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How Bad Are The Raptors Really

OhCanada-
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How Bad Are The Raptors Really

Toronto is in much better shape than many other NBA teams and our situation isnt that bad.Losing Bosh sounds alot worse than it really is at least now we will have a solution for playing two PFs and finally have a definitive first option.Also they will be able to find a real Center so our defensive issues will get alot less complicated just by that.I think part of the reason this young team was so bad is because they relied on Bosh and not on themselves as a unit.When Toronto played as a unit they were a very good team and hard for anyone in the NBA to beat.

If Toronto can get rid of Calderon and Turkoglu's contracts and get a Top 5 pick in 1 or 2 of the next couple drafts this team will have a very bright future.

The Raptors will get value from Chris Bosh (hopefully more draft picks and young players), money and have the 13th pick this year.

PG-Jack
SG-Derozan,Bellinelli
SF-Weems, Wright
PF-Bargnani
C -Johnson

Derozan is a 20 year old wing who will most likely never be a number one scoring option but I see him being a great defender and capable 2nd or 3rd scoring option like Gerald Wallace.His midrange game is ok but a more consistent outside shot is needed drastically.

Weems is another athletic and quick wing player with good defensive upside at the wing position. His mid-range game is very good as well but with an outside shot he could be deadly.

Bargnani has an offensive cieling as large as anybodys in the NBA. Unless youve seen him play from a Raptors, Knicks, 76ers, Mavs, Suns perspective you might not know about his offensive upside because he usually just sits back and relaxes when Bosh becomes ball dominant.

Johnson is a veteran NBA player (being drafted out of Highschool) and is still only 24. He is a reliable energy player from the bench and already one of the best players in the league at that roll. He shows signs of being a very good starting role player in the league.

Every team needs a true Big Man to win. If the Raptors can land a dominant big in the draft sometime in the next 2 years this team can be very good.


Mr.Knick 32
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The Raptors are not getting a

The Raptors are not getting a top 5 pick for Hedo or Calderon.

I agree, the Raptors aren't half bad. The issue is- What is Toronto getting back for Bosh. I'm almost 99 percent sure he's leaving. The team who wants to do the S&T always gets less value. It happens every time. I don't see Toronto getting a lotto pick or a player half the value of Chris Bosh in a S&T

I feel Toronto should draft Ed Davis from UNC

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I didnt mean that knicksboy

I didnt mean that knicksboy lmao

I meant in the next season they will lose enough games for a top 5 pick you genius hahaha

We might have to give up picks just to get rid of Turkoglu and Calderon but it has to be done

I know you Knicks fans have youre heart set on a Sign and Trade with David Lee but I really hope Bosh goes to Miami.They only have a whole bunch of Draft PIcks and Beasley to play with so we wont get any heavy contracts from them.

Mr.Knick 32
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LOL, I know. As soon as a

LOL, I know. As soon as a posted it I thought- Ya know, if Toronto called and said " 13th, Hedo and Calderon for the 6th and Ellis" I think it would go down.

Yea, I think right now for Bosh it's (in order) Heat, Bulls, Knicks. I could see T-Dot asking for Beasley and those 3 2nd rounders which would be good.

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LOL no we would rather

LOL no we would rather entertain offers to New Jersey for Lopez and the 3rd haha

That would be very good then we could get a full team hopefully full of athletic defenders which seems to be this new team identity and make Beasley reach his potential somewhat lol.Then when Beasley publicly announces Toronto is too cold for him he wants a trade (which should be right around December of 2011) we can get another good young player and build a very good team.

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personally, I'm not touching

personally, I'm not touching Beasley.

What about Bosh to Houston for the 14th, Budinger and a big contract?

Nugz10
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bosh to houston

i think they are going to use budinger more in the rotation this season, maybe swapping scola for bosh (both sign and trades) with a pick thrown in and if salaries need to match i think battier's deal is expiring. They are still in the mix for bosh but if they had just let Tmacs deal expire who knows what Morey would be planning right now.

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Ya know, if Toronto called

Ya know, if Toronto called and said " 13th, Hedo and Calderon for the 6th and Ellis" I think it would go down.

no way a curry Calderon backcourt would be just about the softest back court ever. And I know ellis has his issues but seriously undervaluing the man. Remember we could have gotten OJ Mayo for him straight up. A better deal then that trash haha

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Troy Murphy, and Jeff Foster

Troy Murphy, and Jeff Foster will take this team to the playoffs.

