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How screwed are the Knicks?

JudBuechler is ...
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How screwed are the Knicks?

Was looking at the standings today and noticed the Knicks are the 3rd worst team in the NBA. Then I realized they have given their first round pick this year to the Denver Nuggets. At the rate this team is falling apart and the statements Carmelo is making, I don't see the Knicks retaining Melo.

Who wants to play for such a dysfunctional franchise, owner, and GM? I am not even a Knick fan, but someone needs to buy this team from Dolan. The NBA is fun when the Knicks are competitive.

What does the future hold for the Knicks? Does it get better from here? Can it get better? Or will it become the Isaiah Thomas years part deux?

Long time reader, first time posting.


NardDog Nation
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Not necessarily

Things aren't looking good for us but there is some glimmer of hope. Our core has proven that they are capable of putting together great runs (see last season) and I can see that happening when we're healthy. We're missing Tyson Chandler though and JR is still recovering from knee surgery, so I wouldn't count us out just yet. Looking beyond this season, we're not in too bad a situation. Come 2015, only JR, Felton and (presumably) Melo will be under contract. It's possible that we do an offseason rebuild and walk away with 2 of Rajon Rondo, Marc Gasol, Kevin Love (doubtful) and/or LaMarcus Aldridge (probable). At that point in time, we'd only owe our 2016 pick (Toronto), so hopefully we'd have competent management that won't screw up this fresh start like Glen Grunwald and (especially) Donnie Walsh. I suppose that time will tell.

BrentSuriaga01
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Lol

The glimmer of hope you're talking about is somewhere in the toilet right now, flushing every hope a dickrider knick fan like you has. Quit it man.

KHAM83
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Just read about the blowup

Just read about the blowup between Shump and Mello. I though it's being overblown, but the fact that they have already been shopping him and the play if Hardaway, I think they should move Shump now. I think they should however go after a young prospect or Draft pick instead of another veteran that will not really make them contenders. Two ideas off the top of my head:

Shump to Atlanta for Schroeder and future pick. As a Hawks fan I really wouldn't like this deal but I can see both teams being interested. Always gets a young starting two to pair with Teague, who has improved a lot. NY gets a young pg with potential. Schroeder/Hardaway could be their backcourt of the future.

PHX has been said to really love Shump. What about a 2014 pick for him? Bledsoe/Shump backcourt well be pretty nice. Ugly shooting % though. This will almost certainly need to happen after the lottery when Phx is in no position to Draft one of the top elite prospects.

NardDog Nation
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I say Shumpert in a much

I say Shumpert in a much larger package for Aaron Afflalo, Jameer Nelson and Glen Davis would mean more to the Knicks than Schroder (who I like) and a 1st round pick (which is a reach, considering Shumpert's value). With the package I proposed, I could easily see the Knicks being the 3rd seed in the East. The beauty about having a guy like Carmelo is that you're never more than a player away from being competitive.

Chilbert arenas
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Phoenix could have as many as

Phoenix could have as many as four first round picks in 2014, but they aren't giving up any lotto picks for Shump

Jordo
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Even better question is where

Even better question is where does Melo go if he decides to go else where?

NeggedAlterEgos...
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Houston is a great place.

Houston is a great place. Remember when howard played for the magic he had a stretch 4 in lewis and a playmaking wing in hedo. He will have a way improved version in melo and harden. Alot of ppl I know are saying Portland ,GSW,dallas,or Houston are the best FITS out there. The only team on the east I can see him fitting into is the Pacers but ind will have to find a trade partner in give up picks to sign and trade him along with granger and a few other via free agency.

BrentSuriaga01
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Lmfao

says the delusional Rockets fan.

Moon River
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Houston Trainwreck

Could you imagine Harden, Melo and Dwight playing together? I definitely cannot seeing it being successful, but would love to see it happen.

Jester87
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They're definitely the

They're definitely the biggest mess I've ever seen in the Nba. They're terrible (but let's see if Chandler can change something when he comes back), but not because they lack talent (so, many of their player aren't easy to trade without losing something), and at the same time many of they players are overpaid (so it's even harder or near impossible to trade them) and they have no salary cap flexibility, nor first round picks and many of their players are old, so it's not like they're going to improve in the near future. I'm just waiting for them to trade Shumpert, the only young and promising player with a good contract they have (not to mention, their only guy on the perimeter who can play some D), maybe for a 26-30 player who "can help them winning right now" (but only in their minds), maybe someone who wants 10-15 shots per game and doesn't play D, to make the whole thing a lot funnier

NardDog Nation
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Clearly you haven't been

Clearly you haven't been watching the Nets, who are in a far worse predicament than the Knicks. The Knicks core is capable of winning 54 games and still has an out in 2015. The Nets are capped out for several years, with no draft picks despite an aging roster and are just as bad as the Knicks. There is no parity between the two teams.

