How Can You Hate the Heat???!!!
It is definitely a great story, this is an expansion team who has only been around for 24 years and has 2 titles.... and some teams have been in the league for twice as long and dont any.
Cleveland could have a title by now if they would handle their organization properly, but they dont have Pat Riley. Some organizations are just better.
You can hate Lebron. Go ahead, be my guest.
My question is, how can you not feel good for Chris Bosh...a guy who went from being a superstar on his own team to taking a reduced role and less spotlight in a sense to win a title. Bosh is the model of confidence in your ability and consistency. He has arguably been the most consistent performer since this team was put together. He just did whatever he needed to do.
How can you not feel good for Dwayne Wade, a superstar in his own right...a guy who was at least once in his career considered in the conversation as the best player in the league. A guy who relinquished reigns to "his" team for the sake of a title. A guy who's ego didnt stand in the way of victory.
How can you not feel good for Mario Chalmers? A guy who was really questioned about his ability coming into the draft. He was a winner and a big time clutch performer in college...yet questions about his abilities. They said he wasnt a true PG, wasnt a great athlete, was undersized, couldnt create his own offense, etc.... the fact is, all of those things may still be true...but Chalmers does something better that all of those things....he plays the game to win.
How can you not feel good for Mike Miller. This guy has some heart. He has struggled mightily, but he wanted to be a part of this title so bad. His body looks like its falling apart on him, but he came through when the Heat really needed him. After a successful career before joining the Heat, there were big expectations for Miller coming into Miami. Expectations he never fulfilled. In hindsight...was it a bad decision to sign Miller....after his performance last night, I would have to say absolutely not.
How can you not feel good for Battier, a tenacious and fearless role player in the mold of Robert Horry....he is well deserved as should be.
How can you not feel good for James Jones....a guy who was going to retire before this team was put together due to a near career ending wrist injury...but fought back and won the 3-point shootout and is now an NBA champion who can go out on top.
What about Udonis Haslem? A guy who has spent his whole life in Miami. A true hometown hero, who will likely go down as one of Florida's most beloved sports figures.
What about Norris Cole, a guy who fought and struggled just to be recognized as a basketball player since being virtually unrecruited out of HS. A guy who the Heat believed in enough to draft. He was a part of this team's success although his minutes were infrequent....whenever the opportunity presented itself...he didnt play like a rookie.
Dexter Pittman, yeah, hate him for the dirty play on Stephenson....but Pittman is a hard worker who has lost over 100lbs since coming out of HS. His character and work ethic is appreciated by the Heat...and as proved with the foul on Stephenson, he may be the new Bill Laimbeer...because he definitely will do what he feels necessary to defend his teammates.
I am not sure how someone can hate Juwan Howard, a guy who has been an All-Star, a leader, a public role model due to his work with the underpriveleged youth. Howard is a winner and a leader even if he barely played. He never wavered, his commitment to his team as a veteran is 2nd to no one. A class act.
However, if you want to hate Eddy Curry for getting a ring...feel free....because right now, I dont have any arguments in his defense unfortunately.
because I'm not a Heat fan.....
I completely understand why someone could dislike the Heat. I don't myself, in fact quite the opposite. While I am always interested into why and can think some reasons to be a tad hypocritical, it is very understandable for people to have a distaste over certain basketball teams.
This Heat love fest is even a little much for me though, surve. I am happy that these guys won, just I think there are many reasons not to like this team. Even if they are not good reasons in your eyes or my eyes, everyone is entitled to their opinion.
The reasons to hate many of these guys would be that they colluded to form a team rather than building it from the ground up. It does not bother me, always wondered why this did not happen sooner, but it was a team that was bought as opposed to built. This is just not the way it is typically done and a reason many fans dislike sports. That is the reason people hate the Heat, along with a perceived arrogance (that I believe is no worse than anything else out there, though I am semi-alone there). Your write-up may have been heart felt (though the "hate LeBron James and Eddy Curry, love everyone else method is a little much), just probably does nothing for people who dislike what the team stands for and how they came together.
Didn't care much for them before, why would I now? I've NEVER been a fan of LeBron I'm not especially fond of players that beat up on my teams. That fact gets exacerbated when my fellow Detroiters jump on the Heats bandwagon and forget about the Pistons just because we're irrelevant right now. But I digress I'm happy for Mike Miller and Shane Battier (went to Country Day a private school here)
I believe most people hate the Heat out of jealousy. I think last year I could understand some of the backlash to a degree, but most of it was not justified. The WORST thing that we KNOW Lebron did was make a big press conference about where he was going to go. Trust me, when I say ESPN had a huge hand in this as well. It was eaisly one of the biggest free agency decisions ever. Everyone knew it was a possibilitiy because the Cavs had made so many horrible moves in the quest for winning it all. With that said, I believe over 2 million dollars was raised for the Boys and Girls Club of America. If the worst thing you do ends up raising over 2 million for underpriviledged kids, was it all that bad?
