[binetParticipant]

 This site new mock has been posted and apparently jumped into the Lonzo Ball hype.

I honestly like him but think there is no way he is going number 1. He fits very few teams with bad records this season (I see Dallas, Minnesota, New Orleans and Miami as only struggling teams that would consider him #1 potentially…).

UCLA won but he lost his matchup against Fox during the game against Kentucky.

 

 

 

[Andv1 WaitingParticipant]

 Top 8 teams that could be vying for the number 1 pick:

Philly-They will probably draft the best available: Combo guards/SG or SF assuming the Simmons P.G rumors are true. This would make taking Ball here really unlikely

Nola: I could see Ball going here if they got number 1 but honestly they need everything that is not at A.D’s position.

T-wolves: I see them taking the Best available  SG,Sf or PF to fill their needs unless a PG really blows them away by being able to shoot the ball amazingly and playing Thibs level defense right away. But I think Thibs would rather get his future back up or starting PG via Free agency …

Miami: They could take Ball number 1 this would also open them up to make a goran dragic trade to gain further assets.

Suns: Same as Miami this opens them up to trade away one of Bledsoe or Knight(which ever one wasn’t going to be the 6th man/has greater value) and have a team that suits their time line alot better. 

Mavs need anything not at whatever position Harrison barnes is playing next season so ball could go number 1

Boston via brooklyn: Could happen but hard to say with them as you never know what Danny A wants to do with their pick..He could trade it and pick Ball for the team that wants their pick,take the best available player for a position of need which could be PG for all we know as they could trade Smart/I.T…

Wizards could trade Wall for a big haul and select  Ball with their pick.Because they are in position where they need to figure out soon before they waste John Walls  deal and he bails for nothing due to them under achieveing..

But this is what I make of Ball so far: Good B-ball IQ,Reasonably atheletic,Willing passer,Team player,Wants to win and even though his shooting mechanics look weird for some reason they work..Only thing I am a little concerned about him though is this his defense at the next level and will his shot work in the NBA/need a major over haul when he makes the NBA? 

 

 

 

 

 

[binetParticipant]

 I just don’t see Phoenix taking Ball over whoever seem to be the best prospect at SF. All 3 of Jackson,Tatum and Isaac have shown really good flashes so far and their game seem to fit to their roster needs. By the end of the season, I am pretty sure at least one of them will be a promising enough talent for Phoenix to take him over Fultz. Philly taking Okafor and letting Devin Booker slip has already proven that allegedly "best prospect available" over team needs (with a decent prospect) is just stupid.

Trading your PG when everybody is drafting one and guys like Jrue Holiday will be very available in FA seems unrealistic imo also.

 

 

[ChewyParticipant]

 But both Simmons and Ball are elite passers and smart players. I’m sure they could find a way to fit together. Both are willing passers, so playing both would drastically imporve ball movement.

[binetParticipant]

 I would have to see PG Simmons before having a final thought on this but I think Ball is not a perimeter go-to-guy and fultz is. Fultz appears to be a capable passer as well for your ball movement as well.

Philadelphia lacks reliable go-to scorers right now and I honestly don’t know how Simmons will play this role. Right now Embiid is the go-to guy and he honestly is not very reliable in the clutch (mostly because he is still a rookie learning and because no other are able to carry the team) making his multiple tos to double team etc.. If Simmons is also inside as a go-to guy I don’t think it solves the problem of ‘TJ obviously trying to pass the ball to Embiid 1:30 left on the clock…Turnover’ the team has in close games. 

I expect Simmons to be a great P&R guy in the clutch, but honestly that relies on him truly ending up as a PG.

The way I see things for the sixers are: 1)Simmons can’t realistically play PG, team need a PG go-to-scorer, not Ball. 2) Simmons can be a great PG, sixers do not need Ball who basically would be a worse at everything (but shooting if Ball continues, but I don’t trust his form like many here) Simmons and need an secondary ballhandler who is a knock-down shooter at the 2.

In both cases Fultz seems way better imo, even if Ball ends up a better player (which I doubt is possible), he just does not seem to be a great fit alongside Ben.

 

 

[ChewyParticipant]

 certaintly gives the Sixers some room to go more of a combo guard route with their PG position. I haven’t watched more than 8 minutes of Fultz, but everything I’ve read says he is the one bright spot for Wash. 

I wouldn’t like Fox or Smith next to Ben. I like both Ball and Fultz, and maybe Monk depending of drafting position.

