The new kings ownership doing a fantastic job
The new ownership of the Sacramento Kings really wants to win, and they're doing a fantastic job rebuilding that roster. Drafting Ben McLemore was a no brainer and he has a chance to be a star. Then, they traded a future second round pick for Luc Mbah Moute, who they later dealt for Derrick Williams, a former #2 pick in the draft. Basically, they turned a second round pick into a player who still has potential to be really good.
This last move though, is what I really applaud. Some will not agree with me, but I think this will go down as one of the best trades of the year. The thing that I like about the Rudy Gay trade is that it's pretty much zero risk. If he declines that player option, it was just a salary dump. If he accepts that option, they get a borderline superstar for one more year.
That core of Ben McLemore/Rudy Gay/DeMarcus Cousins to go along with some great role players (Thomas, D-Will, Gray, Landry) will make some serious noise.
I applaud the effort the kings have put forth to put a entertaining product on the court. I just didnt think trading to become a low lotto team in this draft was for the best of the francise.
I'm not questioning what they did before, but this last trade honestly doesn't make much sense to me. It seems like they're a little confused on what their plans are (to tank or not to tank). And by the way "if he declines that player option, it was just salary dump. If he accepts that option, they get a borderline superstar for one more year"...
First of all, he's never coming out of that option. Look, I know that after the Kirilenko thing this summer we have to be ready for everything; and I know that any doubt on Rudy's decision making it's legit just after watching his shot chart. But basketball and shot selection is one thing, money and contracts is another. I'm calling a psychiatrist for him if he comes out. And no, what the hell, he's nowhere close to be a borderline superstar. He's a chunking talented player who thinks to be a superstar without any concrete fact backing his firm belief. He's a guy who's scoring 20 every night, but on 25-30 shots.
And it's not like they got rid of big lengthy contract. Both Patterson and Vasquez's deals expire this season, they (now the Raptors) have to decide if they want to pick their fourth year exception and neither of them is really expensive, then again, it's on the team. Salmons' contract expires this year, well, there's a team option for the next one, then again, if anyone is picking that option we're back at the psychiatrist. Hayes has the only bad contract, since he doesn't play much but still gets roughly $6 million per year. But as bad as it is, it expires last year and it's not $19-20 million Gay is getting for another year.
The Kings will be over the cap next year and they're still a bad team (they also might have to pay luxury tax if they want to keep Thomas). Does anyone believe they're making the playoff this year with Gay? I hardly think so. If any I think Gay is detrimental to a basketball team right now, so maybe I'm missing the point and this is the ultimate tanking move (get a guy with me first attitude in a team with many guys with me first attitude and let his shot selection piss anybody else off to no end, especially your "moody" franchise player). But since I doubt they did that on purpose, I really don't understand what they have in their mind. And even if Gay starts playing like he did in his best days (usually players tend to be more disciplined for a while after they get traded) in this year western conference they still have very few chances of making the playoffs. And I don't think winning some more games and getting a 10-11 draft pick it's such a great idea. I don't know, they're probably trying to win a few more games just to reassure their fans, after all the talks about a possible relocation (but their bigs rotation is very short now). Maybe they want to trade Vasquez away and give Thomas and McLemore bigger responsabilities (though bringing a trigger happy volume scorer isn't necessarily the greatest way to do it) and finally play Williams at 4 trading some bigs.
I think Zach Lowe nailed it as usual on Grantland www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/85058/a-new-king-what-the-rudy-gay-trade-means-for-toronto-and-sacramento. I really agree with everything he says and also I think there are some interesting considerations about Gay opting out or not
Rudy Gay's not a borderline superstar. What statistics say he is, other than that he's paid like one? He's never even been an all-star and what Toronto got in return means his value has hit rock bottom or near it.
It's not a terrible trade for Sacramento especially if Gay opts out, but if he opts in they're paying $19 million for a negative, one that creates obstacles to keep Isaiah Thomas around past this season. That trade wasn't zero risk, even if Sacramento is clearly assuming he opts out.
Gay and Cousins are both cancers to their team.
If Cousins is suppose to be so great (like a lot of users think) why is he not making the Kings are better team ?
