Now you want to throw Andre Drummond back in the 2012 draft
I honestly feel that some players who are labeled as "one and done" and return to school ultimately hurt their stock if they dont show significant improvement. Examples: jared sullinger, perry jones, terrence jones. along with underclassmen like khris middleton and rodney williams who were both at one time considered potential lottery picks. i think it would be wise for rivers and drummond to enter the draft while they are still hot commidities. these days freshman are getting better and better and its not as easy as it seems to share the spotlight on a college stage.
Austin Rivers will enter the 2012 NBA draft. Why? Because he's been told for probably the last 3 years he'd fall no where past the lottery if he were to come out of college after one year, something he has probably bought into and believes. You can tell by his demeanor that he probably BELIEVES he is NBA ready right now and if he does he's partially right. He also probably knows that coming back "could" increase his stock, but it's probably in decent postion right now and all he has to do to make his stock jump from where it is now is have a good tourney run and play well, which is something he still has the power to control. He's also probably knows that coming back could also hurt his stock if he doesn't show significant improvement, even breaking even (i.e. jared sullinger) having a year where he's not much better than this year or the same. He's also probably sure that to improve his game he can do it in the pros with the big boys as he has already worked out with them......The bottom line is projected lottery picks and above USUALLY don't come back and i'm sure he's aware that is exactly what he is.
@NickWayne87
Austin may come out. I do realize that. Hence the flip flopping.... And easy to say that it's for sure after he hit that game winner and his stock is on the rise, BUT............Duke guys aren't usually one and dones. (with a few exceptions - Maggette Deng and Kyrie) not to mention Rivers is not under any financial pressure to leave early. Doc and Coach K will tell him if he's ready.
"I could sense that in him", isn't exactly an inside scoop or a compelling argument. So just wait and see what the word is from those that know when the time comes and stop being so hypercritical.
Also, considering UConn's tourney eligibility being stripped for 13 and Calhoun's back situation (new development), odds have increased that Drummond will go.
"Austin Rivers will enter the 2012 NBA draft. Why? Because he's been told for probably the last 3 years he'd fall no where past the lottery if he were to come out of college after one year, something he has probably bought into and believes. You can tell by his demeanor that he probably BELIEVES he is NBA ready right now and if he does he's partially right. He also probably knows that coming back "could" increase his stock, but it's probably in decent postion right now and all he has to do to make his stock jump from where it is now is have a good tourney run and play well, which is something he still has the power to control. He's also probably knows that coming back could also hurt his stock if he doesn't show significant improvement, even breaking even (i.e. jared sullinger) having a year where he's not much better than this year or the same. He's also probably sure that to improve his game he can do it in the pros with the big boys as he has already worked out with them......The bottom line is projected lottery picks and above USUALLY don't come back and i'm sure he's aware that is exactly what he is."
That's a whole lot of "probably"s for me to probably take you serious on whether or not Rivers probably stays because his draft stock will probably raise next year and he could probably improve another year under Coach K. Probably of course.
You're not giving anything compelling and your argument is baseless. You presented no facts and started every one of your opinions with a weakening "probably".
I never claimed I had the "inside scoop" I just have a feeling.....and as I said before, your dad's millions is different from your millions. And his game winner had nothing to do with it I didn't even see that game only highlights....I knew he was projected as one and done coming in college saw him him play a couple game and knew that'd he come out never once have I thought otherwise....only way I would've would be if he had an extremely subpar year which he definately hasn't. Austin's stock was so high coming out of high school if high school seniors could still go straight to the league he probably would've never seen a college tip off, another reason why I KNOW he's gonna come out. His first step is NBA ready and so is the range on his jumper but his skills aren't the biggest reason I think he's coming out. I'm 24 years old, I've played basketball i know the dream of playing in the NBA my cousin Muntrelle Dobbins played with Derek Fisher on UALR. I have a younger cousin going d1 to ball state next year Marcus Posely, if you got the chance to be a lottery pick which he does he's absolutely gonna TAKE IT. Not a matter of may, it's a matter of WILL.