The rest of these guys are professionals outside of what we have seen from Edy Curry in the past, but maybe he learned something from his time there. If I am correct, not only did Wade, Lebron and Bosh take paycuts, but so did Haslem who I believe had a bigger offer from Dallas and Mike Miller who may have had a bigger offer from the Lakers. It's not even like it was a choice of taking more money from bad teams. They had the option of taking more money from championship caliber teams.
A lot of guys fought through public, private and health issues too. That's not easy to do for anyone. I would like to say I really appreciate the effort of everyone on that team, but more specifically Mike Miller and Juwan Howard. At least the last couple of years have been hard on Miller. He started to have a really good season this year and got his shooting stroke back, but injuries took him out for a chunk of the year. It seemed like every time I watched him play, you could tell he was in pain no matter what he was doing, but you look at last night and the guy is still diving on the floor with a bad back. He's only 32 and I believe has 3 more guaranteed years left, but he's already stated that if he cannot get his body right then he's retiring. A lot of guys would collect those last few paychecks on the bench or force you to waive them. As for Howard, the guy is always ready to play and plays at his best. Last year in the playoffs and finals, it seemed that every time he got onto the court he made something good happen. It reminded me of the year that the Celtics got PJ Brown, even though the end result was different that year. That guy has been in every sort of scenario possible and he's made the most of it.
For all the OKC fans, those guys will be more determined next year and I have a hard time believing that they won't come back better, with fewer holes in their game and with a ton of experience from this year's mistakes.
I've hated Dwyane Wade since late 05, and I'll never be happy for him. He almost did more harm then good in the playoffs a few times. I'm indifferent towards most of those guys on the list. I don't like the Heat (may seem odd since I've rooted for them since the 2nd round), I just wanted LeBron to get a ring. Now it's time for me to get back rooting for Rose to get his while Phoenix is a lottery team.
Chris Bosh - I really like Bosh, he's a great player and he's rather comedic. I feel like he by far sacrificed the most, going from #1 to #3 to win a ring. You don't really see that happen with many players in their 20s, that's usually something the guys about to retire do.
Dwayne Wade - I have no sympathy for Wade, he's the biggest whinebag I've ever seen. He's this big tough egomaniac but if you touch him(or don't touch him) he instantly runs to the ref crying for a foul. It's dishonorable and sickening.
Mario Chalmers - I'm 50/50 on Chalmers. While he's improved he's still highly inconsistant. On almost any other team he'd be a 6th man or a role player.
Mike Miller - I've always liked Miller, while it's hard to watch him play through injuries it's amazing how he can fight through them and still be lights out. I deffinitely think he deserved a ring.
Shane Battier - Like Miller I've been a long time fan, he can be a bit dirty at times but he's tenacious and seems to never tire. He deffinitely deserved a ring.
James Jones - I'm glad he was able to come back after the injury. He's just a deep bench player though, good for 1-2 3's a game.
Udonis Haslem - Loyalty is a big plus for me, he's been loyal to Miami from start to finish including college. The fans and team have been loyal right back at him.
Norris Cole - He's a little fighter, he doesn't get many minutes, and he will never be a lights out scorer, but he makes few mistakes which is rare for a rookie.
Dexter Pittman - Yeah, no sympathy here. Doesn't deserve a ring.
Juwan Howard - I'm pretty happy he got a ring, he's had a long career mixed with a lot of ups & downs, he deserved a ring.
For me, it has nothing to do with LeBron or Wade as people off the court, by all acoounts, they are model citizens, good family guys and stay out of trouble. It was the way they acted like champions before they were one (even though Wade had a ring, I'm talking about this team). Their arrogance and whining on the court turned me off.
it was a rhetorical question guys....you are entitled to hate you who you want to hate....but this team despite everything surrounding it had a lot of character and a lot of championship mettle, or simply they would not have won off just talent alone. thats all I was saying.
Im turned off by the Heat cuz I know guys around my age and they say they are Heat fans. Since when? Name me a good player before Shaq and Wade? Steve Smith, Glen Rice, Rony Seikaly....anyone and they cant. They are steam roller fans
My biggest thing was their parade after joining up, celebrating like they just won a title. Now they can have their parade.