The season before he got there they went 25-57. The next few season with Cousins 24-58, 22-44, 28-54.
Gay and Cousins are not good leaders, having them both on the same team is not going to get the Kings to the playoffs.
I think the Kings tie with the Knicks for having the worst management in the league.
Kings haven't been that bad. Past years yes they made terrible moves. It's not easy turning around a franchise that bid on Travis Outlaw, re-signed Thompson to his current contract, getting Salmons, etc.
The trade for Derrick Williams, even if next year he costs over $6 million, was solid though. If Gay leaves after this season, that was a nice move as well. If the Kings plan on keeping Gay long-term though, well, that's a disaster both in the short term and long term. There's several reasons teams weren't lining up to take Gay, a 27-year-old about to enter his prime.
New management isn't worse than the old, though who knows what'll happen this summer. They have quite a ways to go if they want to top Billy King though.
If Kyrie is supposed to be so great why has he not made the Cavs better than basically a .300 team for his career?
If Chris Paul is supposed to be so great why has he not made the finals once?
If Kevin Durant is supposed to be so great why has he not won a finals yet? He has Westbrook, that should be plenty to win a title?
If basketball is supposed to be a TEAM sport, where 5 guys play together at one time, why do people put all the blame on the team's best player? Guess it's his fault he doesn't have good players on his team too? Not to say they are free of critisism or any fault, but take Cousins away from the Kings, and Sacramento would be a whole hell of a lot worse, which is hard to imagine.
I will take all the negs just like when I predicted Amare and Melo would not get the job done in New York.
This isn't Fantasy Basketball where you play for stats and add a 20ppg scorer and think you can win. You need team chemistry, defence, teamwork and leadership. Throw in a good attitude also, Gay and Cousins lack most of these qualities, if not all of them.....
Predicting Melo and an already-hurt-a-million-times Amare not winning a title in New York wasn't exactly going out on a limb.
Do you forget how many kids on here are fair weather fans ? There were numerous posts and hype about the Knicks making it to the Eastern Conference Finals with Melo and Amare (which is what I went against). What about all the posts about Melo being one of the best players in the league.
Melo is a melanoma (a cancer waiting to happen) Now the Knicks aren't doing too good all the Melo fans have jumped ship and Melo is being exposed for the player he is. Melo like Gay and Cousins are not leaders and not team players. All the time they are "the man" they will never win - they need to be a second or third option on a team.
I respectfully disagree with your opinion. I think all the players on the Kings have been sandbagged by the bottom of the barrel scum known as the Maloofs. I agree with you that chemistry is a problem but when you go into each season knowing the owners aren't even trying to make anything better and the GMs hands are tied it leaves a bad taste in the mouths of the team knowing they are essentially being set up to fail. Make no mistake about it either, the Kings were being set up to fail by management not even attempting to sign decent players(when they would sign players it was low end rotation players) and selling off draft picks for cash because the Magoofs were hemorraging money.
I believe defense and teamwork stem from, again, the Maloofs not willing to attempt to get a good coach. I refuse to believe Paul Weshphal is a good coach and his "offense" of "just run" is ludicrous and no way to help develop any young player(I think this point in time hurt Tyreke the most and is why he never developed into something more). The same thing can be said about Keith Smart as his small ball run-and-gun offense when the Kings simply weren't talented or developed enough to work in that system. But now that Malone is in with the Kings and actually being a coach and helping the Kings develop it shows massively. Cousins has been amazing this year with a system in place, the coaches trusting him and giving him more offensive responsibility, and his defense has been better(around average or a bit below) but that is something that is being worked on and kudos for him for buying in and attempting to improve(needs to work on trying more on the defensive end too).
Cousins attitude I believe has changed drastically this season. He tries his best to keep his cool but let's be honest, he gets a lot of calls against him based on his reputation alone. I was watching a game(against Brooklyn I think) and he got a tech for something small and Joey Crawford wound up recinding it mid game because he knew it wasn't a big deal(the other team still got the shot though). Does he still whine? Of course, but a lot of other teams' stars do it but since they win it's ok.
The only one I psuedo agree with you on is leadership. Cousins is not a born leader but that gets into the argument of whether a leader is born or made? I see no reason Cousins can't be made into a leader if the front office actually pushes for a good team and a good coaching staff is in place.
