Is it Crazy to Think KCP > McLemore
I DON'T THINK SO.
I honestly don't understand all the hype surrounding Ben McLemore as a possible top 3 pick when KCP who is YOUNGER can do EVERYTHING that McLemore can, & is projected to go later in the 1st.
McLemore is 6-5 185 lbs
KCP is 6-5 205 lbs
Both can fly & both have incredible range from behind the arc & gorgeous shots.
McLemore (Freshman) averaged:
-50% FG (198-400)
-42% from 3 (73-174)
-87% from FT (120-138)
KCP (Sophomore SEC Player of the Year) averaged:
-43% FG (186-430) played on a TERRIBLE Georgia team where the defenses focused all on him
-37% from 3 (84-225)
-80% from FT (135-169)
Somebody please fill me in on why a guy who feasted on open shot opportunities in a very well ran offense at Kansas (who may or may not be able to get his own shot & handle the rock effectively) is projected higher than a guy who was the SOLE FOCUS of his teams offense & had to go out every night & work for his points....& is YOUNGER.
and your serious??
No, it's not crazy.
I've been comparing them as prospects.
If KCP was in Kansas and McLemore was in Georgia I would like to see what people would be saying.
They are extremely similar players.
+ Off the ball
- Play Making
- Ball Handling
- Finishing in Traffic
I just don't get why McLemore is considered top 3...
The thing is McLemore is a bigger leaper. ..
KCP can shoot it off the dribble much better than bmac. And I personally like KCP mechanics as well.
I do not think it is crazy because of the parity in this years draft. In the top 10, no single player is that much better than any one else. There are a number of SGs on the same level (or close to it) as McLemore in this years draft that won't cost a top 3 pick. Just to name a few - Oladipo, KCP, Hardaway Jr., Crabbe, Jamaal Franklin, Michael Snaer, Ricardo Ledo. I did not include players like C.J. McCollum, Lorenzo Brown, Archie Goodwin, or Brandon Paul because they are all under 6'5. Another big point, a number of the players I listed had to face defenses focused on stopping them so they have more ability to create their own shots.
McLemore looked great because there were so many other options on his team and Kansas is such a well coached team. Defenses could not focus all their attention on him so he got a ton of good looks and ended up with stellar percentages. Also, Ben never really showed the killer instinct it takes to be great, he never really took over games and carried his team to victory.
I am not saying that KCP or any other SG in the draft will be better than McLemore, I am just saying I won't be surprised if Ben is not the best in the long run.
The difference basically is KCP went to a terrible team, and McLemore went to Kansas.
I actually like B Mac a lot, but I love KCP as a sleeper. He has a lot of tools and could very solid for someone.
Ben Mclemore is a little longer, a little more athletic, and a little bit of a better shooter. But I agree with your premise that McLemore is overrated and KCP is underrated.
All I'm gonna say is that I think Archie Goodwin still is the best SG prospect in the class so that just shows you how wide open this thing is.
For real. And I always thought it was easier to improve your shooting that it was to improve your entire ability to create a shot and handles.
It Archie had a consistent jumpshot god knows how high in mocks he would be... top 5?
Goodwin is super athletic, extremely young, he's still only 18, and despite what his official height will be he possess' a 6'11 wingspan, and guards like Wade, Harden, and Reke have shown just how much of an advantage having a near 7 foot wingspan for a guard can be.
Only matters if you can actually dribble and shoot, Archie currently can't really do either. High risk high reward though.
I still think mclemore is probably gnna be a top overall pick... like ive said before.. if noel was playing I would take him top pick with no hesitation... ive honestly only seen KCP play twice in college ever so I cant even judge... mclemore has all the tools to be a pretty damn good player though... someone about last week was bringing up wes Johnson and how wes Johnson couldn't create off the dribble at all and how it has impacted him up until now.. and we know mclemore isnt a shot creator off the bounce.. I see what they were trying to say but lets not forget that Johnson I think was 23 when he was drafted and mclemore is just 20 so three yrs makes a huge difference in development... I think that or maybe wes Johnson is just a lazy ass and doesn't work on his game
this draft is pretty crap anyways lol, everyone being put higher on the board then they would in a better draft
I've been hoping that KCP flies under the radar enough for the TWolves to snatch him up with whatever their pick will be (8-12). Hopefully playing at Georgia helped him by forcing him to develop parts of his game, while also hurting him by limiting his exposure.
