How good is Anthony Davis really? I think the hype has gone too far.
I'm from Baton Rouge, LA and i'm a die-hard Hornets fan. The Cleveland Cavaliers offered picks 4, 22, 33, and 34 to the Hornets for Number 1. No singular player wins a championship. The Hornets need to be building a team. Who knows at 4 we may be able to get Drummond, Harrison Barnes, MKG, or T-Rob at 11 we may be able to get Lilliard, Rivers, Ross, Perry Jones, John Henson and 22, we could get Harkless, Royce White, Tony Wroten, Marquise teague, and the 2 early 2nd round picks could be great.
I personally think Anthony Davis will be a Marcus Camby type player, Jermaine O'neal at best. I don't think he'll reach the KG or Tim Duncan expectations.
Besides. with picks 4 and 11 we could end up with a great duo to team with Eric Gordon, everyone says they want to use the OKC model, well OKC built a team through the draft, they got lucky through the draft.
I would personally have taken that trade, but supposedly the hornets and everyone else feels that Anthony Davis will be better than any of these prospects combined together. So... I don't think so but only time will tell. I think the Hype is too much.
The hornets already have two lottery picks why trade down to secure another late first pick and a second rounder who might flop when u got a surefire talent in the 1st and tenth pick.
I don't think that's far off at all. Anthony Davis is definitely the best prospect in this class but he's no Blake Griffin, Derrick Rose, or Kevin Durant type talent. I think he could be an all-star but that's no guarantee. You knew going into their drafts that barring injury KD, Rose, and Griffin would be in all likelyhood all-stars.
I would have countered the offer adding either Emeka Okafor or Jarrett Jack and taking back Tristan Thompson and see what they said,
While I dont subscribe to all the hype, I have held steadfast that there will be some really good players taken after Davis, some will have better careers. Still, Davis presents the best ratio of risk/reward out of any player out there. You just named Camby and O'Neal.....those are not busts....lol. Kwame Brown is a bust. I am not the biggest Davis fan, but if he isnt but marginally better than Brown, he will be the biggest bust of all time, maybe in any sport...because thats just about how bust proof he is.
I respect your opinion about Anthony Davis and agree with you. I don't think he is this sure fire hall of fame big man. I think he could be a KG type player but that is absolute ceiling. I think he is going to be just solid in the league. At the same time though, they are going to be a young team. Yes OKC worked out and they were mostly young guys but how did Washington work out with their young team? You just have to do your best with scouting. You say they could get Drummond at 4 but they could get him at 1. I would consider him there. If you want a player just take him. All those young players from the same draft would I think backfire.
If Drummond can be DeDndre Jordan with 40 pounds more muscle as his ceiling in 2-4 years, I'd take him 2nd overall in a heartbeat.
This would be close to a max money player if recent contracts for legit centers are any indication (Biedrins: ~8m, DeAndre Jordan: ~10m, Kwame Brown: ~7m).
A center who realistically won't have much of a problem putting up DeAndre Jordan numbers while being stronger and faster is definitely worth the 2nd pick.
People say, "oh, what if he's a bust and can only play 25-30 minutes; play defense, rebound, and score some garbage buckets?" . If you really think about it, that's a 10m + salary center in today's NBA landscape. No question I'd take Drummond second overall, regardless of who ends up with the second pick if Charlotte trades it.
I have been round for a while and am more realistic / skeptical about all the hype of players before they get drafted. I have copped many neg points for going against the hype and saying Barnes, P Jones, Drummond, Rivers were overhyped and not sure fire all stars when all the kids were on the bandwagon.
But I will say this Davis is going to be great. KG is a top 4 PF i dont' think its fair as its too early to say he will be as good or better than KG... I believe he will be a 5+ All Star and a good chance to be a hall of famer one day. He is def not going to be a bust, he can change a franchise around. I would not have taken that trade either....
Maybe coming out he doesnt have that apparent Rose, Durant, and Griffin type talent but I would personally put him up there with those guys, certainly above Griffin. Blake is an AAU player, Davis is a professional. Anyways Anthony Davis reminds me so much of Tim Duncan. Obviously thats a pretty lofty comparison but I see Davis as a guy you can build championship teams around for the next decade plus. Also how many rookies do you need on a team? Obviously they would trade some of those picks but I dont see the value of the #4 and three picks in the 22-34 range would end up equalling Anthony Davis in the long run. Substitute one of those later picks for an unprotected 1st next year and then we'll talk.