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Knicksboy, seriously? The

Knicksboy, seriously? The Warriors would pick up two horrendous contracts in Calderon and Turkoglu, AND have to give up Ellis and the 6th pick? Calderon's 28. Turkoglu's 31. Both have huge, long term contracts for 3 and 4 more years, respectively. I don't think Ellis is necessarily a good fit for the Warriors, but he's only 24 years old, and he's not a talentless scrub...do they need to take that much baggage, and give up a top 10 pick in order to get rid of him? Wow. I've heard of several bad trades, but this one would just be awful for the Warriors. Monta might not be worth more, but you could dump him for far better deals if you had to, like the rumored OJ Mayo + Hasheem Thabeet deal.

I guess if the object is to make the Warriors suck even more, then yes, this deal would go through.

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Hes being sarcastic holy

Hes being sarcastic holy crawp you guys are stupid lmao

Houston isnt on Bosh's list

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I think when two people read

I think when two people read the post and can't detect sarcasm from it, either a) the post was not meant sarcastically, b) the poster did not express that sarcasm well, or c) 'you guys are stupid'

I personally think that it's a or b, but that might just be because I don't like being called stupid. Then again, 7chakras and Knicksboy might be the same person, which would explain why he/she/it got the post immediately.

Anyway, the notion of the Raptors drafting Ed Davis seems rather bad to me; Davis is a soft big who plays PF, and Bargnani would again be forced to play C. The Raptors need a physical center so they can move Bargnani back to the 4. Or maybe he was being sarcastic there again, in which case I apologize for being stupid...

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houston sucks.

houston sucks.

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Hey man relax its just a

Hey man relax its just a basketball forum dont take everything so seriously

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I don't really understand the

I don't really understand what you are trying to get at 7chakras. You say that Toronto has a bright future, then go on to say if we can get rid of Calderon and Turkeglu (two horrendous contracts) AND get 1-2 top 5 picks to get into contention. So what you're saying is that Toronto will be in better shape than "many other NBA teams", if you get a top 5 pick for the next 1-2 years (aka losing a &$#%#&@! load of games) and can manage to dump 2 bad contracts? How is that in better shape than most NBA teams? Pretty much every team will be in contention if they can supplement their existing team with an incoming top 5 player 2 years in a row and get rid of their two worst contracts.

Having seen Amir Johnson play on a number of occasions I can say without doubt that he is nowhere near "one of the best players in the league" at coming off the bench. Not even close. He can be a decent role player in this league, but that is his ceiling at this point. People were crying out in his Detroit days to "give him a chance" and he did nothing whenever given it. He is a decent 8th or 9th man, but nothing more than that. If he is starting on your team than you are in some major trouble.

Turkoglu and Calderon have atrocious contracts and there is no real sense of direction with the team. Bargnani is probably a solid player and I agree that the Raps will player better team basketball now that Bosh is leaving, but as a neutral I look at that roster and think that you guys will be in trouble for a while now.

I assume that I will get a bunch of negatives from you Toronto guys, but I think that you're future is looking quite bleak rather than "better than many NBA teams".

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Chabvis I respect your

Chabvis I respect your opinion and understand what your saying but with the Raptors those situations are not "IF's" they are "WHEN's" and "HOW's".They will get rid of Turkoglu's contract and possibly not definitely Calderon's.They will get value in return of Chris Bosh, and the team will get a high draft pick.Thats the point of this thread not if the Raptors can do this or that because these are things that are already in process.

Now where the problem lies is Bad Contract's.Bosh, Turkoglu, and Calderon getting traded for bad contracts will make the Raptors be in a difficult spot.

And youre just mad because the Piston's whole roster is bad contracts.Joe Dumar's thought because he got lucky the first time the second time he waved around a bunch of cash he would win another NBA Championship.

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Chabvis I respect your

Chabvis I respect your opinion and understand what your saying but with the Raptors those situations are not "IF's" they are "WHEN's" and "HOW's".They will get rid of Turkoglu's contract and possibly not definitely Calderon's.They will get value in return of Chris Bosh, and the team will get a high draft pick.Thats the point of this thread not if the Raptors can do this or that because these are things that are already in process.

Now where the problem lies is Bad Contract's.Bosh, Turkoglu, and Calderon getting traded for bad contracts will make the Raptors be in a difficult spot.

And youre just mad because the Piston's whole roster is bad contracts.Joe Dumar's thought because he got lucky the first time the second time he waved around a bunch of cash he would win another NBA Championship.