TOL23, it's a guess okay? it's a guess, but an educated guess based on assessing the situation. The point of the post was stir up conversation not to prove "i'm a sportswriter who flies around the nation talking to college coaches and prospects to give you a clear cut answer on where prospects will fall in the draft." Just to guess that based on what i see that austin rivers probably (there's that word again) will come out of the draft. I think there's a better chance he comes out than stays that's all i'm saying. Same with Drummond, I don't care what a coach or whoever told aran whatever andre was ALWAYS gonna enter this draft he's a projected number top 3 pick who'd run the risk of getting EXPOSED if he came back.
I wanted facts not opinions. I wanted to hear that Austin rivers and andre drummond said "I am coming out for the 2012 draft" otherwise this post is baseless and pointless. You made this a post as if we were talking about facts but instead you are being opinionated. Its not that I don't think they will come out(I do). But i don't see the point in this thread other than you ranting out your opinion.
Well when you start telling the creator of this site what to do, I think 100% of the time its gonna come out as if you are trying to throw facts around but instead are opinions and Aran has proven to know things most don't first. This site overall does a great job at knowing things first.
in my OPINION aran should leave both austin and drummond in the 2012 draft no matter what he hears from ANYONE because chances are they are gonna come out. Should've never moved them out of it. Do I expect him to? no.....am I attacking him or how he does his job? no, he is great and this site is great i've been coming to this site FAITHFULLY almost every day since one of my friends in high school showed it to me during the year of the LeBron James draft. I was 16 at the time and at 24 it's one of the FEW things that i still have in common with my 16 year old self. I just wanted to spark conversation and i did that.
well since you pointed that out I will.....mark my words. i'll be here. as I said, I've been coming to this site almost EVERYDAY for the past 8 (damn it's been that long?) years. Sometimes it's the first thing I do when I get out of bed BEFORE brushing my teeth lol.
How about instead of coming back and posting if Rivers is moved to 2012 mock, (since he's already been flip flopped a number of times) come back when Rivers officially enters the draft or stays in college. And state that you were right or wrong. Will you come back and post either way? I doubt it. What would the point of posting if he's moved to 2012 mock be? He might be moved back to 2013 after that, right? He might ultimately stay. So what would posting that prove?
I don't understand why people are having such a hard time with the Drummond and Rivers flip flopping to me this should be expected considering their circumstances.
First look at Drummond. This dude didn't even wanna play college this year he was content with playing a year of post grad ball then coming to college so on his timeline he wasn't planning on entering the draft until 2013 to begin with. Andre Drummond doesn't appear to be in any rush. Like Barnes, the Jone's, and Sullinger last year he seems to be fully enjoying being a college kid. I would like to see Drummond stay in an make a Blake Griffin sophomore leap and Jim Calhoun certainly sold that to him. But in reality Calhoun may have coached his last game. As soon as I saw Calhoun was taking a leave of absence I knew the odds of Drummond coming back just got slimmer. Combine that with the frustrating year UConn is having and even worse they're not even eligible for the tournament and it's looking like Drummond would be foolish not to leave. A month ago I would of told you the exact opposite but so much has changed.
We all knew Rivers could score and shoot but his game is still not exactly pro ready. River's still needs to learn how to play better without the ball. Right now River's is too ball dominant and that don't work well if your a starting SG in the NBA. Look at the trouble OJ Mayo is having. River no doubt has some Wade in his game and he knows this. He also knows that staying in college another year will help him get their then entering the draft would. I know Doc would love to see him stay another year and that's a man that Austin will be sure to listen too.