TallmanNYC
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I disagree. You will see the

I disagree. You will see the Nets come back to respectable. They have DWill, Lopez and AK hurt. Those are probably their three best players 1 through 3. None of them have serious injuries. Once they get back and the team gells it will be fine.

The Knicks just have one guy missing. Chandler. Now Chandler is super important. But he is still just one guy. Even when he comes back, the Knicks will still be a lottery bound team.

Jester87
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I agree. I think the Nets can

I agree. I think the Nets can still put all the pieces together. They've had a big number of injuries. Also I don't put them on the same level for one specific reason: they made a risky move this summer and they have compromised their future, but at least it was a high risk/high reward kind of move. I do not agree much with that because when you give away so much flexibility and future anything below winning the title will be unsatisfying and, well, you can never be sure you will win. But at the same time, if it worked, they would've had a legit chance of winning the ring. Pierce and Garnett turned out to be more washed out than anybody anticipated (and after the season P-Square had last season it was kinda hard to see it).

On the contrary the Knicks behaved like a team competing for the ring when everyone knew they didn't stand a chance. The very highest ceiling for them was a conference final, and that's optimism at its finest. Everyone saw them being a disfunctional team, with many minus defenders, many high volume scorers, no real playmakers, no real bigmen behind Chandler.

TallmanNYC
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Yeah, the Knicks problems

Yeah, the Knicks problems were so predictable. And it was laugable to think that bringing in Bargnani was somehow going to help.

The Nets have traded a bunch of first rounds and yes it hasn't worked out. But Pierce and Garnett were fine last year. It is hard to see why they would drop off that much this year.

The Nets did trade away first round picks. But you can buy late first round picks at the draft because teams don't want to role dice on a rookie with a three year guaranteed salary. So trading them is bad, but it isn't like the Nets can't draft in the first round during those years if they want. $3 million will buy you a pick between 20 and 25 in a lot of drafts (though probably not in this year's coming up).

mbunner23
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Blood4Lyfe

Blood4Lyfe, I hope you didn't just say Melo to the Pacers. Why would Indiana want Melo? They already have a guy who's going to be better than Melo if he isn't already in Paul George. Melo would not fit that Indiana team whatsoever.

NeggedAlterEgos...
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LOL (smiles) if an injured

LOL (smiles) if an injured granger can fit the team these last few years as the "supposed" primary scorer. Im sure melo would do fine.

believe it or not he does more the score he's a great passer and rebounder for his position. Not to mention scoring was a big issue for the pacers in the playoffs their bench was awful having a dynamic scorer like melo could change things for sure. Melo in all honest never played with a great team, in Denver he was put around scorers in sat back and watched A.I and smith see if they can outscore him. Played with a quick assembled knicks team where the other star was always hurt.
If you think he couldn't fit on the pacers your not thinking rationally seeing double and triple teams and still putting up numbers like he does is no easy feat put him on a solid team like the pacers where he will be asked to add into a team concept and replaces grangers scoring things will get ugly for the opposition.

Lipstick
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Too much NBA 2K? :P

Too much NBA 2K? :P

NeggedAlterEgos...
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No just the fact that

No just the fact that everyone thinks melo is leaving and their is only a certain amount of teams he can fit into. I didn't say the heat or okc did I?

NeggedAlterEgos...
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I don't see how he doesn't

I don't see how he doesn't fit in Houston when was the last time you looked at their starting PF?
Carmelo is a sure upgrade . Westbrook,Harden, and Durant played together so what are you guys really saying? Their all scorers at that. so to say Dwight , melo, and harden wouldn't work I don't believe it . Saying Melo couldn't fit the pacers makes no sense when their LOOKING FOR MORE SCORING praying granger can stay healthy.

mbunner23
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Absolutely not.