Although I hate Miami, they're good for the NBA, they draw, they get people talking about the NBA, and they give me interest in every game they play because I always cheer for who they're playing. In pro wrestling terms, Miami is the ideal heel.
I've never liked Wade, especially after the '06 finals when the refs handed him a title after calling every foul they possibly could for him. I dislike Haslem because he went to Florida and was on that '06 team. Everyone else I'm apathetic towards. Lebron is the best player, but I'm just not big into him, I can name a lot more players I enjoy more, but I don't dislike him. Although I like Pat Riley because he's the Ric Flair of the NBA.
How can someone hate the Heat? The first and biggest reason is that they are from Ohio, particularly Cleveland. I don't think many people are happy for Lebron and the Heat winning a ring there since they were counting on him to win the Cavs some rings.
Personally I've been a fan of the Miami Heat since they traded Glen Rice for my favorite player at the time Alonzo Mourning. I've simply continued being a fan ever since.
I just had a question. Why would you dislike someone because you felt that the refs were cheating for them? It's fine not to like someone, but not to like them because of the refs, that they can't possibly control, doesn't make much sense.
People hate the Heat because they represent the people that get what they want through money. Nobody has any RESPECT for that. Remember when Malone and GP signed with LA, and everyone hated that team? I lost a lot of respect for both of those guys for doing that. They would have been happy they won, but I guarantee you it wouldn't have been as memorable for them as it should have beem. I also guarantee you a ring in Cleveland would have meant a lot more to LBJ than this one did.
I can guarantee that because personally I am going through my own struggles. I am trying to get a business off the ground and every day I wake up I have to make the choice that I am going to continue to struggle to pursue my dream. Every day I have to ask myself if I want to quit because things right now are so tough. As I search for somebody to give me the opportunity, when I succeed I know I will cry. After struggling for so long the excitement of winning pales in comparison to defeating every obstacle that has been thrown in your way. It won't be about the win, it will be about completing an intense journey.
Compare that to someone that is flush with cash and can pursue their dream without a facing a lot of the barriers everybody else faces. They have the money and contacts to develop their business, and a win for them means more money, so they are excited. However, a win for them isn't as meaningful as a win for those that risked everything and destroyed roadblocks that stood in their path.
If I were to fail at this, then win the lotto, or was handed somebody else's successful business, I would be extremely excited. But it wouldn't mean as much to me. The end result may be the same, but there would be no sense of conquering the path put in front of me. I also know they are thinking about no Howard and Rose in these playoffs. If people mention an asterisk, they will defend their title and rightfully so, but they are thinking about it.
LBJ went through a lot in Cle, but he quit, and nobody likes that. He then won the lotto/joined someone else's company as he signed with 2 other superstars, all willing to take less money than they could get elsewhere so they could win. Maybe that seems noble, taking less money, and nobody would have a problem with that if they all came up on the same team, but they didn't. Instead they took the shortcut to a championship and again, nobody respects that.
I know I brought up some personal stuff, but I think that's why people hate the Heat. It's personal. They are what most of us fight against every day and we have no respect for them.
Because it wasn't fair, he has a title that doesn't belong to him. I know what you mean, but just seeing Wade get talked up like a hero by ESPN during that finals made me resent him. I know it's not "fair" how I feel towards him, but it wasn't "fair" Wade got that title and all that praise in '06, that just life. Sure I might be resentful and stubborn, but I just don't like him and I'm not going to pretend to like him or be happy for him. I don't wish for anything bad for him in terms of health or personal life, but I hope he never wins another title, much less make another shot.
...between the Heat and the Marlins, they have both won 2 titles since they started in the 90's. They also, even though they have had teams that are competitive, have trouble filling the stands. I don't think that it is cute that 2 years removed from a World Series that the Marlins had to put tarps over some of their seats so that they didn't appear to be SOOOOOO empty. I don't like that until LeBron came, the Heat were flirting with the playoffs after their somewhat recent mid 2000's championship, with a Top 10 player in Wade, and they couldn't fill the seats that were visible by ABC's cameras during PLAYOFF GAMES!!! I think that the town (although the Dolphins do appear to have a pretty decent fan base) seems to be a terrible sports town.
