Has the Rose lovefest finally gone too far?
Legler called Rose the most dominant point guard since Magic, but the stats aren't really THAT similar. Rose has a slight edge in points, but Magic smokes him in assists, fg%, and steals. Not to mention the stats not mentioned... Magic averaged 2 more rebounds and a much better assist to turnover ratio.
I think Rose should probably be the MVP, but I think this is a bit excessive. The most dominant season statistically (since this is the criteria here) for a point guard since Magic's incredible season is Paul's 08-09 season. Westbrook's numbers are also VERY similar to Rose's, and so is Westbrook a close second to being the most "dominant" point guard since Magic?
Again, I'm not a Rose hater at all, but this Rose as Jesus stuff is wearing me out a little.
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you can't compare anyone to Magic just by looking at a few numbers.
I love Rose and he earned my respect for MVP for this season (unless LeBron makes a huge push in the last few weeks of the season and the Bulls some how collapse)
but 24 and 12 assists WHILE being an efficient 52% is remarkable. comparing Magic's court vision to Rose (no offense) isn't fair. Derrick Rose can go up hang in the air for a few minutes and then make a pass but Magic was always a frame ahead of everyone back then. Plus, I do agree with you on Westbrook. He averages two less points than Rose, but averages more rebounds, assists, steals, and FT% and gets no attention. Rose can score 30 points and people will be crazy over him but fail to realize that it may have took him 28 shots to get those 30 points. That's not really being efficient last time I checked.
I just don;t like that comparison to Magic honestly. If anything, Rose reminds me in some ways of Iverson, except with a better team. I admire Rose and his ability to lead his team and basically put the team on his shoulder and carry them night in and night out much like AI.
Magic was 6'9 so of course he averaged more rebounds, but Rose and Magic don't even play that similar. Rose is probably the most exciting player to watch in the NBA and will be the MVP, so obviously he will get a lot of comparisons to hall of famers.
You mean to tell me it's unfair to compare the best point guard in the game today and probable MVP to Magic Johnson but it's completely fair and possible to dub a high school player named LeBron James as "The Chosen One" and compare him to a mix between Dr. J and Magic Johnson before he even won a national championship?
Okay, just making sure.
Numbers don't always tell the whole story.. their numbers werent being compared.. the way they would each influence the game was, and in that regard Rose can be argued to have the same kind of in game affect that Magic had. I'm not saying he is but it is debateable. Of course Rose doesn't have the vision/passing (hence the large margin in apg) but Rose is the better scorer and more athletic so I mean, its very debateable but I wouldn't enter that territory until maybe a few years down the line. Until then, Rose is killin it and so far I think deserves to be MVP
in his 3rd season, LBJ averaged 31 ppg, 7 rbg, and 6 apg and led the Cavs to 50 wins, only 3 games behind a championship calibur Detriot Pistons. And the insuing season, he took a team of Donyell Marshall, Larry Hughes, Boobie Gibson, and Big Z to the Finals single handed. Yes, LBJ has not won a chip yet BUT in no means did he not live up to his expectations since high school. He is already in a discussion for HOF by many players, coaches, and analysts
I'm saying, why is it so bad to compare a top MVP candidate to a hall of famer, but it's not wrong at all to compare a high school kid to Magic Johnson x Dr. J?
I see what you're saying now lol
i dont think rose will ever become the player johnson was
but comparing johnson and rose isnt bad at all
that just tells u how good of a season rose is having
Didnt see the video but Legs didn't compare them with stats he said dominate. Which could mean several things but I think he means the way magic dominated with his passing rose is dominating with his scoring....,I may be wrong but I doubt it
did not look at it like that from that perspective.. I'm about to change my name to "Misinterpretation Man" cuz I Was Wrong, and there's no doubting it lol
Yea he never compared him to Magic he said "Since" Magic. And he's right Rose can take over games anytime he wants. And his hype isn't nearly as bad as some players in the past plus he is living up to it.
People need to take a look at the team Allen Iverson took to the Finals. It was one of the greatest one-man sows in league history.
Rose is on the short list of great point guards since Magic, but those Iverson teams have to be considered. Even the 2006 Dwyane Wade, who was a pseudo-point also merits consideration.