 

[Andv1 WaitingParticipant]

@ binet

 

You could be right the Suns could take the best Sf,however it depends on how high they are on T.J Warren( He is giving them 17 point,1-2 dimes and about 4 boards a game when healthy). Also Bledsoe as good as he is the primary concerns would be health and does he fit the Suns time line..Knight falls more into the 6th man/ may not suit time line also.. Hence they may take a flier on a pass first PG that can get their offensive options going better maybe-Booker,T.J,Chriis,Bender and Len(if kept)..While gaining further needs by making that trade: Who knows maybe they could get above Sf’s in a trade for bledsoe/knight if team is a fringe contender(With a top 10 pick) that wants a vet rather than rookie.

Futlz is probably a combo guard at the next level and do you really want to stunt Bookers growth by taking him? Well unless you are suggesting he is going to be your 6th man? If Philly gets number 1 he could definitely get taken by them though as they need shooters..

As for trading away your PG is all dependent on your timeline as some teams need to hit partial reset to suit their current timeline better or add a vet rather than youth: This years draft PG wise has maybe 4 top level pgs in it: Ball,Fox,Smith and maybe one other that may come up through the ranks/play pg at next level.. That leaves a lot of teams that may want/need a better PG come free agency/ draft time if they hope to upgrade that position..

For example if the Kings some how keep there top 10 pick they  may make a trade of bledsoe for their pick to keep Boogie happy and help him sign on again..

 

 

  

 

 

 

[binetParticipant]

 Good points.

I still feel that like you suggest Fultz seems to be such an incredible fit for the sixers that they might give you a decent package to move to 1 and get him, if your target is Ball or various other guys (like the SFs) a 76ers package might be the best way to go. At this point I think you could trade Fultz for whichever the best pick the 76ers have, Okafor and Saric. For any team not targeting Fultz, that seem to be a great deal (especially with Philly pick certainly still top 5) given how deep this draft is.

 

[Sewok15Participant]

 Every time I watch Ball play I like him more and more. His shot isn’t pretty but he appears to be a knock down shooter with NBA range. I don’t think it is out of the realm of possibility that he will be the consensus #1 pick by the end of the season…no matter what your teams roster looks like.

I can’t wait to watch him and Fultz go head to head because that will really be the determining factor for me deciding which prospect I prefer. 

 

 

[binetParticipant]

 Not sure that would prevent you for loving Ball even if he does not shine then. After all, like many of us you are higher on Ball than Fox despite the Kentucky game matchup. Part of this is because Ball secured the win of course but who are we kidding? Washington is never beating UCLA this year. 

[Sewok15Participant]

 I have Ball and Fultz on a different level than Fox. Fox is a great defender but the other two have the potential to be special offensively. I am more concerned with how they play against one another than the result of the game being that UCLA is loaded with multiple future NBA players. 

I might have worded it incorrectly because that matchup won’t be the be all end all between the two prospects in my mind but at this point I really have them neck and neck at 1 and 2 so it will be a big factor. 

 

 

[SeattleSuperChronicsParticipant]

 Well I called that weeks ago. He is what we all thought Exum was going to be. He would be perfect with Simmons and and embiid.

[Magic JordanParticipant]

 I see a lot of discussion above about Simmons fit and being a PG.  Let’s be clear here.  Simmons is not the passer that Ball is.  He may be flashier, but Simmons makes passes looking to get assists.  Ball makes the right pass almost every time.  He gets rid of it extremely quick if it makes sense to whether it leads to an assist or not.  Simmons could give two shits about a hockey assist.

[Andrew1984Participant]

Lonzo Ball to Dallas at No.1, No. 2, or wherever they end up, seems like a perfect fit.

He’d put up the assist numbers that they haven’t had since Jason Kidd and later Steve Nash. He’d be a face-of-the-franchise to replace the outgoing Dirk Nowitzki. The pieces they’ve added would fit nicely around him; Justin Anderson, Wes Matthews, Harrison Barnes, etc. He’d be the must-see attraction that would have Mark Cuban salivating, with dollar signs in his eyes.

[HitsterParticipant]

 Ball would be a natural fit for Dallas, they could effectively hand him the keys from Day one.

T-Wolves already have a large number of ball handlers already so I don’t see any logic in them taking him.

NOP could use Ball but would need to give him time.

Miami have Dragic, would they get takers for the asking price they want.

Philly want to try Simmons as PG/Point Forward so would need to give him time. Taking Ball gives them another creative guy but if both Ball and Simmons need to have the basketball in their hands to be most effective then Philly may look for a SG or a PG who plays off ball if Simmons becomes a point forward.

Phoenix will likely be looking for a SF or PG in draft so Ball could be an option.

If Washington decided to cash in on Wall then they would want a hefty return given his very cap friendly salary and it having another two years to run after this season. Ball would only be an option if Wall was moved or asked to be moved.