How is KCP defensively? I doubt he was forced to focus on defense very much given he was the only guy who could make a shot for Georgia, and that could be where the difference lies with McLemore and him. McLemore has shown some defensive potential in the passing lanes and the open court where KCP is probably been hiding a bit more because he was needed to score.
I actually think there is an argument that can be made for the two being comparable. McLemore obviously is more athletic and fluid. He looks the part of what an NBA 2 guard should be like, but if he goes to a team where he has to be the man and Caldwell goes to a team (like MN) where he can be more a role player (like Mclemore was this year at Kansas) then people will look at KCP as a more successful pick.
"I doubt he was forced to focus on defense very much given he was the only guy who could make a shot for Georgia, and that could be where the difference lies with McLemore and him. McLemore has shown some defensive potential in the passing lanes and the open court where KCP is probably been hiding a bit more because he was needed to score."
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KCP averages more steals than Bmac.
He was pushed to be a great defender, and he was. He has good lateral quickness and gets on tippy toes when on defense stance, and running. This also helps him get in the passing lanes.
Mclemore is better. He is more athletic, has more strength, a better defender, better shot selection and better teammate.
KCP = shoots too much, doesn't pass the ball enough, needs to get stronger
Goodwin = Better shot creater than BM, KCP , but not as good as jump shot, a little undersized at the SG spot. Also doesn't pass the ball enough and at times wild. Reminds me of a Jordan Crawford
KCP doesn't pass the ball enough?? He did a GREAT job of moving the ball around his sophomore year.
He doesn't. He shot at 43 fg percentage, and jacked up alot of shot vs passing the ball.
Ben Mclemore shot at 49 fg percentage, and passed it at a decent clip a sg should pass the ball at.
And there is no excuses that BM plays for KU. Look at a guy like Cj Mcollum, who also plays for a poor team, also passed to his teammates at a healthy clip.
KCP averaged 1.8apg with a team with less talent, compared Bmac's 2.0apg at Kansas.
The fact that you're saying he; "jacked up alot of shot vs passing the ball" makes me wonder how many games you saw him play.
He did a great job of moving the ball around as opposed to only looking for his own.
This is a down draft, and Ben McLemore may not be an exciting choice for the 1st pick, where franchises are supposedly changed, but you guys are sleeping on him way too much now. He is still the best SG prospect in this draft and I think a lot of you are going to be surprised in just how well his game translates to the uptempo, spacing friendly NBA.
Its not crazy at all. Not that much separation if any between them. I like the fact that KCP played for a worse team because he was forced to create his offense at times when others couldnt provide any. BMac had the luxury of having a lot of help which is why he disappeared at times. I would take KCP as high as #9 in Minny.
McLemore is the better prospect, yes. But the difference between the 2 probably isnt as large as many people think. typically the difference between a top 3 pick and a guy going 10-15 is significant...this case seems different. It shows how this draft is constructed.
Whoever brought up CJ Mccollum made me laugh, the dude is playing in the Patriot League...little different animal than the SEC or Big12 when it comes to being able to trust your teammates to score and make the right plays against their respective opposition.
No kidding, that is exactly why Damian Lillard has played so poorly this year...
The patriot league is worse than SEC and Big12 thus i assume your stating his teammates are not as great , yet Mcollum has a better fg percentage and assists??
Either you are indirectly pumping my point or Mcollum made it much easier for his teammates to score.
I guess you haven't watched Lehigh vs Duke last year. Mcollum is the most talented guard from this draft, don't care if he is from the Russia league. Can score anywhere on the court, pass, play defense, sharpshooter, score in traffic and high end handle/crossover that i haven't seen since Chris Paul.
KCP to me has shown me a player that shoots way too much, doesn't drive and pass enough. Look at his stats, and you see him shooting 19 shots, 17 shots and frequently making 6 -8 shots only. In the nba i see him calming this issue down, but i doubt he will be the "leader" of the team, like Mcollum will be
Fair enough rocketdan9...I will agree to disagree. I see Mcollum as a really good 6th man type guy and Caldwell as a fringe starting role player type. I've been wrong many times, so to be wrong in this case would not come as a shock.
For what its worth, my point with the Patiot league v SEC is that Mcollums teammates arent getting guarded by players that are markedly better then them. Caldwells teammates were. It would be understandable if that gives somebody pause about trusting their teammates and not trying to do too much.
Mcollum may very well be a better shot creator, which would lead me to think his best role would be a Lou Williams type 6th man, while KCP could be a Wes Matthews type guy who is a 4th or 5th option on a good team, but gets his shots more in the flow of an offense.