I also hate the fact that the "Big 3" got together the way that they did. I don't like it's long term implications for the league. I like how the Thunder (although if I had my druthers it would still be the Sonics), Bulls, etc. have put together their teams. I also don't like to have a guy in LeBron, who is being compared to MJ, having to go join 2 other established superstars (unlike Jordan who helped developed them) in order to finally muster up enough to get "over the hump" and win a championship. I also don't like the way they whine and complain when the smallest thing doesn't go their way and DANCE around when they score 30 in a 1st round game (although that last part is more LeBron, before this season). I hate Riley, who probably had to hold himself back with all of his will power to not jump down from the office to the bench to coach (like the last time one of the best coaches in the league in Stan Van was coaching) because there was a very good, championship caliber team in place like the front running jerk he is. I am sick of typing, but I could keep going. I hate them, and I don't think their road to a title compares to almost any other title won in the last 20 years due to 2 of the Top 5 Eastern Conference teams (3 if you include Horford in Atlanta) with Rose and Howard going down being basically eliminated due to VERY bad injuries, both to Top 10 team carrying types of players who have VERY LITTLE injury history in their careers. etc., etc., etc.
ChrisCross, I understand what you mean. Wade attempted what 97 free throws in 6 games? That averages to 16 free throws a game, it was crazy. I'm sure conspiracy theorists will say it was David Stern's way of getting Mark Cuban under contract of something. Personally I try never to criticize the refs because it does no good, but to shoot that many free throws in 6 games obviously makes people ask some questions. It's still not the worst officiating I've seen. I don't know if anyone remembers when Reggie Miller forced the game 7 against the Bulls by first completely shoving Michael Jordan out of the way and yet there was no foul called.
Like I said I've been a Heat fan since way back when they traded for Alonzo Mourning. I don't live in or even near Miami, if I did I would certainly have to gone to a ton of games when they were good and bad. I grew up in the middle of nowhere where the closest pro sports city was Philadelphia and that was 3 hours away. Where I'm from you just liked whoever you liked and it was no big deal at least in terms of NBA, MLB, NFL...College football though everyone was a Penn State Fan.
Back to my point, I was around for the ups getting Zo and Tim Hardaway. Watching those teams do pretty well with Walt Williams, Chris Gatling, PJ Brown, Brian Grant, Eddie Jones, Jamal Mashburn, Voshon Leonard, Sasha Danilovic, Kurt Thomas, Billy Owens, Vladimir Stepania, Dan Marjele...yet always coming up short. It was awesome as a Heat fan when the team drafts Wade and he carries Zo to the title he could never earn on his own in 2006.
It's weird for me that my team has Lebron James on it. I may have been one of the only Heat fans who wasn't estatic about they getting Lebron. I thought they were signing Bosh and would add a bunch of pieces to make a really tough team. Obviously Riley knew what he was doing because he got Lebron and was able to retain Haslem, sign Mike Miller and Shane Battier to help the team be tough.
As a diehard fan of a city I've never been to, it's awesome to see them claim another championship.
Lebron made mistakes in the process of switching teams...that's the reason he is so hated.
When you combine "The Decision", the fact he went to a team with a homegrown superstar (D Wade), and the fact Lebron came up so small in the Finals last year, you came up with a lot of room for hate, and criticism for LBJ's imperfections.
What I think is twisted, is the fact we feel these guys for wrong for banning together as a team to win a championship. The fact we always stress teams win championships, not players, but we were MAD at Lebron and Wade for wanting to team up and win. We wanted Lebron to achieve individual glory, as opposed to winning as a part of a team. Chris Bosh was a player who was primarily good at one thing: scoring. On Miami he had to sacrifice alot of his scoring and excel in other ways. Improve his defense, improve his shotblocking, and play better as a role player than a star, but he gets mostly flack for this. Flack for joining to great stars in attempt to win, as opposed to doing his own thing. Wade gets flack for admitting he is the 2nd guy on a championship level team, instead of being the first guy on a team that couldn't get out of the first round. He's 30. He's already peaked. The combination of all these things have lead to alot of hate, when all they wanted to do is win championships.
Lebron silenced all the critics, won his ring, let's move on.
I don't understand the heat hate either. They play basketball the right way on both ends of the floor.
You're not forced to LOVE or HATE the heat... maybe you can judge them on the way they are playing.
So OK they won but the way they play was very poor... I don't like to see their game cause their is so few coaching, tactics, strategy, ball movement... that's not very interesting to see them play (win or lose, I really don't care when they play).
im a cavs fan and i dislike lebron very much but bosh even more
Riley and Lebron
Respect Haslem alot though
If it was only about playing the right way, then the Cavs teams with Mike Fratello at the helm would've been a beloved team in other cities than Cleveland.