Leftovers16
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No Bosh no raptors

If they lose Bosh and pick up garbage they are in bad shape look at the names they are a bunch of no namers I can't believe how many people rate players by their offensive game like a Cj Watson u can put up 40 but I could careless if u can score if it's 5 on 4 on the defensive side I don't need u defense win championships like Chabvis said they are in worst shape then most rebuilding teams if they lose Bosh ie Twolves who only need another player or two with potential they have their starting 5 pretty much, Kings they have roster full of young potential, Pacers they have their big and small forward with ok players, the Raptors have ok players but no star no leadership if Bosh leaves

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The Raptors should draft Paul

The Raptors should draft Paul George if available, or Luke Babbitt, they need that true scoring option that comes from a wing player, I believe they should only keep one of DD or Weems, they are pretty simular players.

Chabvis
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"They will get rid of

"They will get rid of Turkoglu's contract and possibly not definitely Calderon's."

Getting rid of Turkoglu and Calderon's contracts are not the problem. The problem is not having to blow up your team in the process and try to get value from them. Turkoglu could be a decent option for a contender I suppose, but Calderon is just a completely overpaid backup PG. Jarret Jack has played better than him when he has played. Can Toronto get rid of these guys without throwing in future picks? I am not so sure.

"They will get value in return of Chris Bosh"

Probably, but not necessarily guaranteed.

"the team will get a high draft pick."

I don't think the 13th pick has a huge amount of value, but if you mean in the future than yeah I agree because I don't think the team has a whole lot of talent. So I agree that they will be in the high draft choices for a couple of years.

But if they are picking high in the draft that means that the team is not good. I don't see a lot of young talent on the squad either, so I don't see a good short-term outlook and I do not see the young talent that will propel them into the future. Therefore I don't think they have a "better future than most (if any) NBA teams".

"And youre just mad because the Piston's whole roster is bad contracts.Joe Dumar's thought because he got lucky the first time the second time he waved around a bunch of cash he would win another NBA Championship."

LOL. Literally as I am posting I was thinking he will instantly say well you're team is bad. Maybe they are, this is not the debate at hand. The current debate is whether the Raps have a "bright future".

My equation goes as follows:

Losing elite player (Bosh) + Terrible contracts (Calderon, Turkoglu) + Lack of young talent (even with giving Derozan the benefit of the doubt) + No defense = Bleak future that is WORSE than most NBA teams.

Chabvis
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I would go as far to say that

I would go as far to say that I would rather have EVERY SINGLE NBA team than Toronto's other than Cleveland without LeBron and New York if they miss out on the big guns, based on current talent, young talent, cap space, etc.

Of the other bottom dwellers:
Sacramento - Young star in Tyreke
GS - Same with Curry
Clippers - Griffin, Gordon, Kaman, cap space
Minnesota - Jefferson, Love, Flynn, Rubio, cap space
NJ - young talent (Harris, Lopez), top 3 pick, rich owner etc
Indiana - at least they have Granger
Pistons - Gordon, Stuckey, Prince and Rip are decent trade pieces

Washington would have been a worse situation IMO if they didnt get the number 1 pick, but now I would rather have their team too.

How is Toronto in a better situation than most NBA teams? It is really an absurd statement. Even if by some ridiculous reason you think they are better than the all of the above teams, they are still in a worse situation than the majority of the league.

NashyMing
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The Raptors

The Raptors is definitely not in the worst situation if they handle this summer properly and not doing stupid tweaks on the roster trying to win now and giving up young prospects/draft picks in the process.

I can certainly see BC doing the panic moves and trading our picks, young players for big names that other team wouldn't want in order to quickly patch up the team that may look good on paper.
e.g. Gibert Arenas and Elton Brand.

Bosh leaving Toronto is certainly not the end of the world. I actually wished they traded Bosh 2 years ago to properly rebuild at that time. We would have a young and talent good team if BC didn't try to patch the team for the past 3 years without any success.

e.g.
1) Trading for JO while he's an older version of Bosh and the 3 PFs plan failed as expected, and we gave up a #17 in the process.
2) Trading JO + a protected pick for Marion's expiring contract to try to balance out the roster after a 4 months JO experiement failed. (we are lucky to keep our pick in such a deep draft, i was rooting for the Raptors to miss the playoff since all-star break).
3) Using the cap space from Marion's expiring contract to sign Turkoglu that ridiculous 50mil+ contract

Also, numerous stupid signing by BC for the past a few years had be haunting this team.

E.g. Fred Jones, Kapono, Jose, and most recently Turk.

BC is so shortsighted and tried to build this team around Bosh had proven to fail. I don't have any confidence in him in not screwing us up further.

Let's hope he's getting smarter this time and start a real rebuilding process.

Chabvis
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Who is in a worse situation

Who is in a worse situation right now?

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