Rubio going to be the starting PG on Spains national team. He will play a lot of minutes. Jose Calderon will be his back-up.

Sergio Rodriguez, that guy currently leading the Euroleague in assists, he might not even make the team. I am sure you know this already, but of course will use it as a reason to say Ricky Rubio is not more deserving than a grocery list of other players rather than, I don't know, being happy that he is doing well in another league? At the very least, you don't have to watch him ruin Euroleague for you.

By the way, gave completely legitimate reasons for LeBron and Derrick Rose doing well in Euroleague, guess you cannot accept them. Your basketball knowledge always amazes me, though. Oh, it is your lack of any basketball related things other than saying they travel all of the time when they both have adapted fine to international rules. Yeah, that is amazing.

European Baller
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Why the f*ck are you here?

Why the f*ck are you here? This is a NBA forum!!!!!

Excuse me, but I was under the impression that this is an NBA DRAFT forum. A place to talk abotu the NBA Draft, how it works, players that are and are not drafted, and why, etc.

That's EXACTLY what I have been doing. And so far, not a single person has given any logical, rational, or legit reason as to the questions I have asked and the points I have brought up here.

And in case you were unware, the NBA DRAFT is an INTERNATIONAL basketball subject, whether you like it or not.

I am here to talk about this. That is why I am here.

Scottoant93
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How about you do something

How about you do something constructive and go back to the navaro thread and answer Y2G and my questions which you failed to answer

Nbanflguy
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Excuse me, but I was under

Excuse me, but I was under the impression that this is an NBA DRAFT forum. A place to talk abotu the NBA Draft, how it works, players that are and are not drafted, and why, etc.

That's EXACTLY what I have been doing. And so far, not a single person has given any logical, rational, or legit reason as to the questions I have asked and the points I have brought up here.

And in case you were unware, the NBA DRAFT is an INTERNATIONAL basketball subject, whether you like it or not.

I am here to talk about this. That is why I am here.

No all you do is b*tch and moan about how European players dont get drafted or are not on the mock, diss and insult the NBA and NBA fans, call us and nba gm's racist, and make rediculous statements that are in no way true.

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I know I had Shved on my Mock

I know I had Shved on my Mock Draft. I think they both definitely had interest coming from the NBA. Could it be that the announcers were possibly, I don't know, full of $hit? I know NBA announcers tend to be, but, I guess I should expect more to even question the Euroleague announcers statements. Not to mention, isn't that exactly what a team like CSKA would want? Why do they want these guys to go to the NBA if they can help their team? For the buyout? Sounds like it definitely you are looking at the reflection side of a two way mirror.

The announcers were talking to CSKA officials and it was abouyt the NBA, since the owner of the Nets was there. They wanted to know if NBA teams had any interest in Mantzaris, Sloukas, Papanikolaou. They were wondering the same thing I am. Why the hell not one of them even apepars on a single mock draft list anywhere.

The basketball people, with close ties and knowledge of NBA (Prokhorev was their boss and owns the Nets and was in the arena and staying there for the week).................

They told them just that. That is how the NBA is. They were told flat out by people that work personally with the agents of those players that no NBA teams ever had any interest in drafting Teodosic or Shved, because they did not come to personal workout camps in the US every summer. They ahd other things to do like play with their club teams or national teams.

Like they said, then all of a sudden they want these players, after they realize they make mistakes. In other words..........they were told that those 3 players (Sloukas, Papanikolaou, Mantzaris) are not on any NBA mock drafts because they don't spend their off time doing private workouts and 3 man workouts with NBA teams.

So my point stands.............people heer are full of it. The NBA isn't even considering European players unless they are personally doing workouts. But all you hear is how the NBA mock drafts are simply "a list of the Europeans that are capable of playing in the NBA".

Well according to CSKA's management, it's simply a list of the best European players that showed up at some NBA workout, during the times when most of the best European players have other duties.

European Baller
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I forgot, no European teams

I forgot, no European teams have ever made a mistake or signed someone to a bad deal. Thanks for refreshing my memory on that one. By the way, hate to say it but, Ricky Rubio going to be the starting PG on Spains national team. He will play a lot of minutes. Jose Calderon will be his back-up.