I wonder if Portland would be willing to trade their 6 and 11 for Davis?
I personally think it's too much, but the Hornets could potentially have picks 6, 10, and 11 and get a host of young pieces for the future.
No team really wants to add four rookies to their roster. They will make some trades on draft day but doubt the 1st pick goes anywhere.
- NO has pick 1 and pick 10 (not 11)
- Clev offered pick 4 pick 24 (not 21) pick 33 pick 34
Anthony Davis is a serious player (not HOF material in my mind) who could become the face of the franchise for the next 10 years. Moreover he's already a defensive specialist... And Defense makes you win games (PO games I mean not RS). Anthony Davis doesn't worth 2 top 10 picks + 2 early 2nd round picks... but picking at 24 is not like picking at 9. There is a gap in this draft between pick 1 davis and the others : beal, robinson, drummond, barnes, mkg, lillard, rivers, sullinger.
There is an issue Drafting too much young players from the same draft, for example : 4 Beal/Drummond 10 Leonard/Rivers 24 Teague 33 Jenkins/Lamb 34 Green/Taylor...
- how can you give them enoough playing time for all those young guys ?... if you add Gordon (assuming you extend him), Okafor, Ariza, Jack, Aminu, Vazquez, Henry, Smith AND Ayon. You'll have to give up on some players and maybe trade them or see them underdevelopping. Waht's the point on trading Davis for several young players whereas you won't be able to develop them or should trade some of them ?
- when you have to pay them you'll lose some of them... In this case NO would welcome 5 rookies and would have to extend almost all of them the same year...
I would try everything in this draft to get 1 or 2 early 2nd round picks cause you could find some nice players there (deeeeep draft)... but not giving up on Davis.
This kind of deal would make more sense for Charlotte at 2 (even without pick 24) : pick 2 against pick 4 and picks 33/34
OKC got lucky in the sense that they got the 2nd pick instead of winning the lottery the year of Oden and Durant's draft. The majority of GMs would have taken Oden and OKC very well may have done the same if they would have gotten the first pick. It really is a shame Oden never got a chance to develop beceause we will never truly know what might have been.
They were smart to take Westbrook 4th in 2008. Love went 5th so he obviously would have been a fine choice as well but Beasley went 2nd and Mayo went 3rd and neither of those guys are starters. They also took Ibaka 24th that year which made no headlines at the time but 4 years later it was brilliant.
2009 they took Harden third when most would have gone for Tyreke Evans. They chose the right guys that fit what they want to do and developed them. They may have gotten a bit lucky along the way but they put themselves in a situation that allowed them to succeed.
Luck can always comes into play in these situations and New Orleans is not dumb enough to take that out of the equation and try to outsmart everyone by overthinking and trading the first pick. If you look at the trade really all you are getting is the 4th and 22nd picks for the 1st pick. The two second round picks are not guarenteed contracts for a reason. Those players seldom work out. For every Paul Milsap or Tony Parker there are 20 guys who are taken and hardly see the league. Anthony Davis will be much more than just Marcus Camby or Jermaine O'Neal. I think he is on the level of being an all-star for years to come barring injury. He already comes in ready to go defensively based on his length, timing and basketball IQ. He has all the skills to develop a potent offensive game as well. I really do not see how some people cannot see the potential that this kid has. I feel like there is no question within 3 or 4 years he will be in the discussion for who the best PF in the world is with Blake Griffin and Kevin Love.
If I'm Charlotte and Cleveland offers me 4 / 33 / 34 aginst 2 I jump on the deal in a heartbeat...
in this draft picking at 2 or 4 is almost the same thing : whereas it's obvious Davis is better than everybody in this draft, you can not be sure who will be the better pro between Robinson/MKG/Beal/Barnes (I think Rivers/Sullinger/Lillard... are a little bit below right now).
@Sewok15 not agree with you on the way you see this year's 2nd round.
You can't compare draft from different years : not the same players....
