I think John Wall has a shot to be a lot more Special than Rose...Repost
This thread was made by ghettosermon and I thought he made a lot of good points but people weren't replying to it because it was in the NBA section of the forum. So I decided to repost it in the NBADraft section of the forum so I can hear what everybody has to say about this.
Let me just start off first by respectfully saying that this is just my point of view as a spectator. These are just opinions and there is no definitively right answer until we actual see them on the court a few years down the line. With that said while you never want to base judgments off college play and a few summer league games, but I truly believe that Wall will be better than Rose although I'm definitely the minority with that opinion. Wall ended up leading summer league in points and assists, and was near tops in steals. He really showed how scary he can be because he dominated games despite struggling shooting. The biggest thing holding back Rose is his inability to get to the free throw line. Instead of absorbing contact and going to the line, Rose tries some ridiculous reverse layup or fading shot. He'll make some, but all NBA stars know how to get to the line. John Wall averaged over 10 free throw attempts per game. He really knows how to get to the line. Also shot mechanics wise, he's more impressive than Rose. I also liked how after having 8 and 9 turnover games his first two games, his last two games he had 3 and 2. Shows growth within a week. Then there is the whole intangibles part. I love Rose's maturity and low key demeanor but to be a star PG you need to be more vocal. Rose is not vocal with his teammates, he isn't a good director, and I hardly ever see him making adjustments to his teammates. While it might have been a bit overzealous and early for Wall to do this, I really liked how Wall right out the gates in the first game was already directing his teammates and telling Javale when to set picks and such. Wall is a good floor general and he does wear his emotions on his face at the proper moments which is very important for team morale. While you don't need to be a loud mouth to be a great leader guys like Jason Kidd are constantly working the refs and directing players. I can already see that from Wall but not from Rose. Lastly Wall has star power. While being a star is looked down upon from the media and Rose is applauded for his humble attitude, you need your teammates to feel that star aura. I feel like Wall's teammates will know at any time Wall is capable of getting them out of a jam. As for Rose I feel like his teammates are never sure what he'll do. With all this said but are extremely talented players who will both be perennial allstars, but I just think Wall could be elite. Both are extreme athletes who need to work on their jump shots and turnover problems, but if you ask me, I'll take Wall even knowing Rose's proven NBA success.
Again, I did not make this, ghettosermon did. No copyright intended.
Nah, I'm taking Derrick Rose.
I think he will be the better player. Rose reminds me of Kevin Johnson. He should be able to get huge numbers as early as next season. John Wall at best reminds me of Gary Payton. IMO, Johnson would have been the better player if he remained healthy.
I think the biggest issue for Wall in year 1 and 2, he needs to slow down. He averaged 5.4 turnovers per game in SUMMER LEAGUE. That's a cause for concern a little bit in my eyes.
Just because you average a lot of turnovers doesn't mean you can' be a great player. Magic Johnson averaged a lot of turnovers throughout his whole career but most people still consider him the best PG of all time. There are also a lot of other great point guards that averaged a lot of turnovers early in their career but I forgot their names. And Wall is just a rookie. He'll probably tone down on the turnovers as he gets older.
Just because you average a lot of turnovers doesn't mean you can' be a great player.
I never said that. I said it's a slight cause of concern for me. I still think John Wall is ready to be a stud in the NBA ( or at least show flashes).
To me, Derrick Rose is not the best point guard but he's MY number one point guard. I feel Chicago by simply adding Boozer gave Rose alot of freedom in the system. Now, you could either fall prey to a Rose jumper, fall to Rose on a pick and roll or let him increase his assist by passing to Boozer. As a Chicago supporter, I think Rose will be a monster next season.
Sorry about that. Just started posting here wasn't sure which forum to put it in. Anyways to the post above I can't say that I agree with your assessment of KJ vs the Glove but anyways Rose and Wall are really 2 different types of players. Rose is more of combo scorer. He's really score first, pass second. He can definitely run the sets when asked to but IMO he doesn't have a point guards mentality. Wall yes does have to slow down and cut the turnovers but while he too can look to score when he wants to I do believe he does have a point guards mentality. IMO Rose can win a ring as an elite #2, but TBH I can't see Rose winning a ring in which he's his teams top player. Wall however I can see leading a team to a title as the main man setting everyone up. Obviously that's not this Wizards current roster, but who knows in the future.
It's iight. I don't know why everybody post n the NBADraft section.