I'm happy for Bosh, Miller, Battier, Cole, and Howard. Bosh is the least selfish guy out of the Big 3 and hardly ever complains. People make fun of him for getting too pumped up for getting an And 1 or making a hustle play, but I like it, he's got a fire. Miller, Battier, and Howard have always been good teammates and done things the right way, they're all nearing the end (perhaps 2 of them already at the end), and I'm glad they finally got a ring after all their years. And Cole never did anything to make you hate him. I loved how he was a Rookie and came in with no fear, firing away, making defensive plays, anything to help them win. He's a fighter, he doesn't complain, he's just a likeable guy.
However, I'm not a big fan of the rest of the guys that play. Lebron and Wade literally complain about every non-call they think they got fouled. They were even staring down the refs when they were letting stuff go when they were up by 30 for heaven's sake. James Jones takes so many cheap shots at people, he's got such a bad attitude sometimes. Mario Chalmers, while he is very clutch and comes up big in big moments, he acts bigger than he is. Like last night, pushing off Durant but won't look him in his face, that kind of stuff annoys me. Haslem, I don't even know why I don't like him so much, I just don't.
But the reason I hate them as a team is the same reason I hate Alabama. I live in Mississippi so everything is about football down here, and as soon as they started winning a couple years ago, everyone that lives here were Bama fans all of the sudden. None of them knew anything about football and couldn't name 10 players for their team, but acted cocky everytime they won. It's the same with a lot of Heat fans that I know. They only like them because it's popular to like them now, all these girls that have never watched an NBA game in their life postin crap on facebook like "Lebron!! Thunder can't handle the Heat ;)" (<-- real status), and always talk at other times about how much they don't like basketball.
You can say it's not the players fault that they get favourable calls and it is true. Howerver it is ok to dislike them because of the bias. It is also ok to hate them because they get favourable calls and then still complain when they don't get a bail out shot. I personally hate the heat, i did like Wade for awhile but now he just complains and looks for calls. Bosh is the same as Wade both of them have never fouled anyone in their minds and are fouled on every shot they take. As for Lebron besides being an athletic freak, he has a average at best jumpshot, is only descent defensively because he gets away with way to much contact, and pushes off with his left hand everytime he drives to his right. If the refs were to call the game the same way with him as the average player, that is exactly what he would be an average player
I agree with you on EVERY point BUT....
LeBron would not be average. He would adjust his game. He is VERY good and always will be. He might still be playing at 40 years old and making the All-Star team as a PF. He is that good.
Everything else you said I agree with you 100%, even on the criticisms of LeBron and him getting away with calls, but if they consistently called some of those things I think he would just adjust and still dominate. He finally did what he needed to do in the playoffs this year, I just don't think I respect him for it as much as I would if Rose and Howard were not hurt. But he was just dominant and would have been no matter what, in my opinion. It might have been a bit harder to have a Triple Double in his final game of the year if he had to contend with a healthy Eastern Conference though.
I also can't stand that, before LeBron won a championship (and SEEMED to quit on a team with the league's best record just months earlier) he was predicting as much as 8 championships in a RIDICULOUS parade/movie premiere/concert/whatever the hell it was. Remember, there wasn't a dancing Haslem and Chalmers. There were 3 guys (1 of whom was not really a "free agent signing") there.
Oh, I hate the way last season when Omer Asik dove for a ball near Bosh, Chris Bosh complained as if his kids could starve because you "know better than to go 'after' somebody's legs/knees", while also going 1/19 (or whatever the hell it was) against the same team.
When the Bulls played the Cavs 3 seasons ago (LeBron's last with Cleveland) in the first round of the playoffs, LeBron had a pretty good game. He hit a really good 3 with someone in his face (don't remember who). It was Game 3. He was dancing around like he was on the Harlem Globetrotters, because he scored his 30th some odd point, in a first round playoff game that was WELL in hand. Since then, I never really liked LeBron's attitude, because I don't remember Kobe doing that when he scored his 81st point against Toronto. I don't remember when Jordan danced around because he scored 30 against an 8 seed in the 1st round. Then, when things weren't going well later in the playoffs, not only was he not dancing, but he was pouting and quitting on his team. For a self annointed "King", I always felt like that attitude rubbed me the wrong way. He is SOOOO talented. There isn't even a question who the best player in the NBA is, it's him hands down. Same way when you watch the Dream Team documentary, they all are HOF's but they are all B+, A- players compared to Jordan who is A+. I feel that LBJ is the same. There is him, and everyone else. Like in the draft this year, there is Davis, and everyone else. I always like my superstars to set an example that I played with when I played college/high school sports. If you score a TD, act like you have done it 100 times. When you hit a big shot, act like you expected to hit it. It's okay to celebrate victory, but do it with some class. Same as losing. Do it with class and dignity. Same reason I hate Isaiah Thomas and the Detroit Pistons. They didn't win or lose with class (and, karma is a &$#%#&@!, isn't it Isaiah, since everything you touch now turns to shit).