Talent doesn't always win you ball games. There's no doubt about it Melo is very talented but he would NOT fit on that team. What the Pacers have now is a team with great chemistry and players that compliment each other perfectly. Just because Melo is one of the most talented players in the world, doesn't mean he would make the Pacers better. I've always hated the argument that a team full of superstars would just start winning. You're acting like it's a video game, where you just put the best players on one team and they win. In reality, that doesn't work, you have to have guys who can play together. Not to mention, Melo would stunt Paul George's growth as a basketball player. And Indiana would be stupid if they even thought of bringing Melo on board. Paul George is their guy, and they want to put players around him that will be good for him and the betterment of the team.

Example. Look at the Brooklyn Nets.

mbunner23
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Also, you're the first person

Also, you're the first person I've ever heard call Melo a great passer.

blood
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Well

he's dead right. Melo has great handles and vision,its just since he came to NBA,he was always his team's offense.Look his college hightlights,he was great passer,back then they saw him as a potential 25,8,5 guy

mbunner23
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Blood and Blood. You must

Blood and Blood. You must have had to switch user names to try to make it look like someone agrees with you. Anyway, Melo averaged 2.2 assists in college. And his highest in the NBA has been 3.8. Not bad for a scorer, but lets not give him too much credit. He's an average passer, but you/he said he is a GREAT passer. Great passers are guys like CP3, Lebron etc. Melo is a scorer, and isn't a guy that you're going to win championships with.

ItsRainingNegs
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Who rely wants Melo at the

Who rely wants Melo at the max at this point though? If Chicago can carve out the cap space I see that, Dallas if Dirk is on board, and then what contending team would want him? Knicks of course because they don't have any other option. Maybe Miami will scoop him on the cheap heheh. But seriously his destination possibilities are fascinating.

NeggedAlterEgos...
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What team wouldn't want melo?

What team wouldn't want melo? Nobody is saying how the pacers had a struggle scoring last playoffs and just because melo is on the floor doesn't mean he has to shoot the ball his presence alone will benefit the team and your still not saying who replaces grangers because right now hes riding the pine. You don't have to explain to me how Super teams don't work save it lol. The most awkwardly constructed super team is the heat and they won 2 championships. The nets have a number of reason why their not working 3 of the starters are on the downsides of the careers, rookie coaching , big chemistry issues , injury. Melo replacing Terrance jones(hou), or Granger(ind) wouldn't hurt either team. Melo has good vision and passing ability who does he have to finish ? you don't have to average 10 ast to be a great passer or have vision iggy and lebron don't average 10 ast. Melo does what he has to do to win and that's score a lot put him on a team where he has to score less and I don't see why it would be hard to mesh. I understand pg is their guy but if they could make a run at melo do it. I love lance but you don't know what lace Stephenson your going to get on any giving day or what off court trouble things he might get into OR WILL HE SHOOT YOU OUT A PLAYOFF GAME WHEN YOU HAVE THE HEAT AGAINST THE ROPES. Hill cracks under pressure Cole and Chalmers gave him fits. This is the team you have to get through they lost with granger and they lost without granger against the heat. Chemistry will only take you so far spurs been together how long? and committed how many turnovers and mistakes those last 2 finals games? Its not melos fault the knicks are losing like they are its the teams and front offices. Anyhow I will love to see what happens and where he goes because if they keep losing like this hes leaving.

mbunner23
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Agree to strongly disagree.

I think you're mistaking Melo for LeBron. Lebron could fit onto any team, Melo cannot. Miami is succeeding as a super team because of Lebron James unselfishness as a player. Put Melo on the Heat in Lebrons place and tell me how good they are then. He holds the ball on offense, and it makes the defense easier to guard everyone. Why do you think Melo's teams have always struggled? It's hard to play with that guy, because he wants to score and score only. Don't get me started on his defense. I like Melo but I also understand what he is, and what he will always be.

Tyrober
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I know the Knicks are

I know the Knicks are struggling and they are missing Chandler, but they are only 4 games out of the 8th seed in the East. If the Eastern Conference keeps playing terrible then there is a chance they can make the 8th seed with a losing record. They still lose the pick no matter what and the Nuggets fans should get excited though.

Mkadoza
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We're royally &$#%#&@!. No

We're royally &$#%#&@!. No plan for getting better looks real unless it involves waiting for cotracts to expire (again), trading your assets for picks instead of visa versa, and for the love of God, keep Dolan away from everything requiring intelligence. But we're &$#%#&@!. At least cap relief is in sight for 2015.

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BREAKING: The Knicks P.R.

BREAKING: The Knicks P.R. department just announced plans to roll out a Jahlil Okafor 2015 campaign...

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