Obviously this post is about Cousins. As a guy from Tennessee who watched Rudy Gay I completely agree with you and I think he is a third option that is being paid like a first option. In my perfect world he takes Thornton's spot off the bench so that he doesn't break the Cousins-Thomas chemistry but with his salary there is no way that happens.
It'll be really intersting to see how this trade pans out in terms of winners and losers. I must say though Gay is NOT a borderline superstar. It's frankly a stretch to say he's a borderline all star. He has all the tools and I think actually tries harder on defense than people give him credit for, several times this year I've seen him really crash the boards when he's shots not going because he want to help the team. But really, he makes extremely poor decisions offensively and is a ball-stopper and is overpayed by about 7-8 million a year.
To some point I agree with CavFanPR but I'm still a little bit confused about what the Kings are doing.
First of all, I totally agree that the D-Will trade was an absolutely steal if you consider they got LRMAM for a second rounder. What the Kings need is a Power Forward who is not standing in the way of DMC down low. In a perfect scenario Williams is that player who can shoot it from the outside.
Then they had this logjam at the 2 and 1 and no real starting caliber player at the 3. With Salmons gone and Rudy in, it's absolutely clear who will start at the wing.
Then they have Thornton and B-Mac at the 2. Ben is playing very good since he has been starting and is tearing it in Dezember.
What I like most about this trade is that Thomas is now the clear 1st option as the point guard. He leads the league in 4th quarter scoring!
Yes Isaiah is their starting point no question, but he will get fewer touches than he did before the trade as Gay will command a lot more posessions than Salmons ever did.
What concernes me most about this whole situation in Sacto is the fact that they have absolutely no defensive identity anymore. Gay is a liability if he doesn't really plays hard what he does way to often. Thornton, Ben and Jimmer are horrible to unproven defenders. Thomas is holding his own pretty well but depending on the matchup he sometimes has zero chance against bigger guards. Williams, Acy and Thompson are average at best. The only player I see having a good defensive impact is Landry who I always like very much but he is a tweener himself. If he plays well, Williams will be stuck again on the bench.
I see that the Kings want to give this team an identity and for sure they are much more talented and athletic now but this won't win them much games. If Cousins is the only one on the court playing defense this says a lot about this team and I don't want to see his expression and frustration if he gets in foul trouble cause no one is defending the paint.
At leat they are trying to build something and maybe they aren't done dealing players and picks!? Oh and btw the West got stronger again with this trade which is crazy!
I meant borderline all star. My bad.
What I like is that they cleared some room for their core guys. Thomas and Derrick Williams can see more minutes and keeps pressure off Mclemore to score. No Gay isn't the answer but it's a sign that this team isn't afraid to mix it up. Gay for this year and next max. I also think we may see Gay at some 4 to spread the floor for Demarcus. This team isn't a playoff team but it's showing the fan base they will make moves and that they are committed to the future. So more of a mixed bag for me. Don't think Gay is a good fit but he is a more well known name that the kings haven't had in awhile.
Do you guys realize the kings are on the west coast right and in the pacific div? stop saying their going to go up in the lottery their not making the playoffs one bit this year or next year. The lakers, warriors and clippers will be competitive the suns and kings will fight for the bottom feeder title. If you looked the suns are ahead as of now so relax with the " their hurting their draft position" because there aren't in no way ,shape , or form.
The Kings got rid of the Salmons and Hayes contracts. Both were for another 2 seasons: the same length as Gay's contract. (Assuming he picks up the player option which he most certainly will).
That's a huge plus for the Kings. While I'm happy that Gay is out of Toronto, I'm not sure having Salmons and Hayes on the payroll is necessarily a step in the right direction.
Salmons' contract has a team option, they could opt out this summer paying him $1 million, which is very reasonable. So next year they would've had only Hayes' contract, for roughly $6 million. Now they are going to pay more than $19 million.
Also, even if they did heavy drugs and picked Salmons' option, his contract and Hayes' would've made a total of roughly $13 million. I don't really see where the heavy plus is, cap wise.
By subtraction with that trade. Too many of those rotation players werent contributing, with a shortened bench and as long as Rudy buys in, this isn't as bad as a team with as it was with out him.