I hate the way the refs have favored Wade since the 2006 Finals, when every other young player needed to "earn their stripes". I think Wade (whom, by all indications, USED TO BE one of the classiest, friendliest guys in the league) acts like a punk who will REALLY start to decline fast and not "age gracefully".
I think that in Game 4, when Russell Westbrook sank his 33 or 35 point and FINALLY got a FT attempt, it showed that the refs were favoring the "veterans" in the finals a bit more. I am personally okay with that, but when it happened in 2006 with Wade (who had a similar game back then to Russ), the difference went to the younger guy who hadn't "paid his dues". I don't really understand it, but based on the NBA in the past, I would be okay with the more veteran (at least in it's core) Heat getting more calls. I don't really like that the NBA doesn't call the game the same for everyone, but I am a fan of the NBA and am used to it.
I wonder if everyone would feel the same if the Bulls would have signed the Miami "Big 3" (which they could have, I know for a fact, they had a deal in place to move Deng, don't bother disputing it because my source is VERY good). The starting lineup would have been Rose, Wade, James, Bosh, Noah. Would that have been fair to anyone in the league? I am glad it didn't happen, it would have taken a lot of the fun out of it for me to have guys that came in and made people hate my team and prevented Rose (hell, anyone on that team) from winning an MVP.
I do also hate how much DWade whines now. He never used to complain before. I wouldn't say Bosh is that bad though. He's about the same as most guys in the league. DWade sometimes doesn't run back on defense because he's complaining to the ref now which is insane.
to hate them.
Dwyane (I pronounce it like it's spelled, dwuh-Yane) Wade, or as I like to call him, DWhine complains to the refs as much or more than anyone else, often refusing to run back on D to bark at the refs. Add in cheap shots (Kobe in the All-Star game, Collison in the playoffs), and his fake tough-guy image, and it's hard to see why people shower him with praise as much as they do.
Lebron (Princess) James is obviously a very talented basketball player. I'm not sure he doesn't believe he is the next coming of Jesus, or Zeus. Maybe Jezeus. His ego is almost too big to describe.The way he is officiated makes me sick sometimes. How can someone that big and strong not get a foul when he hits you? How can someone that big and strong fall down when a point guard blocks his path to the basket? I guess I don't know what traveling is anymore, because I see him take not one, not two, not three, but four steps or more three or four times a game.
Chris (Like a) Bosh is another fake tough-guy, but he puffs up like a blowfish and screams whenever he does anything, score, rebound, block a shot, take a sip of water without spilling it, etc.
Dexter Pittman should have been jailed for his flagrant foul (again, incorrectly called by the refs, suprise, suprise) on Lance Stephenson.
I don't have any problem with Battier, Miller, or Chalmers. It makes me mad Juwan Howard got a ring before Dwight Howard. Joel Anthony is a champion and Charles Barkley is just a funny fat guy?
I hope the Thunder can keep their pieces together, grow from this years finals, and challenge the cHeat for the next several years.
they got their team through money? man, they got those players on good deals. why be mad at that? those players couldve went elsewhere for more money, not just the big 3 but Haslem and some of the others. yet Dan Gilbert throws around money like its water. taking on Luke Walton's contract....you cant be serious. they put together a talented team because the players were unselfish....not because they through money around. maybe teams can learn something from that....dont go out overspending for mediocre stars....give players a reason to want to be on your team and they may not try to break the bank when they sign.
how many of you hate the Celtics???? Rondo is a very arrogant basketball player, even though he is a team player on the court, its no secret he is not the easiest player for coaches to get along with. Pierce....one word....wheelchair. KG....one of the most blatant dirty players ever. and for what he did to Bill Walker and didnt even get a slap on the wrist??? there are only a few guys on that team you could really root for, Ray Allen being one.
I understand that most of the hate is coming from the pre-championship celebration but never thought a team would be hated as much for one guy shooting off his mouth. judging by the negs I got on this post, I see I really offended some with this question.
you can love the way OKC was put together but a little luck was involved there, how many of you thought that Westbrook, a guy that wasnt even a star in college, a guy who was a SG who had to transition to PG would be an All NBA player in his first few years in the league? how many of you thought with the 24th pick in the draft that Ibaka would lead the NBA in blocked shots 2 years early into his career? how many people thought Harden would be the star that he is now....he was a good scorer but his athleticism and explosiveness was a big question mark for teams. OKC obviously knows what the hell they are doing, but it took some risk. Had Cleveland knew what they were doing, they wouldnt have picked Luke Jackson. They couldve easily took a big man with potential like Al Jefferson...or a PF like Kris Humphries.