I can see Ball going top 5 when the draft takes place but I would have Jackson and possibly Fultz ahead of him now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[BeastMode716Participant]

 at the next level for the same reason I did not like Brandon Ingram over Ben Scrizzle last year – players who lack that Elite Freak athleticism struggle to create their own shot & at the NBA level you have to have that skill set in your back pocket to bail you out in order to be an Elite level Super Star 

And Elite level super star is what a team expects w/ the #1 pick. Look how Ingram is struggling to hit shots (35% fg% & 29% 3pt%) & D’Lo Russell too (40% fg% & 35% 3pt%) – & both those players will be Very good NBA players as they grow but neither will ever crack that super star category & it kills me to admit that b/c I’m waering my Lakers gear right now.

Ball is in that same category. He’s got great height for the PG position but he’s already been moved to 2 guard at UCLA b/c he just can not create space to either pass or shoot off the dribble. If he is struggling w/ that at the college level the Pro’s will only be tougher. So he’s Def a top 10 pick but not #1

 

 

[binetParticipant]

I also think athleticism is important but it’s not more important than skillset at the end of the day.

Lonzo Ball is not an elite athete like Wiggins was, nor even an overpar NBA athlete like DeAaron Fox probably is, but he is not terrible, he is better than average at the NCAA level and should be slightly below average at the NBA level, but not necessarily preventing him to be good. His 6-6 size even with his subpar wingspan is interesting and he is not less athletic than successful guards Goran Dragic right now or Steve Nash before, and you can add some aging players to that mix. If he is as talented as some think he is Dragic’s athleticism is enough since he is supposed to be way better at everything.

My concerns are more directly tied to his game, which to me seems to be more pass&3, with no midrange game(does not matter much), and no pick&roll game or ability to drive in the paint whatsoever adding to his suspicious kind of slow shooting form. 

His vision remains his main skill but it seems embellished by this UCLA team that shoots and moves way better than NCAA average. He is able to see the open man yes, but many other prospect would also if there were that many open men in their teams during games.

He also was not the guy who carried the team against Kentucky (most NBA relevant game so far), actually fellow freshmen TJ Leaf and Ike Anigbogu made more clutch and important plays.

So far his shooting is great enough that I still see him being good in the NBA, but he is not that far from being a Ricky Rubio who can’t defend, should his shot stop to fall.

 

 

[HitsterParticipant]

Ball is primarily a pass first PG who a team would want to create the shooting opportunities for his team mates so being an elite athlete isn’t really an issue. But being a good 3 point shooter and a useful defender are always a big plus as teams have to close him down and it helps spread the play and being a defensive liability is always a concern.

Whoever drafts him will probably need to have some good shooters around him but in the right situation, Ball could be an ideal pick.

[MatosParticipant]

Let me make this clear: Philly didnt nab Simmons with the intention to not have him develop a jump shot. Him not having a jump shot is the only reason one would hesitate to nab Ball. Ball is an unselfish player who is just looking for W’s and not prioritizing his stat line over the success of his team.

With that being said, I still stick by my notion that Josh Jackson is a generational talent. I truly see him being a special player in the NBA. Would love for the sixers to pick him up. With PGs loading up the first round, they’ll have plenty of opportunity to grab a PG with LA’s pick. But with their pick, you have to go JJ.

 

[binetParticipant]

 Let me make this clear. Philly did not draft Okafor with the intentions to not have Noel develop a jump shot. Him not being able to defend was the only reason to hesitate. Okafor was a…

Philly won’t draft again players that are hypothetic fit and hypothetic "best available". If they had gone obvious fit in 2015 they would have drafted Booker. Sure, that’s a miss on Porzingis but that’s still way better than Okafor.

It’s a deep enough draft so that they can pick a guy that fits alongside Simmons and Covington in the perimeter.

 

 

 

 

[MatosParticipant]

 If you think Covington is a piece that they are trying to fit around, you are sadly mistaken my friend.

[binetParticipant]

 I don’t.

He just actually is their 2nd most productive player right now. When Simmons comes back and Saric begins to figure things out more that will not be the case anymore, but he certainly will still be there next year and still play big minutes.

 

 

[BeastMode716Participant]

 which is incredibly rare. Originally I thought Ball would be a bad fit for Phila b/c I figured Ball would only be effective w/ the ball in his hands but he struggled w/ the athleticism of opponents at the Div 1 level & UCLA moved him to more of a combo guard role where in the 1/2 court he is the 2/sg but in tranisition b/c he is such a good rebounder & outlet passed he’s been given the green light to do his thing.