Everyone has always loved Rose, and Durant. Like I rarely ever see anyone ripping these two, and they rarely do anything to deserve to be ripped. They deserve the love, and I dont really expect them to get thast Kobe, Lebron type hatred. Cant get mad at people for showing love now.
Anybody else wanna see Oklahoma vs Chicago in the Chsmpionship? That would be a refreshing change and definitely get these guys some hatred.
He doesnt say Rose is as good as Magic, he says Rose is the best since Magic. So instead of comparing his stats to Magic's, which is ridiculous, start comparing his stats to Isiah, AI, J Kidd, Nash, and all the other PGs post Magic. Also, yes, if you are a month away from becoming the youngest MVP in league history, they can comapre you to anyone.
Rose is the best basketball player at the PG position. Is he the best PG? I don't know about that. He is an undersized 2 guard who's the primary ball handler, and he takes 20 shots a game. If they do win a championship any time soon, it will mainly be because of team defense and coaching.
No, it will mainly be because of Derrick Rose. Last time i checked you have to put the ball in the hoop. And if they get through Miami, Boston, and La, Lebron, DWade, and Kobe, yes, Derrick Rose will be the main reason.
The reason the Bulls are so good this season is because they can keep games low scoring to make up for their mediocre offense. If they can get past those guys, it will take defense, not Rose outgunning them. It takes more than putting the ball in the hoop because as a team, the Bulls aren't good at doing that, and it's true that defense wins championships. It's not just a cliche saying.
Duh they are good because of there defense, but Rose, and to a lesser extent Luol Deng is there entire offense. YOu act like Rose should get no credit for how good they are. This guy comes through every game. They keep games low scoring and hes the one who has to take them over on the offensive end.
If you agree that they're good because of their defense then why are we arguing? I never said Rose shouldn't get any credit. My first post I said if they win a championship, it will be mainly because of their defense. I didn't say it will be all because of their defense like how you're saying I'm acting like Rose gets no credit. Rose gets credit. He's the MVP of the season so far.
Urbaneverything, you forgot Boozer, he brings offense to the table. And they also get great production from their bench every night.
The offense from their bench is ranked 22nd. They are the best bench defensively, statistically speaking, if that is what you meant.
I definitely don't think Rose is the mvp. He'll win the award due to the success of the Bulls and the hate for Lebron.
He's a great player, worthy of being in the conversation. But I think the real MVP race should be between Chris Paul, Lebron and Pau Gasol. Rose is just a notch below those guys
Yes, their second unit plays great defense, and while they might not put up a ton of points, they stretch the game by being a very good passing unit which can eat up a lot of clock.
The Bulls are the #1 seed in the east, Rose is still the only player in the top 10 in both scoring and assists, and continually takes games over down the stretch. How can you honestly say that Paul is more deserving of the award? And Pau Gasol?! That is just ridiculous.
that rose has been overhyped. i'm even more annoyed that tom thibideau is going to get looked over for coach of the year because everyone has put the bulls success down to their point guard.
i can't look further than Dwight Howard for MVP this year. simply for VALUE...you take him away from orlando, what the hell do you have?!? he keeps them relevant on both ends of the floor. he is basically unique in the NBA today, whereas if you put chris paul, deron williams, russell westbrook, rajan rondo in that bulls team instead of rose, they'd do just as well.
That's what I'm saying, morestealthanscore. People are hating on my posts apparently because I think their defense and coaching would win them a championship before Rose. Unless Rose takes over series like how Wade did when he won his ring, I don't see it happening. If they did win, he'd be the finals MVP because he's going to get his 25 or whatever points along with 7 asts. If it weren't for Thibideau making them commit to team defense, they wouldn't be here right now because they are the 20th ranked offense which is in the bottom half of the league. Rose has been the consisent on this team and he's having a breakout season, but Thibideau has done wonders with this team even though they're offensively limited.
Stats, stats, stats. Everyone always looks at stats. Is it a coincidence that Rose won back to back titles at Simeon, becoming the only player in city history to do so? Then took his Memphis team to the title game as a freshman. And now, at 22, is leading the Bulls to the #1 seed in the east and has been to the playoffs twice already?
The kid is a leader and obviously makes his teammates better around him. He hasn't even had a fully healthy team around him at any point this season.