While I dont like the idea of teaming up with stars, its just not like it was in Jordan's day. Its hard to keep teams together because of how free agency is now. OKC may not be able to keep Harden and Ibaka both. If Wade and Bosh wouldve went to Cleveland would it have been different?
Also, to even imply that Lebron is a quitter is ridiculous, Cleveland should be grateful that they even had a Lebron era.
@chriscross, you are 100% correct, the Heat is good for the NBA, every sport needs a bad guy. Floyd Mayweather is one of the most hated boxers in recent memory....I guess thats why he is this year's highest paid athlete.
this "shortcut" to a championship business is the most ridiculous double standard nonsense I ever heard. if Lebron stays in Cleveland and never wins, he wouldve never gotten his just due. he would just be a guy who put up flashy numbers and won MVP's but never a true winner because he wouldnt have a title. would a title in Cleveland mean more than this one in Miami, of course, but who's to say he would ever win one? if Lebron wouldnt have been so scrutinized for his lack of rings, I dont think he wouldve ever left Cleveland. damned if you do, damned if you dont.
I challenge anyone here who thinks Jordan wins 6 titles without Pippen. Do you guys know that Jordan was viewed the same way as Lebron before he won his first title? Kobe, the same way once Shaq left. Talented gunners. Great players but dont measure up to the Russells, the Birds, the Magics, the Kareems. Michael Jordan was rumored to be on the trading block after his 4th year in the league. Who knows if he wouldve left had free agency been different then? It was also rumored that MJ wanted Pippen traded early in his career because they couldnt get past the Piston roadblock. Just like Kobe didnt want Bynum....see how history repeats itself? Kobe was real close to leaving L.A. and not getting those championships. The point is...this is a team sport and no matter how great a player is, there is no one that has total control. As Herm Edwards so elloquently put it...."you play to WIN the game! hello!"
how do you criticize someone for not winning then turn around and criticize them for the way they won?
you will never erase that : THEY CHOSE EASINESS OVER CHALLENGE.
... for anybody (you, me...) that could be just a "comfortable choice", but for a professionnal sportsman that's the exact opposite of what you have to be.
I think that's a good reason not to like them.
LeBron has definitely become more humble, but D-Wade is still a douche.
@surve : 1 difference !
kobe, jordan... they didn't left their team to win...
Pippen was not a genius in his first years with jordan but jordan pushed him to become one of the greatest.
"THEY CHOSE EASINESS OVER CHALLENGE."
what was easy about it? although they guaranteed victory, was it really easy? you guys didnt like it when Team USA was getting blown out did you? The top players in the NBA. This is the highest level, nothing is guaranteed. Why are pro athletes playing in the Olympics anyway? You know why? Because the society we live in places emphasis on superiority....that superiority is measured by tangibles such as winning. When college kids couldnt compete in the Olympics anymore, what happened? But you guys root for these Dream Teams dont you? Whats the difference??? Its gotten so bad as far as boxers winning gold medals, the US contemplated sending pro boxers to the Olympics. Why this double standard for the society you live in and the ideaology it fosters???
if you sent comprised an Olympic team of the Kentucky Wildcats since Calipari was there, they would be getting crushed in international competition and you guys would be begging, send Lebron, send Chris Paul, etc...in fact...you probably would be pissed if Lebron came up with a reason as to why he couldnt play. yet you dont want him to win an NBA championship with another guy who is a top 10 player and maybe another one who is top 25?
nobody wants to be challenged all their life and not have some level of success to measure the challenge against. I dont know if any of you have ever played on a team where you were the best on that team but your team could never beat a team that had more collective talent. its cool to be the star and all but after a while, it gets old. Lebron wanted to play with better players, obviously because he was tired of losing. that says alot about his ego though. he doesnt have one.
nobody hates NYK like that, for Melo and Amare teaming up, and those are two selfish dudes just by the way they play the game. I dont see how one could say Lebron quit on the Cavs and Melo didnt quit on Denver...I dont care if it was the regular season. I doubt many people make such a big deal if Dwight teams up with DWill. Nobody made a big deal when Bosh teamed up with Wade, its just that when Lebron did it, it was the worst thing ever.
Thanks for bringing that up... Pippen was drafted to the Bulls. It's not like him and Jordan met up mid-prime and teamed up.