I am in complete agreement, players who deserve more minutes are going to get them and it will show.
There has to be a pecking order in professional basketball. Hardest thing to do is to look a man in his eye and say "you're better than me, lead us" especially when it's a close call. If Gay shoots 12 per game and decides to play defense then maybe the Kings can win their fair share. BUT with that said Buggy is toxic.
^^ Boogie* damn autocorrect
I wish people would try and present a valid argument as to why Demarcus is "toxic" for the Kings, mostly so the people who actually watch him play basketball could explain to them why they are wrong.
I'm not a Kings fan. I'm a Raptor's fan. This was a terrible move by the Kings.
I was actually someone who liked Gay coming into TO originally. But no one is happier to see Gay leave than I am. Once you see him brick his first 6 layups, and cough the ball up in the lane 10 times a game, and not see the wide open three point shooter in the corner, not give up the ball to the outlet man on the fast break, etc etc....
Sorry Sacramento, you just got poned!
Good news is Gay played his best ball for TO right after he was traded there. I imagine he will look pretty good the first month or two. Then watchout!
If you didn't like Rudy doing that then good luck with Salmons...
I think the Kings made a move in the right direction with this trade, the way the 4 players they traded were playing they had no future with the Kings. The money tied up in the deal will have no real significance because the Kings are not going to be drawing any UFA's this coming off season. Why not give Gay his shot to redeem himself, if he doesn't then no harm no foul. Plus this trade creates more playing time for players who deserve it but were not getting it due to the log jam of players the Kings had.
This trade is good for both teams.
The point about Salmons would be valid, except that he will not be playing anywhere near as much as Rudy did. May not play much at all.
In reality Gay being a better fit somewhere else could happen. And the Kings are a better fit for him for sure. Can't be any worse than it was in Toronto. Just don't expect too much value for the 35 million.
As far as being a bordderline All-Star... that is what we were told everyday of his tenure as a Raptor. Not even close to that, though he should be with his skill.
All I will say, is don't get your hopes up too much. Right now - after trading away Bargnani and Gay withing 6 months - is the most excited I have seen Raptor fans in about 5 seasons. And they all know the team is going to be terrible for a while longer. Maybe if Rudy were not going to plug up 20 million in salary next year my take would be different - but probably it would be the same.
Dude takes 25 shots a game at 38% and does not make his team mates better.
Let's not exaggerate here, he doesn't take 25 shots a game.
Per basketball reference, he shoots 18 field goals per game. He's shot 25 or more just 3 times.
Also, can I say hooray for BBR? It makes looking up stats soooooo much easier.
Let's not exaggerate here, he doesn't take 25 shots a game.
Per basketball reference, he shoots 18 field goals per game. He's shot 25 or more just 3 times.
Also, can I say hooray for BBR? It makes looking up stats soooooo much easier.
I think the trade for Gay was excellent. I think that even with gay, the Kings will still hover around top 7 in the lottery.. This trade shows that the Kings are making an effort, and giving up a few role players for a borderline allstar is not bad in my opinion. If he can improve his play in Sacramento he would increase his trade value, which would make him a good asset dor Sacramento.
I don't think this was a bad trade for either team. The Raptors are clearly rebuilding and Ujiri really knows what he's doing getting rid of Gay and Bargnani.
But for the Kings, it was a good trade as well. They got Rudy Gay at a discounted price. Sure, they're going to pay him this season and only about 13m since we're a quarter of the way into the season, which provides even better value but even if he declines his option, the Kings were going to let go of Salmons, Patterson, Hayes, and Vasquez anyway.
Vasquez, Patterson, and Salmons would have given the Kings 13mil in cap relief at the end of the season and since each of them were backups, they were likely not going to be brough back, especially with the fact that the Kings already have too many PGs and two quality PFs.
Not only that but they also got rid of Hayes contract of 5.7m and 5.9m next season. So once again, even if Rudy Gay opts out of his deal, the Kings are going to get 17mil cap relief at the same time. Cap relief that they were going to get anyway, so why not take a chance with Rudy Gay?