What in the hell does this have to do with top level European players not getting drafted? Rubio was taken 5th. I am talking about top level European players not getting drafted, and not even being on a mock anywhere. Rubio was always 1-2 on the mocks.

Besides that, I will make sure to bump this later on, since you guarantee Rubio "will start for Spain"....................and stop trying to derail all my threads by changing the topic please.

European Baller
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By the way, gave completely

By the way, gave completely legitimate reasons for LeBron and Derrick Rose doing well in Euroleague, guess you cannot accept them. Your basketball knowledge always amazes me, though. Oh, it is your lack of any basketball related things other than saying they travel all of the time when they both have adapted fine to international rules. Yeah, that is amazing.

No, you did not. What you said was complete and utter BS.

Once again, the Olympics and FIBA World Cup (Championship) play under new FIBA rules, not the old FIBA rules. The Euroleague plays under the OLD rules of FIBA.

I already said it several times to you, Euroleague has different rules, to which your only reply is "they already played great under FIBA rules". Completely irrelevant and pure nonsense, considering those tournaments have DIFFERENT rules than the Euroleague does.

And shows you are a troll. Because in fact Derrick Rose sucked when he played for Team USA, and yet you keep pretending he was some kind of star that dominated. The truth was he played pretty much like crap.

You are not countering a single point I have made. You are just trolling.

mikeyvthedon
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You tend to do a lot of quoting and statement making

But very little actual analysis. Besides excuses like "everyone in the NBA travelling", you have very little to back-up your claims. You are using this to attack rather than inform, which I do not find cool in the least. If you want to kick knowledge, do so without being arrogant and looking down on people. Until than, it is really difficult for any of us to talk about the draft with you when you always come up with an excuse as to why other peoples opinions do not matter.

Also, can you bump the post where you guaranteed the US would not win the Gold Medal in the 2010 World Championships? Oh, wait, no, that would mean you would have to admit that maybe you were "BS'ing" everyone. By the way, what part of my reasoning was BS? Because, I do not find your criticism specific and I bet you did not even respond to exactly what I was talking about, as per usual.

Scottoant93
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Reasons nba teams may not

Reasons nba teams may not draft certain international players in the draft and come back to get them later

1. The player is still raw and has not fully developed his body or game to fully support the nba game. Years later he may have significally improved and ready to contribute.

2.Drafting an international player has the risk, of A. The player having a buyout that cant be reached B. chance the international player might never come over(ala Vasquez)which results in a waste of a pick(in the example a lotto pick) as oppossed to ncaa players its less likely

3. Nba team may have not had room or any need at the time of the prospects draft, so they decided to skip on them, years later(which is a long time) however they needed someone to fill that void or role and they decide that international player is right for it and they will have no competion signing them compared to other FA

4. The Common mistake when drafting any player from 1st to undrafted, lack of hindsight...you cant see in the future man, if that was the case would Kwame Brown have went first, and boozer,redd, lin went int he second round or undrafted people make mistakes...everyone does it weather nba gms, european gms, or everyday people like us...sorry to tell you man no one is perfect.

4 logical reason of why some internation player dont get drafted

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No all you do is b*tch and

No all you do is b*tch and moan about how European players dont get drafted or are not on the mock, diss and insult the NBA and NBA fans, call us and nba gm's racist, and make rediculous statements that are in no way true.

Are you calling Jon Givony a liar? Givony wrote in his own website (draftexpress.com) that when he asked an NBA GM about whether he would select Rubio, the GM replied to him that his team's Gm rule was "never draft a white guy".

So, I guess you are calling Givony a liar then? Because he wrote on his own website that NBA general manager was so racist that he would never draft a white player.

Nbanflguy
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Damn you are right. I forgot

Damn you are right. I forgot that everything you read on the internet is true

European Baller
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1. The player is still raw

1. The player is still raw and has not fully developed his body or game to fully support the nba game. Years later he may have significally improved and ready to contribute.