As great of a player as Pippen grew into, he was never an alpha male. It was always MJ.
Kobe almost did and we all should know how close he was to being gone. Jordan very well could have....but again, every circumstance is different. Malone and Ewing should have left in their primes, Barkley stayed in Philly too long. so even though Lebron won a title, he is still a loser for the way he got it in your eyes? I say he just didnt make the same mistake that other greats WITHOUT a title did.
you guys talk about Jordan as if he is GOD, and no man is. I see where you stand from your avatar. so there is no arguing with you. Jordan pushed Pippen? what would Jordan be without Pip? ask yourself that. who did Lebron have in Cleveland to push to be great? Mo Williams? Mo is a decent player but he doesnt even sniff the All Star game without Lebron on his team.
I don't hate the heat... (I just hate the way they play).... and I don't like the NEW NYK with melo and stoud'... and I won't like the NEW NETS with d12 and deron...
that's the same sh*t in my opinion... you are affraid to face adversity and maybe failure, so you chose to pair with other players (coward ?)... that's not the way I imagine professional sportsman are made of.
I like OKC INDI PHILA MINNY and CHI building through the draft, I like SA building through smart trades and players development.
Once again make a look at the bulls roster : all the pippen rodman horace grant harper paxson kukoc... were brung through the draft and smart trades and THEN developped by how jordan was competitive.
Jordan faced FAILURES and stayed and developped all the complementary pieces around him thanks to hos strong mentality.
All the williams, howard, james, bosh (wade ?), melo, stoud... are so strong athletes... but so weak mentaly in comparison.
@ surve : you tell it yourself "Jordan very well could have" (kobe too)... could is not did... that's a big difference.
I don't have a Fan mentality (my avatar is only because I like the photo with those two)... Pip' was out from a division II university... he was a good prospect but really nothing great. He developped nicely cause he faced FAILURE in PO against detroit and some other teams. That brang him to be a better player.
"so even though Lebron won a title, he is still a loser for the way he got it in your eyes?" : it really depends on what you call a winner and a loser... in my opinion James is not a better winner than 2 weeks ago and in my mind Malone and stockton are not losers cause they didn't win a title... they accomplished so much more...
If Ewing or Malone had moved during their prime years what would have been the value of their potential success ?... this is the real question (not about james or the heat but more general). We have a quote in france saying something like that : (sorry for the bad translation)
When you win without risk, you dominate without glory"
(What is the most important ? the moment you're on the top of the mountain or the way you manage to be there ?)
hey, times change....nothing is the same...its not as easy as you say it is. to think these players are mentally weaker than others is what you see in your mind but you are not fairly comparing the timing and subjectivity.
as I stated OKC has a little luck on there side....a lot of luck perhaps if you consider if they wouldve gotten the 1st pick they couldve had an injury prone Oden. Must I remind you that San Antonio was lucky as hell....they were a contender for the title who lost their HOF center for one year and ended up with the number one draft pick. Hypothetically, lets say Lebron misses his 2nd year, the Cavs get the 1st pick in the 04 draft...thats Dwight Howard. Oh, that makes it better because you are building through the draft. I agree, but that aint likely.
OKC and San Antonio are the only teams you mentioned that have a good shot at a title in the next couple of years. Chicago, great team...but they may never win a title, especially if they have to go through the Heat or a re-tooled Celtics team. the rest of the teams, have about as much chance of winning a title in the next 10 years as a snowball in hell....unless....they bring in some superstars to team with the talent they already have...but who would do such a thing?
"Not 5.....Not 6.....Not 7" <---The overconfidence and disrespect made me dislike them
@surve about your comment that the Thunder "got lucky" with Ibaka, Harden, and Westbrook all exceeding everyone's expectations: I don't think we got lucky. I think Sam Presti knows what he's doing and is basically a genius. There's no getting lucky 3 times in a row. Also, give some credit to the training staff and the coaching. If they went to a different team (aside from the Spurs and Bulls, we all know they have phenomenal staffs), I doubt they would be the same players
If you don't know how someone can dislike Wade, you don't pay attention to basketball. He's the biggest flopping drama queen in the league. He acted his way to one title and rode coattails to another.
I mean, how can a guy make fun of someone for playing with the flu and then cry to the refs like "Oh! Oh no! My eye! My eye! The guy who was about ten feet away from me when I was taking that shot poked me in the eye!"
Weird note, though. Pau Gasol, Mike Miller, and Shane Battier all have rings. I guess the Grizzlies weren't that bad afterall....