This year offers a strong 2nd round cause some players should slide from the first ... if you have early second round picks you can add some fine starters or role players in THIS draft : jenkins, lamb, white, green, taylor, middleton, miller, cunningham, wroten, miller, fournier, satoransky, barton, O'Quinn, english, machado, Ezeli, Aldemir.
This is a very nice 20 to 40 range. But I'm agree it doesn't worth Anthony Davis.
Whenever it comes to the draft you always have to have a little luck, and I'm adding that factor into this discussion. As I said earlier, OKC got lucky, OKC got 5 players who all worked out and that is seldom. People forget they flipped Jeff Green straight up for Kendrick Perkins, their 5th guy.
The point is, some people say that the people with the most potential in the draft are Anthony Davis, Perry Jones, Andre Drummond, MKG, and Bradley Beal. The Hornets have to be lucky and have a good front office but it would be great to have possibly 2 of those guys and an extra 1st round pick to work with instead of just 1 and 11. Sometimes you have to go out on a limb to win. Also they don't have to use all of those picks, they can package them for trades, having extra pics gives you so many options..
I don't know, I still haven't bought into the Anthony Davis hype, it's tough predicting greatness for someone who hasn't played a single game in the leage yet. Also we've seen ton of players dominate college on length and athleticism and not be as good in the league.
I've consistently stated that his prime could be around 18 and 12 with great defense. So whether you view that as a star, role player or superstar is up to you.
Anthony Davis has KG potential and it's obvious. He's not a "sure thing" the same way Duncan was, but he hasn't played 4 years of college ball either.
In terms of big men, I'd say Greg Oden was a sure thing. A generational talent that missed ONLY because of injury. I don't think Davis is quite on that level, but he's the next notch down from that. I think the big thing he's missing is a developed post game, but let's also remember that he was a guard until 2 years ago.
I think all the evidence suggests that Davis is on the path to be a superstar. If he reaches his potential he's going to be one of the 5-10 players in the league you can legitimately build a championship team around. You dont trade a guy like that for a bunch of later picks
He is 19 years old, 7'5 wingspan, averaged a double-double, won POY, won a National Title, is the best shot blocker ppl have seen in a decade coming out of the collegiate ranks, anyone who watched him play realizes there is A LOT more to his game then shot blocking, he has all the offensive skills its just gonna take a lil while to piece them altogether.... so ya i definetly thinks hes worth the hype, he gonna be one hell of a player
Jenkins, Lamb, and White should all be fine players but I don't think any of those guys fall to the second round. As for the rest of the list of players I am not completely sold on any of them. I can't claim to know tons about the players especially the foreign guys and I am sure that some will succeed but they are afterthoughts in this situation. It is obvious to say those guys are really not in the same league as Davis. They should not be envolved in a deal for him or even mentioned in the same paragraph as him. I don't believe that New Orleans even considered that deal for a second and most likely laughed at it.
We have seen players dominate in college with length and athleticism but not like Davis. What makes him special is not just his length and jumping ability but his timing and knowledge of the game. He blocked almost 5 shots a game while only committing 2 fouls a game. He has non-stop energy that has given every indication it will transfer to the next level. I would not trade him even in the fictional scenarion that you could get the 2nd and 3rd picks for him. I understand guys like Drummond and PJ3 have nice potential as well but their potential to fail is also extremely higher. Davis is as close as it gets to a sure thing.
Maybe people dont remember Kevin Garnett in his prime, but Anthony Davis doesnt play much like Garnett offensively. Garnett was a 20 ppg scorer easy, I doubt Davis never be a 20 ppg player. Ever. At any point in his career. Garnett could handle the ball like a wing, shoot the 18 ft. shot consistently, and have offense run through him. Anthony Davis is much closer to Marcus Camby than Kevin Garnett to me, not that kind of impact player offensively
I agree with you and also....KG had advanced ballhandling and passing skills far superior to Davis at the same age. There has been much hoopla surrounding Davis playing PG a couple of years ago and sprouting several inches....but still he doesnt have the handle and passing ability of an 18 year old Garnett.