2.Drafting an international player has the risk, of A. The player having a buyout that cant be reached B. chance the international player might never come over(ala Vasquez)which results in a waste of a pick(in the example a lotto pick) as oppossed to ncaa players its less likely

3. Nba team may have not had room or any need at the time of the prospects draft, so they decided to skip on them, years later(which is a long time) however they needed someone to fill that void or role and they decide that international player is right for it and they will have no competion signing them compared to other FA

Yes this is trure. But the point is why the hell were Shved and Teodosic not drafted. None of this would apply to them at the time they wer up to be drafted. Yet, they STILL were not drafted. When you bring this up in forums like this (and I remember mentioning several times here why the hell was Teodosic not in any mocks and not being drafted).......

the response is always this kind of BS - "game won't translate to the NBA", "not athletic enough for the NBA", "can't play under NBA rules" and all that BS. The fact that NBA teams are now offering contracts prove that is wrong. If any of that was true, and how NBA teams veiwed it, then they would not be offering them contarcts.

That's the point. And all the time when I kept asking here why the hell was Teodosic not on the mocks I got the same BS responses i get now. For example if I asked why Sloukas was not on the mocks - same complete BS answers that I got when I asked about Teodosic......

So, as it turns out, I was right, and everyone else here was wrong. But I am to believe that no matter what, every time I am wrong. Because no matter who I mention here, EVERYONE slams me and says they are not on the mocks because they can't play in the NBA.

Then after the fact, when it turns out I was right, it's just, "well you know, no one is perfect and everyone makes mistakes". Really? So then how come I get attacked here by everyone on every single player I ask about here?

And again, it still does not explain why guys like Teodosic and Shved were never drafted, since none of these reasons actually apllys to them. But if I ask these questions here - I get attacked and called a troll and a liar.

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Damn you are right. I forgot

Damn you are right. I forgot that everything you read on the internet is true

So you are actually claiming that the NBA would have not sued him if that wasn't true? Really? You are actually claiming that? OK..........................

A Lil English
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Hey Euroballer.. Let me ask

Hey Euroballer.. Let me ask you a serious question and please don't dodge it.

What do you think of Motiejunas & Valanciunas as NBA prospects?

Nbanflguy
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I did some research online

I did some research online and the only lawsuit i could find againt Jon Givony was from an agent in 2005. In 2005 Givony published an article on draftcity.com calling an agent a scum bag and dirty and stuff like that. He was later fired from the site and later sued by the agent. I think you got you facts wrong..... again.

http://www.citmedialaw.org/threats/bell-v-shah#description

http://www.basketballforum.com/toronto-raptors/173663-draftcity-com-fires-jonathan-givony.html

European Baller
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I did some research online

I did some research online and the only lawsuit i could find againt Jon Givony was from an agent in 2005. In 2005 Givony published an article on draftcity.com calling an agent a scum bag and dirty and stuff like that. He was later fired from the site and later sued by the agent. I think you got you facts wrong..... again.

http://www.citmedialaw.org/threats/bell-v-shah#description

http://www.basketballforum.com/toronto-raptors/173663-draftcity-com-fires-jonathan-givony.html

What does this have to do with what i was talking about? I'm just not going to respond to non topic trolling that is designed to derail my threads anymore.

Nbanflguy
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You serious? You said the NBA

You serious? You said the NBA sued him because he was telling the truth about a gm saying he would not draft a white guy.

The NBA never sued him and he has a shady past. You were wrong

Scottoant93
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European Baller Read my 4

European Baller

Read my 4 reasons and tell if you find anything wrong with them... you wanted a logical point of view you got one so....Agree or disagree

European Baller
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Hey Euroballer.. Let me ask

Hey Euroballer.. Let me ask you a serious question and please don't dodge it.

What do you think of Motiejunas & Valanciunas as NBA prospects?

Good. Pretty much every player puts up better stats in the NBA than in the Euroleague. In fact, Euroleague scrubs regularly become NBA stars now. Even guys that did not play in Euroleague and no one in Europe had really even heard of (Jerebko, etc.) do fine in the NBA.

The whole thing is, you don't want to be an ACTUAL REAL Euroleague star, because then you tend to get benched for no reason, other than NBA marketing. But if you are just nothing but a young talent, and get drafted with a first pick, you pretty much will have better NBA stats than Euroleague stats.