When it is all said and done D-Rose will still be considered the better player. The debate of who is better can be evaluated so many ways. We can sit hear and say o Kevin garnett skill set is better than tim duncan but Tim duncan is the better player because he has championships to back him up. Duncan isnt the hoo-rah guy but kg is and all that hoo-rah has gotten him is one championship. Demeanor means nothing when it comes to the game. U are who u are and thats that. Simply put Rose is a winner and Wall isnt. Wall never won a state championship in high school.....D-Rose won 2(back 2 back). D-rose took his team to a couple seconds of a championship......Wall and all his highly touted draft picks got bounnced from the tournament by a less talented West Virginia team led by their BACKUP POINT GUARD!!!!! no way Rose and memphis gets ousted by a backup PG. Wall has to win rookie of the year and he has to take his team to the playoffs in his first year and advance to the second round b4 he can even be mentioned in a conversation with D-Rose. In 2 years wall will be a SG bcuz he cant control the rock. if the kid averaged 5 turnovers a game in college how many u think he gon average n the NBA? Wall cant run a team but he sure can run himself out of the "WHO IS BETTER DERRICK ROSE OR JOHN WALL DEBATE." Just wait and see Rose dominate wall in all phases of the game once the Bulls play the wizards.
David Robinson,Manu,Parker. A lot more help in his prime years than KG had. KG was loyal to a fault. I am a big fan of Rose, but Wall looks to be the better passer and defender. I feel defense and passing are the most important qualities to have as a point guard. I have to see what Rose does with his new weapons to say who might have the better career. Wall will make his teamates better IMO, more than Rose will.
i actually think John Wall will be better Rose and him are really close skill wise and athletic wise but John Wall is longer and taller and looks to have a better jumper early on than Rose at the same time.
only time will tell who will end up being the better player. i think there should not be any cause for concern when it comes to john walls turnovers. summer league play is supposed to expose players w/ nba potential and help work out the "bugs" for players who are already signed. we gotta let john wall play an nba game first before we start assuming. i personally dont care who ends up being better as long as they both continue to get better. if both these guys reach their full potential its going to be some exciting basketball to watch for years to come
If we are going to guage players NBA potential off of Summer League I'd guess that Anthony Morrow is going to get the Nets to the Eastern Conference Finals, where they are going to lose to Anthony Randolph and the New York Knicks. Both those guys killed it in summer league.
John Wall had a great NBA summer league, but he's not going to average 23 and 9 against real NBA players, and the NBA has become a point guard driven league, he's going to be faceing guys like Deron Williams, Russel Westbrook, Chauncey Billups, Rajon Rondo, and the list goes on every single night...thats gonna wear on him, and NBA teams are not going to allow him to do whatever he wants, he's not going to be able to just waltz into the lane every possession, or get out and run the break every other posession. John Wall is going to have a learning curve just like every rookie.
I personally think Derrick Rose is going to end up being the better player, because of his natural basketball ability, part of me thinks John Wall is just really really fast, but in a half court setting is going to struggle for a while...where Rose has the ability to break people down in the half court but can also get out and run.
When Rose's explosiveness fades, you will see his game fade quickly. He's a mediocre shooter, very weak defender and his passing skills are nowhere near where Wall's are at this point in their careers.
And KnicksBoy, if Rose is K.J. and Wall is Gary Payton, gimme Payton all day long, you just answered your own comparisons...either way, they will both be special players, but I'll take John Wall at the end of the day...
in yrs to come. wall and rose on the east squad
russ and reke on the west squad
insane rose steps up his play in crunch time as you seen the past 2 years rose steps his play up in playoffs and in the ncaa tournament 2 years ago he had chris douglas roberts and couple of other ok people and he had 42 point in the final four games wall be as good as rose because he can't lead his team near as much as rose rose i think actually is a past first point he was pressured to take shots cus no one on his team can make them no offensive presence noah is defense deng is a little of both hinrick is defense taj im not totally sure about with boozer in town he might hit 10 assist a game and about 22 points also i'll definetly take rose rose is a little more athletic full court time rose 3.05 wall 3.10 wall is more like westbrook imo
So you're saying Wall isn't clutch? Wall made the game-winning shot in his first college game and he made other numerous big shots in other games when his team needed him to. I don't know what you're talking about, but Wall steps when he has to.
not im not sayin hes clutch he just can escalte his game like rose can in the most importnant games
I'm not sure who will
be better but I have to address some statements
rose had a better team
around him in college that had played with each other for more then a season
wall doesn't have to lead the wiz to the playoffs in year one to be comparable because the bulls already had a playoff team before drafting rose
and summer leauge is nice but you have to take it with a grain of salt. The talent level is comparable to the d leauge. Not even comparable to the back ups in the NBA. Teams prepare for u in the NBA and team
defense is wayyy better and the players are smarter/faster/stronger.
And I'd also take Payton over kj. I like kj but he wasn't as good as Gary kj defense wasn't nothing to write home about but Payton was one of the best ever at his position on defense. Was a better scorer as well
no disrespect but who did rose have at memphis
Cousins is better than anybody on the Memphis team that lost to Kansas in the championship game...