I can see some of you thinking now....."Well if KG was so good, why didnt he go #1 overall?" The only reason KG didnt go #1 is because he was the 1st HS player to jump to the NBA in 20 years and GM's were afraid to take him. I think it was only during workouts that he climbed up as high as he did. A lot of GM's were pondering taking him as high as #1 on down, but they were afraid to pull the trigger. The fact that he wasnt dominant out the gate didnt help Kobe's draft status either, look at how many teams passed on that guy...a top 10 GOAT perhaps.
and JYD is right about drafting too many players in the same draft. you want to build through the draft, but you cant do it all at once. I dont think any draft picks from 2012 are worth # 1 unless I was able to get #2 and 3. In that case I would take Drummond and Barnes/Beal/MKG combo. Doubtful that both picks would bust. Other than that, these teams would need to throw in next years first round pick and the year after that to even be considered.
I am pretty sure that today Anthony Davis is as good as Camby was in his prime offensively. Davis can handle the ball as well as garnett. I will agree he is not the mid range shooter that KG is or was but he has the potential to be nearly as potent on offense. I can see him scoring over 20 points a game within 4 years. I can see him blocking over 2 shots a game and grabbing over ten boards next year.
KG averaged 17 pts 8 rebs and 2 blks a game in his second year. Those are close to the #s I expect from Davis as a rookie except maybe 15 pts and 10 rebs instead. I don't know that he will ever average 24 14 and 2 like KG did in his prime but I would not rule out putting up close to those kind of numbers once he gets stronger and more mature.
hell no Davis can not handle the ball like Garnett. he can dribble with his head up and lead the break, but damn, I saw Kendrick Perkins do that the other night. A lot of big men can dribble. Garnett as a rookie had the sickest handle and passing for a 7' footer that I had EVER seen. Davis is not the ballhandler or passer that CWebb was. Davis is ok dribbling the ball up court, but his handle and passing is overated if you think he is as good as Garnett then, much less now.
I doubt some of you really seen these guys play early in their careers. Some joker said yesterday that Paul Pierce didnt have a quick first step. Jesus.
also, Davis is playing in a league with much younger players.....when KG was playing, he was an 18 year old against players that were MEN. Even McDyess and guys like that had 2 years college (and weight training) over KG. Its not the same league.
I think Anthony Davis is overhyped, at best he is Taj Gibson 2.0, he also has a bit of an ego as shown by the ''check my stats'' shirt and him saying he wants to be the Kobe stopper
Coach Cal wanted Davis to focus only on defense,rebounding and shot blocking earlier in the season..He wasnt asked to score..Cal has always done a great job of getting the most out of his players and forcing them to learn new roles..Then unleash them to do their thang...Once he feels they've gotten comfortable and gained confidence on the floor...
At 1st Davis most got his points off put-backs.tip-ins,dunks off lobs and dribble hand-offs..And as the season went on Cal gave him more freedom..Davis was sometimes bring up the ball and create plays for himself and team mates..He started attempting more 3 point shots,shooting a mini jump hook and talking mid range shots..
Right now he's 70% of the player he will be in 2 years..In his rookie year i project him to get around 12 to 14 pts-10 rbs and 3 blks a game...
Its strange but i've been hearing alot how much the Hornets love to draft Sullinger at 10..But i think they should go after Lilliard if he's still there...
Yes those 1.8 assists per game that KG averaged his rookie year was mind boggling. Never had someone with such great size made dazzling passes to that extent....come on man!!! I am not saying that he is a better passer than KG but Davis can handle the ball. How many times did you see KG leading the break and making a pass to set up his teammates? KG is a good passer and ball handler in the half court. Working in the post and passing out of double teams have led to most of his assists. KG is a very willing passer as well...almost to a fault. Passing is a nice trait to have as a big man but I would still rather have you finishing, blocking shots and rebounding.
The KG comparsion is an extreme one since he is one of the 50 best players ever but if you look at the potential of Davis instead of skinny 19 year old he is now you should be able to see some similarities.
You expect 220 pound Anthony Davis to step into the Western conference and average 12 pts,10 rebs, and 3 blocks? What are you smoking? I see him averaging around 12pts,6rebs,1.5blks
dont worry about the 1.8apg, that stat dont tell the story because early in his career Garnett was relied upon heavily to score, plus he was on a bad team. in the half court and interior passing, thats exactly what I am talking about, it takes a special skill to do that. I dont care much about a big guy leading the break because it doesnt happen as often as he gets interior touches in the half court set. Davis can dribble, but comparing him to KG is a stretch of monumental proportions, especially once he goes though the motions and hits rookie and sophomore walls...then you bandwagoners will be oh so willing to throw him under the bus.