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yo

I am from europe, i live in spain and i watch the Real Madrid team play everyday at practice ... players like sergio llull, rodriguez, kyle singler, mirotic etc. Ill still tell you that most Euro players dont get drafted because their athelticism doesnt translate or the game is vastly different ... take some white players in college ... Jon Schuer .. they play great ... he played so well for a great team in a great conference with great players ... but did he get drafted ... no ... did he get on the mock drafts ... no ... and a lot of white college guys get overlooked because of guys like jj redick in the nba (who isnt too bad) so with no insult to european players because i am european myself ... their game just doesnt translate that well just like the white guys in college ... i mean sergio llull is averaging 6.3 points in euroleague ... but he got drafted because of his potential to play better in the nba because he is athletic ..... i really hope all jokes a side that you European Baller will stop being so negative ... some players get overlooked all over the world ... its just life ... youtube is sometimes better than a jumpshot, so chill out and accept it

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more proof

darko milicic, yaroslav korolev and nikolov tskitishvili were lottery picks. more proof that nba teams know nothing about young european players. who cares?

Scottoant93
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^^^ Can you be more specific

^^^ Can you be more specific with your answer can you discribe some of their weakness that you see other then them possible putting up bigger numbers in the nba

Nbanflguy
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In fact, Euroleague scrubs

In fact, Euroleague scrubs regularly become NBA stars now.

Uh what?

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What are you talking about?

I just wanted to know what you thought about their game. Damn son

European Baller
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You serious? You said the NBA

You serious? You said the NBA sued him because he was telling the truth about a gm saying he would not draft a white guy.

The NBA never sued him and he has a shady past. You were wrong

No I did not. I said if he said that, and it was a LIE, as you implied, he would have been sued by the NBA. The fact he said it and was NOT sued by the NBA, shows it was true.

You then supported this, by providing info on a suit, for something much less eggregious being said, that was supposedly disputed.

Stop trying to derail my thread with trolling please.

You know damn well, that if Givony said that, and it was untrue, the NBA would have sued the hell out of him and probably got his site shut down. Instead, he said it, the NBA knew it, and did NOTHING and pretended it never even happened. And believe me, MANY people were aware of it.

Of course, you are sitting here pretending that there is nothing racist going on...................

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European Baller Read my 4

European Baller

Read my 4 reasons and tell if you find anything wrong with them... you wanted a logical point of view you got one so....Agree or disagree

I agree. But, as I keep saying, that's not the issues I am talking about. I am talking about top level European players that don't get drafted, and none of this applies to their situation. I am talking about the cases that simply make no sense. Why NBA teams purposefully pass on players that would help them a lot, for no logical reason, that fits into nothing that can be logically explained.

Nbanflguy
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You know damn well, that if

You know damn well, that if Givony said that, and it was untrue, the NBA would have sued the hell out of him and probably got his site shut down. Instead, he said it, the NBA knew it, and did NOTHING and pretended it never even happened. And believe me, MANY people were aware of it.

Of course, you are sitting here pretending that there is nothing racist going on...................

Or the NBA just didnt care and just ignored a random comment on the internet.

Nihochu
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To your comment EuroBaller .. the reason why a lot of european players dont get picked when they produce at a high rate in europe whilst other get picked when they dont is because the ones that kill in europe probably do it because it is their natural game ... ones that fits them much better ... whilst some other people (sergio llull) are much more adapt at playing an atheltic game at a much faster pace .... in europe there are a lot of guards that produce better that llull but because hes so atheltic and a good 1 v 1 player his game can translate better to the nba rather than somebody who is slow and shoots jumpers a lot

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I am from europe, i live in

I am from europe, i live in spain and i watch the Real Madrid team play everyday at practice ... players like sergio llull, rodriguez, kyle singler, mirotic etc. Ill still tell you that most Euro players dont get drafted because their athelticism doesnt translate or the game is vastly different ... take some white players in college ... Jon Schuer .. they play great ... he played so well for a great team in a great conference with great players ... but did he get drafted ... no ... did he get on the mock drafts ... no ... and a lot of white college guys get overlooked because of guys like jj redick in the nba (who isnt too bad) so with no insult to european players because i am european myself ... their game just doesnt translate that well just like the white guys in college ... i mean sergio llull is averaging 6.3 points in euroleague ... but he got drafted because of his potential to play better in the nba because he is athletic ..... i really hope all jokes a side that you European Baller will stop being so negative ... some players get overlooked all over the world ... its just life ... youtube is sometimes better than a jumpshot, so chill out and accept it

Yes, Llull was drafted for simple reason that he is athletic, AND he is from Spain. Look my friend, I have no reason to complai about any young ACB players (Spanish or other nationality) not being drafted. If any young player in ACB has any real game, or not even has any game, but just is an athlete (Biyombo, Eyenga, etc.) they WILL get drafted.