It's a win for the Raptors but a "nothing to lose" for the Kings. Good trade for both teams.
how does the rudy gay trade have zero risk? he's due to make almost 18 million this year.. and gm's were saying they probably wouldnt even offer him the MLE. im sorry but 18 million is a TON of money, and of course he will opt in to his contract if he's going to make 19 million in a year.
Only way he doesn't take the option is if he knows he can get at least 4 years at 13 or 14+ ie if Sac offers it to him. Otherwise, why would he not take the money?
Yeah, he's due 18mil this year but we're a quarter into the season, meaning a quarter of that is already paid for.
You do realize they receive checks just like everyone else right? They aren't paid a large lump sum at the end of the season....
Meaning the Kings would only pay him 12mil, give or take a mil.
Now would you rather pay Patterson, Salmons, Hayes, and Vasquez nearly 18mil or pay Rudy Gay 12 mil?
Just a quick little question for King's fans who might be excited about this trade....
How many Raptor's games have you seen in the last 10 months? If it is less than 5 or 6, I would wait and see what happens before likeing this trade.
Rudy helped Raptor fans enjoy watching basketball for about 2 or 3 weeks last year.
Then he made us hate it.
Rudy didn't call the plays. If you want to hate someone for ruining Raptors basketball, blame Dwane Casey.
Agreed, why do you think the Grizzlies did better in the playoffs without him ? They soon learnt how much of a cancer he is before they traded him...
Too many kids on here play fantasy basketball - they think having 2 X 20ppg scorers is going to help them win. Rudy Gay shoots 39%
I think it's overplayed about how much of a chucker Rudy is. Until recently, he was solid, efficiency-wise. That happens, sometimes, though. Monta Ellis was a model of efficiency until he got to Milwaukee. One or two bad seasons can ruin your reputation.
The Kings I'd assume were approached by both the T-Wolves and the Raptors for the recent trades and obviously decided to accept. The Kings will be a very much offence based team this year and the lack of defence is a worry but they will be fun to watch.
The Kings obviously went for Williams' upside in that trade and filled their PF need and now have traded a load of role players for Gay and whilst they have taken on a cap hit for next year, will Toronto suddenly become a top FA destination if they are looking to create cap space, I somehow doubt it.
Toronto moved Bargnani and have now moved Gay, so they are probably positioning themselves to tank. The Kings are having a poor season so far and whilst adding scorers may not improve their overall results that much.
Rudy Gay is overpaid for his contributions and is very unlikey to opt out of $19 million next season but the Kings have saved salary this year and at worse have a great expiring deal next year for a 18ppg player who will only be 28 then so could move him via a trade if needed.
Rudy Gay isn't a bad player, he's a very good one but he's not worth $19 million a season, at $10 to $12 milion a season he'd find his true value.
Forget All-Star, Sacramento now has someone qualified to be a starting SF in the NBA for the first time since trading Artest. Even if it's a bit mismatched still, the Kings starting 5 looks like an actual NBA lineup, and as others have indicated, there are now more minutes for some of the young guys like McCallum, who they want to develop.
Plus, I'm fairly sure Rudy Gay can read and knows what is being said about him. Who knows? Maybe he'll come in with a great attitude, accept a role in Malone's system and rejuvenate his career? I like the idea of using him & Williams as interchangeable at the 3-4 based on matchups. It certainly can't be any worse than what has been happening around here lately.
It might cost a few ping-pong balls or maybe a draft spot or two, but there's not that much room to climb in the West anyway, and at some point you need to stop throwing away seasons and start to develop a system and culture that will pay off when the players the team actually covets are starting to come on board. This is still the throwing crap against the wall with high-risk, high-upside type guys to see who might be worth keeping around for the long haul. No one was coming to Sac in 2014 anyway, now they can start to build something people might actually want to become part of in 2015.
Obviously a great trade for Toronto, but it makes sense for the Kings too. It's not like they haven't been talking to just about everyone - they obviously thought this was the best deal they could pull off for the parts they dealt. Plus, there are more moves to come - I'd be shocked if Thompson, Thornton or Fredette are still on the team come March. Hopefully an extra draft pick - even a late first or early second - comes back somehow, some way. Regardless though, I too like what the new Kings management team is doing so far.