Lets just hold off on the KG upside, there is no evidence of that. Even if Cal didnt want him to score, you guys should remember that at 18 KG had some post moves and a serious back to the basket game and could face up. I am looking at a 19 year old skinny kid as opposed to the 18 year old skinny kid I saw growing up. Defensively, Davis is a monster, but offensively, Garnett as an 18 year old was much better....not even close enough to compare.
KG was 220 when he came into the league and now is up to 250. I don't know if Davis will put on as much muscle but 20 pounds is certainly not out of the question. 10 boards a game might be tough but I think he will get over 8 for sure and will be top 5 in the league in blocks with around 2 a game.
if they're lookin to grab Davis obviously they feel like he's an upgrade from Thompson...why not give up him and the #4 for AD maybe throw in the 33. The Cavs get that upgrade and NO gets a young 4 to bulid around and at the 4 maybe they grab a Drummond who could be just as good if not better not to mention u can grab your PG for the future at 10 ala Lilliard or call me crazy K Marsh. Barnes would make sense at 4 too and so would MKG wherever they with that 4 pick went there would be options. That actually makes sense for both teams really
KG had a frame to put in a ton of weight I think anthonu Davis can put on 15-20 pounds his rookie season should be similar to KG's
Chris Bosh on offense, Marcus Camby on defense.
I'm sticking with that.
I didn't even read your post but the title was enough for me to give you a point which I barely ever do. Anthony Davis is being so hyped that I don't know that he can meet the expectations even if he has a really good career.
That being said the Hornets were right to dismiss that trade. Late 1st and early second round picks in the NBA draft are not like they are in the NFL draft where you expect to get a 10 year starter. At that point in the draft you are hoping for a decent role player. Thats not something I'm giving up the 1st overall pick for.
If you look at New Orleans team, they don't need a whole bunch of pieces right now. They need length and talent. Davis give them both and will help sell tickets. Now if you were saying Portlant was going to offer their 2 picks plus another top 30 pick they acquire it may make sense basketball wise but not business wise.
Anthony Davis might not be KG or Duncan or close to them esp. on offense but he's worth a lot more than those picks. The hype is a little crazy but he did have an excellent season on a team that won the nat'l title.
Will take some time for his offense but those 2nd round picks are worthless you can possibley buy one if needed. The 4th pick will get you a solid player maybe an all-star but not a franchise changer at least not right away. The 22nd pick maybe becomes a starter but is no lock and more likely a bench player. 33 and 34th who knows if they make the rotation even 2nd rounder are always a gamble. Meanwhile the 1st pick is ususally a sure thing and this year is no different.
Davis has no where neeeear the ball hadling skils KG had at that age. Seriously taking 3/4 dribbles against some stiff aint handling . As Ive said before. How come he could score against Jeff Whitney?
it's becoming a hype not to buy the hype... headache...
I think some of you underrate how good Marcus Camby really was and he is generally considered a more unfavorable comparison for Davis. Teams NEED interior defense. This past Celtics teams was one of the worst offensive teams in the league by the numbers. It ranked 25th in the league in points per possession in the regular season and still made the playoffs easily, basically because of its great defense. Others get more hype, but Garnett is the Celtics top player and one of the top pfs in the league. I would say he is 2nd best behind Kevin Love right now. I know I will be negged, but in terms of value to his team, its true.
Davis is the #1 pick because he could easily be a 20-10 guy in his prime while being an outstanding defensive player. Many top scorers at the 4 position are not great defenders, so it is very unique to get a 2 way player like Davis. He is worth more than what Cleveland offered, easily. You don't win a championship just by accumulating as many young players as possible. Quality is better than quantity in the draft.
Kevin Garnett if Kevin Garnett couldn't shoot or dominate offensively
Anthony Davis potential:
on offense: LaMarcus Aldridge with better handle
on defense: Kevin Garnett with elite shot blocking ability and without the filth
Maybe I'm wrong, but I see Davis' future as a 20 ppg, 12 rpg, 2-3 blocks per game player. He has to go #1, and trading down when you already have the 11th pick to get a PG seems like a bad decision to me.