ACB is like the best possible place to guarantee a draft pick. The NBA is insanely scouting it. Ayon can have half a good season, in a small club, and be given an NBA contract. Biyombo can come from nowhere, block some shots, and be a lotto pick. NBA is drafting anyone with a pulse from ACB.

I am talking about all the players they DON'T draft and come from other areas. Explain it please....

Siskauskas

Diamantidis

Papaloukas

Shved

Bourousis

Teodosic

etc.............none of them can play in the NBA? Oh wait..yeah game don't translate and it's athletic related? When Papaloukas was young, he was super athletic. he would dunk on 7 footers in traffic all the time. Shved is very athletic by NBA standards......not drafted.

Guess that? They ddid not play in the ACB..........hmm, strange.

Are you going to tell me that Llull would have been drafted if he played in the Greek league? Really? Seriously?

And you mention Scheyer not being drafted by the NBA. OK, what is this supposed to prove? That because he was not drafted by the NBA, is white, is not a super athlete, and is playing in the Euroleague that this makes sense? That this adds up?

How so? Explain it. Because I don't get it. Because Scheye is a 15th man on Maccabi. He is the FIFTEENTH man of Maccabi.

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I mean that because of people like Scheyer the stereotype of white people weather that it be from europe or from the nba will always be a risk .... yeah i agree with you the greek has much less exposure ... extremely less but maybe (i dunno) thats because a lot of the players that play there are not suited to the game in the nba , i mean i seen the greek national team play and they play such a team game with a lot of continuity and it looks nothing like some teams in the nba would want .... Papaloukas got a lot of offers from the Nba when he played at Cska moskow i know this ... i also know that he rejected them .. for reasons i dont know .... and shved probably didnt get drafted because when ettore messina was coach at cska he gave him no game time ... and now he is playing but he is in his mid 20's

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To your comment EuroBaller ..

To your comment EuroBaller .. the reason why a lot of european players dont get picked when they produce at a high rate in europe whilst other get picked when they dont is because the ones that kill in europe probably do it because it is their natural game ... ones that fits them much better ... whilst some other people (sergio llull) are much more adapt at playing an atheltic game at a much faster pace .... in europe there are a lot of guards that produce better that llull but because hes so atheltic and a good 1 v 1 player his game can translate better to the nba rather than somebody who is slow and shoots jumpers a lot

Again, this does not in any way explain what i am talking about.

Llull plays in USA or Spain = DRAFTED

Llull plays in Greece or Russia = NOT drafted.

No one will address my point. The NBA practice of not drafting players specifically becasue ofn where they are from. And Llull isn't that athletic by European standards either. I can list a whole bunch of European guards that blow him out of the water in terms of athleticism. So in reality, it's not even a true point.

Yes, he IS athletic. But there are a bunch of guards in Europe with way more athleticism than him....don't get drafted. of course they also don't play in the ACB.

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Uh what? Brandon Jennings,

Uh what?

Brandon Jennings, Ricky Rubio, Ty Lawson. All 3 of them were pretty much scrubs in Euroleague. All 3 of them classify as stars in the NBA. Not superstars by any stretch of the imagination at all, but nonetheless, they make the cut as "stars". They were pretty much all scrubs in Euroleague.

So that is what.

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yes probably because of the exposure ... i don't know for sure obviously but when the spanish national team are the only team that consistently challenge the USA team (even though greece beat them in 06) that they think that the most considerable talent is in the ACB. Its like college too ... there are so many athletic ... fast ... brilliant players in the MAAC and other not very strong conferences that they often get overlooked ... hell scott machado has been passing so well all year and he has only just got a page on this draft site ... so i think maaaaaybe .... if other national teams start to compete with the USA ... like russia or greece or france ... then scouts will look at the talent there more ... because from their eyes all they see is talent in spain .. whilst obv is not true ...