But can somebody explain to me how Quincy Miller went from lotto pick this year, to the 30th pick of 2013? Quincy is another guy who loves being in college and I think will stay. But if he enters this year he's a lotto pick based on size, skill, and potential. If he comes back to Baylor for his sophomore with PJ3 gone he's gonna be the go to guy and flourish. I can see Miller putting up over 20ppg next year and becoming a top 5 pick. Sort of like what Derrick Williams did.
Careful Nick, your thiiiis close to being sent to TLI's basement. In regards to the topc of discussion I believe they both come out. Drummonds potential is great although Im sicking of waiting on him to have great consistant games, also with UConn losing I believe Drummonds stock and Lambs should take a huge drop.
Austn Rivers has been underrated all year long. He is instant offense, teams like Charlotte, and Toronto may take a look at Rivers if they slip under the Top5 of the lotto. Given the right rle I believe Rivers could score near 20-ppg in his rookie year. Austin is being limited in Duke to me, which is great for his development and teaching him how to score in different ways then just ball dominant thrashings.
I feel like we should trust the random messageboard poster guy "Nick" and his instincts about Austin Rivers. As far as I know, "Nick" has never been wrong, and I am positive this site has been wrong about a few things.
(ps. Awesome to see Aran participate. He has unlimited credibility in my book for being the first person to recognize that D-Rose would be the #1 pick in 2008.)
As far as Austin Rivers is concerned I think Aaran hit it when he said that he is not in a financial situation where he'd have to come out. Also, I agree with Aaran when he says that Doc and K will tell him if he's ready. I think that it doesn't matter for his draft stock either way if it is this year or next year he's still looking at being picked between 7-15 with the guys potentially in this year's draft and they players next year don't see how he gets any higher.
As far as Andre Drummond is concerned. I think it would be crazy for him to return. Here you have a guy who is being considered a top 5 pick based soley on size and potential. If he were to return to school he would be expected to produce and based on what I've seen of Drummond I don't know if he'll ever produce on the college level or NBA level the way he is expected to.
Andre Drummond is a mega talent, but I feel coming back for a year would be a much riskier move for him than Rivers for a few reasons, as well as what Aran eluded to.
1. Drummond apparently likes the "Blake Griffin plan" of coming back for another year, but the difference there is that Blake Griffin never had a questionable motor or maturity. I had high hopes for Perry Jones with another year of college, and as another guy with a tendency to disappear and not play to his talent level, he's not destroying the Big 12 like he should be this year. Drummond's stock is where it is because of his unlimited potential, but the longer he sticks around the more he will actually have to produce and dominate consistently. I think he would need to really be honest with himself about how serious he is about taking his game to another level before making that move. It's also simple mathematics, with his stock being higher, there is less to gain and more to lose by coming back.
2. Love him or hate him, Rivers is dedicated to the game and wants to be great. Although he's on record saying he wants to be a 1 and done, he's also said he wants to be a lottery pick. I also think he's more focused on his lasting legacy than a typical kid. I don't think he's made a decision yet by any means and will probably give it an honest look depending on how he finishes the year. Going off his history, he would go into the offseason hungry and want to come back as the best player in the nation if he opted for another year. The only question with him is in regards to how much he'd be willing to hurt his team to accomplish that.
I honestly feel that any players on the level of Drummond or Rivers should be kept in the current year's mock draft. Unless it is a 70-30 he isn't coming out scenario, we should be looking at where the players will go in the draft this year if they do come out. I think Rivers/Drummond are 50/50 on coming out and therefore should stay in 2012.
@NickWayne87 mock drafts are only to keep viewers who visit mock draft sites excited about the up coming draft. How many mock draft are right on from the starting of season to the end of the season? Even on the day of the draft things happen and moves go down. Your opinion any facts so let them go!
I made a thread about it when he was first moved to 2013, should've never done that he's coming out....and oh yeah aran let me help you out a bit, i don't care what you've heard, read, or who you've talked to Austin Rivers is coming out too so quit flip flopping him. He was one of those "ready or not here I come" players from the get-go i could sense that in him.