What has really been impressive to me is that Ball did not pout when primary pg duties were taken away, he just became an Absolute stud 2 guard. And that’s why I have changed my mind about fitting w/ Phila

Simmons & Ball have similar ability to rebound at an elite level & make jaw dropping passes in fast break / transition. Where Simmons sets himself above Ball is in the 1/2 sets that dominate NBA playoff basketball. Simmons has elite athleticism so he can break down his man off the dribble & either get his own shot or attack the rim which draws a double – he just happens to prefer to pass in those situations where most players at that very elite level go full scoring mode. I disagree that Ball is a better passer than Ball. On the Herd show last month Chriss Broussard claimed several GM’s, scouts & coaches have told him that Simmons is the best passer in the NBA right now & the closest thing they have seen to Magic since Magic. I know that sounds crazy but I have a lot of faith in Broussard & it seems even more credible when you consider that Broussard has evicerated the Sixers over the last 3 years by vehemtly disagreeing w/ their tanking plan.

All that aside, & no matter who anyone likes better Ball & Simmons are both elite distributors & Ball’s incredible play as a 2 guard by taking advantage of open looks by either shooting 3’s or attacking the rim b/c his pg has drawn the double team would seem to indicate that he Would be a great fit on Phila. My goodness, I could not even imagine an unselfish backcourt of Simmons & Ball w/ that Monster Embiid on the block & also adding a Johnathan Isaac or Jayson Tatum if they get the Lakers pick would be scary. 

I’m confident about Simmons stroke long term b/c we forget that Unibrow’s shot was Completely broken when he entered the NBA & the NBA level coaching completely rebuild his shot. Simmons shot looks like it just needs tweeking & might more of a confiendence thing. I’m older & I remember Magic having a similar game in that he would Always drive & dish b/c no one could stop him. Magic actually shot something like 19% from 3 pt range his first few years in the NBA. But as his game matured he developed that 3pt shot b/c defenders would play off him & Magic learned to punish them. Simmons is such a smart player & so team oriented & his work ethic is already impressive considering he lived in Cleveland all summer & worked w/ King James & his crew & their hard core work ethic is legendary when Simmons could have spent those months partying. 

 

 

 

 

[Hype Machine]

 Lonzo Ball will be as good as Kobe Bryant and is the best American prospect since Oden and Durant.

It takes a lot for me to overcome my anti-american bias, so u know this guys the real deal. 

Easy #1 choice for me regardless of who gets the pick, with Jackson being another player worthy of top 3 pick most years.

Will win 3 MVPs alongside Simmon’s 4. These 2 guys along with Porzingis will define a generation.

 

[Andrew1984Participant]

I am definitely a Lonzo supporter, however, if I had to offer one criticism, it’s his insistence on making highlight reels. He seems nearly incapable of coming off a pin-down and catching-and-shooting a basic 15-footer from the elbow. In that sense he reminds me a little bit of White Chocolate Jason Williams. His vision, range, and talent were undeniable, but the showboat mentality was something he really needed maturity to overcome. He eventually did (kinda), but I do have those same concerns with Lonzo. In college he can get away with it, but in the NBA it results in TOs, low FG percentage, and failure to convert at critical times in games. It becomes fair to wonder if players like that are more committed to looking cool than winning games.

[khaled_a_dParticipant]

I think this is sort of Derrick Williams bold statement from nbadraft.net
If people remember almost same time 6 years ago this site has put DWill as the 1st pick and they were the 1st to put him really high.their valuation for him in the draaft board was correct but wasn’t the 1st overall pick at the end. I think it was kind of a statement that he is a player they value in the draft board more than the others.
This year seem the same,Ball is rarely in top 3 in mock drafts but they are moving him to top pick. I think he won’t end up being 1st but with the way he is playing he will be surely top 3 pick if he continues like that
As for the Mavs,most of Mavs fan are higher on Fultz,Donnie and Finley scouted him personally,Dennis Smith is popular too and rumors he is very high on the Mavs list but not sure how very high are we talking. But Ball has been earning more and more fans in the past couple of weeks.
Personally I see him as a franchise PG not as a franchise player. He would fit with Rick Carlisle as PG who control the offense and knock down 3 which are both really needed for RC different systems when it come to PG. But I don’t see him as our new face of franchise.

[HitsterParticipant]

 The Mavs look like this season may be one they want to forget but I’d back their staff to make a good choice on whoever they draft. I could see Donnie, Rick and co getting a load of players in and working them out. The Mavs will almost have a free choice of who they draft positionally if they went for BPA as the likes of Josh Jackson could play around Harrison Barnes and develop behind Wes Matthews for a year or two.

I can see Dallas looking for a backcourter personally but they will also likely take a close look at Isaac and Giles when he is fit. A lot will of course depend on where they end up in the draft but if they want a PG then they should be in a good position to get one.

 

[r377Participant]

I watched him play for the first time about a week ago.

I am not sold on Lonzo Ball as yet. Yes, decent handle and shoots good % but he doesn’t take the ball to hole and when he does he isn’t a great finisher or passes out. His unorthodox jump shot works ok in NCAA but might not be as good in the pros against bigger and better PG’s.

[Author]

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