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I mean that because of people

I mean that because of people like Scheyer the stereotype of white people weather that it be from europe or from the nba will always be a risk .... yeah i agree with you the greek has much less exposure ... extremely less but maybe (i dunno) thats because a lot of the players that play there are not suited to the game in the nba , i mean i seen the greek national team play and they play such a team game with a lot of continuity and it looks nothing like some teams in the nba would want .... Papaloukas got a lot of offers from the Nba when he played at Cska moskow i know this ... i also know that he rejected them .. for reasons i dont know .... and shved probably didnt get drafted because when ettore messina was coach at cska he gave him no game time ... and now he is playing but he is in his mid 20's

OK, so you are agreeing with me, that the NBA is drafting and not drafting players based on stereotypes, based on race, and based on where players are from and what league they play in? Because this is my whole point. It's what I have been saying.

But for saying that here, I get ATTACKED by ALL of the American NBA fans and even a lot of the ones saying they are Europeans. They just refuse to even consider this could be true. it's just no no no.

The truth is though, this is EXACTLY what the NBA draft is and how it works.

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I had a feeling you wouldn't

I had a feeling you wouldn't give me a straight answer. Crazy chip on your shoulder...

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i wouldn't agree with you fully on race and stereotypes .. im sure if a spanish person played basketball in zimbabwe they wouldnt think just because hes spanish he is better than most europeans ... only because they beleive that spain teaches players better , as all they can look at is result ... so in my opinion its not race or stereotypes ... its just the belief that as of this moment , spain produces better players .. like in college the ACB is like a big college conference , whilst some other leagues are considered less competative, so they by into the ACB performers to be better, weather they be russian or serbian doesnts matter,

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I think everyone just needs a fresh start with EuropeanBaller

I think everyone is caught in their ways too much. If you guys can open up a little and see eachother's points, maybe you can see that you guys can exchange some valuable information. EuropeanBaller is from Europe so he obviously understands European basketball better than any of us here in America. But if you come off so ignorant to everyone, everyone is going to come off so ignorant to you. But everyone else who just calls him a troll is ignorant as well. He obviously is not a troll if he is spending this much time giving posts with valuable information. Agree with it or not, he is not a troll.

I think you have to look at it from an unbiased perspective. In America, athleticism is way more important than it is in Europe. That is not to go under the bus. That is a BIG BIG difference. In Europe, players like J.J. Redick or Adam Morrison could have probably shined. But that is not a knock to European basketball, it is just a different style. On the other hand EuropeanBaller is probably right, Derrick Rose and LeBron James would not dominate as much in Europe I believe. The European game just does not have the domination that our game has because of the slower pace. Their atleticism would not shine through as much, even though they'd be even more athletic compared to their teamates, as it would in the NBA. But you are kidding yourself EuropeanBaller if you still do not think they would be stars. It might take some getting used to, ala Deron Williams, but once they found their grooves they would be great players and you know this. Especially LeBron. He would not even have to score that much to be able to play a HUGE role in Euroleague.

The other main thing is that I think NBA teams are drafting for potential. They are not looking for a role player, they have enough of them. I believe that every player you name can probably play a role in the NBA. But the NBA wants a player who CAN dominate. NBA is always looking for the next big thing. They do not want a 6'3 point guard, average athleticism. They want that 6'5, athletic point guard that thrives in the up-tempo system, ala Ricky Rubio. It can not be stated enough how much athleticism is more important in the NBA than Europe. In the NBA, a star usually plays about 38 minutes a game. In Europe, a star usually plays about 28 minutes a game. It is more of a 12 man unit than the NBA. More of a team game. Not as much single player domination. And I do think that the scouting for players is not as good in some countries as it is in others. In Spain I am sure there are not many prospects missed, but in smaller countries, there are probably a ridiculous amount of prospects missed. It is impossible to get every prospect even in our own country. Everyone makes mistakes and no one person can truly know a prospects future.

I think everyone needs a fresh start with EuropeanBaller because you guys can all offer each other a LOT of basketball information.

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I don't understand how I've

I don't understand how I've been banned here and this guy still posting? -1000 posts?!

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