It'd be pretty embarrassing to look back at some of these comments in a few years. He may or may not live up to the hype, but "Taj Gibson 2.0" or even Jermaine O'Neal comparisons don't sound particularly objective.
Anthony Davis can be as good as he wants to be. People talk about his handle, shot, excetera. He young. He's only been his size for 2+ years now. It takes time and repetition to fully understand how to utilize ones gifts, and he learned at a rediculous rate. The one thing that stood out to me, and it stood out to me the most with Derrick Rose, is the speed that they get better. Davis was improving on a NIGHTLY bases. You could see with his confidence and experience, his timing, rotations, and offense became better. He did lead his championship team in scoring, shooting over 60% as a freshman. He does have unreal quickness for his size, awesome basketball IQ, a guard like upbringing, and a ridiculous motor.
Basically, based on his age, current skill set, and observed rate of growth, Davis has a chance to be a star in the league. And I dont think thats over or underrating him. He could be a generational talent if he gets the skills down. His proven ability to impact the defensive end while showing atheticism, fluidity and IQ on the offensive end almost guarantees that.
Honestly his worst case is a PF version of Tyson Chandler. It may take a decade, but at some point people will mention him as a top flight defensive player. His best could be something else. 20-12-3ast-2stl-3blks type of something else. My honest prediction however is 12-8-1-1-2.5 as a rookie.
Jermaine O'Neal was a perennial All Star before he got consistently hurt and one of the brightest stars in the game. Im only 21 and I still know more about bball history than half ya'll so called "experts" on this site. AD will be lucky if he turns into O'Neal in his prime.
Tyson Chandler and Marcus Camby were 222 and 223 lbs when they entered the NBA, that is Davis' biggest knock coming into the league. I know he's skinny, but a 9' standing reach is very good and will allow him to rebound even as a rookie. I suspect he'll fill out to 240-245 lb because he has broad shoulders despite being a skinny guy.
Every #1 pick gets a ton of hype and not all of them live up to the press they get, but Anthony Davis is the best player in this draft and I do think he has the offensive potential of a 2nd option. He has a soft touch around the basket, can face up a bit and knows how to use the glass ( so lost on the younger generation of post players ).
Offensively, I think it will take him a little while to hit his stride. He really struggled against a dominant collegiate defender and 7' shot blocker ,Jeff Withey, in the title game, but he's young, works hard, and he'll adapt. I think his ceiling is a 17 ppg 13 rpg 3.5 bpg player.
JO averaged 20 & 10 for six straight years. Saying that comparing AD to him is selling AD short is ridiculous. It is selling JO short because AD is not averaging 20 & 10
Chris Bosh/Lamarcus Aldridge meets Marcus Camby sounds like a superstar to me... Especially if he can stay healthy.
It's okay if he doesn't live up to Kevin Garnett status... Garnett is one of a kind.
It's funny people keep saying Davis isn't Rose or Blake or whoever. Answer this. What did those guys do as freshmen in college and compare what Davis did. Davis lead his team to the title and punished just about every team in their way in the process. Davis was POY and won just about every award you can think of as a freshman. Blake wasn't as dominate as a freshman, Rose had his moments especially in the tournament but he wasn't a finished product either and had some big flaws with defense being the main one. This kids worst case is Marcus Camby ( a healthy one) and best case is a better K.G ( his handles nor jumper at the same stage was as good and he's never been known as a shot blocker). People forget that unlike most bigs he has only been a big man for 2 years.
I can understand him being over hyped if he had P.Jones motor or Dummunds but the kid has those rare motors like MKG and psyco T. Most player with that type of motor aren't as skilled as him. Another thing, Coach Calipari said Davis can handle the ball as well as shoot much better than he had shown at UK but he didn't need Davis to do that because he had other who could do the. He also said everything that we saw T.Jones do as a freshman when he was at his best (jumper, handle) Davis can also do. Now no one knows if he will be a HOF or not but every year every top talent is talked about as far as what they could POTENTIALLY DO. Of course any player can end up being a bust but no one is drafting any of these guys with the thought or hope that they turn out to be busts
These Chris Bosh Lamarcus Aldridge offensive comparisons are some of the most ridiculous things I have ever read. There is nothing, at this point, remotely similar about his game. Wow. Fail.