Rose is good and probably the MVP of the NBA this year but he's not comparable or even in Magic class yet. And i dont expect him to be right now since he hasn't been in the leauge long and they are just two different type of players. It doesnt take away from how good he is though
I can't stand it when people say Rose isn't a point guard and that he's an undersized shooting guard who just handles the ball.
He doesn't have superstar court vision or passing ability, but he's very good in those areas. The last time I checked he was top ten in assists. He's a shoot first point guard, who's also unselfish. It's not like he's an Allen Iverson type who used to be a gun, rarely moved the ball and had horrid shot selection. Rose attempts 20 shots per game, but they're all within the flow of the offense. It's about winning with Rose, not statistics.
It's just not hard to see he makes his teammates better. Yea, the Bulls defend and rebound the ball, but Rose's impact on the team can't be denied. He IS the MVP, not probably.
My MVP is still Dwight because of the fact he Dominates both side of the ball not just one. But in order to be the MVP in the leauge you don't have to be a two way player ( Nash). Pretty much every disscussion about how good a player is begins and ends with how good they are on offense
Boozer is not a very good defender, people on here say Noah isn't a very good defender, and everyone says Rose isn't a good defender.
Then how the hell are they the best defensive team in the league? Rose shut down D-Will in their last 2 match ups....shut him down. The first meeting, D-Will was a little gimpy, but not the second time.
Who said Noah isnt a good defender?...The Bulls have very good TEAM defense, there's a difference between that and individual defense. I would liek to know who said Noah isnt a good defender though???
"that rose has been overhyped. i'm even more annoyed that tom thibideau is going to get looked over for coach of the year because everyone has put the bulls success down to their point guard."
And Mike Brown was the integral piece to the Cavs rise, not LeBron.
Rose is going to end up as one of the best players the game ever saw. He really is that good, same with Westrbook. These are two of the best PG`s the league ever saw and they arent overrated at all. They are 22 year olds completly dominating their position every night with outstanding athletisism and increasing IQ and skill. No need for hate.
I believe both have the Potantial to be that. To be in the catagory of Zeke, Gary Payton. All Guys who have gone far in the playoffs and in Zeke's case won it all. They could also possibly end up being K.J 20plus scorers, 10plus assists and going far int he play offs but never winning ( thats the worst possible senario)
At the end of the day, it's up to the players whether or not they want to buy into a coach's system/philosophy, but let's give Thibs some credit. He's done a great job. He's gained the respect of the players. He's holding everyone accountable. He's a great defensive coach.
And I know Deng finally being healthy has a lot to do with his play, but I like the way Thibs is using him this season.
I think he is more deserving than Rose. Rose is phenomenal, but the Bulls are a slightly above average offensive team (due to Rose) which is winning because of their league best defense, which is not because of Rose. The Magic are the 3rd best defensive team in the league with no above average defender except Howard, and Howard is also critical for their offense.
rose is the mvp... its not even close
Rose is my clear choice to be MVP but please don't compare him to Magic yet, lets see him lead a team to a title something top Pg's like Kidd, Nash and Stockton have not done or never did.
I would not say it's a lovefest saying D-Rose should be MVP but going beyond that might be.
Dwights team is hardly a contender....Rose's team has alone won the MVP over the Dwight, because Rose's team is so much better than Dwight's. You dont see 4 seeds winning MVPs very often.
If that was the Case someone from the Spurs,Lakers,Celtics, Heat should be in contention because they all are either number 1, battling for Number 1 or 2 and each has someone putting up similar stats
If Rose got hurt, and missed this season, the Bulls still could compete for the eighth seed due to their league best defense. If the same thing happened to Howard, the Magic would be in contention for the second worst record in the east.
Those are all if's. I will stick to what is reality, like Rose scoring his team's final 6 points including a crazy lay up and 1 with 8 seconds to go. He had a bad shooting night but closed it out when it mattered.
2 games up on Boston.
I am using the hypotheticals to show that, in reality, Dwight Howard is more valuable for the Magic than Rose is for the Bulls.
I do believe he is the most dominant player since Magic johnson, from the pg position. But thats not to say he is comparable to magic johnson, NO ONE is comparable to magic, not even Lebron. Once Derrick rose gets 2 strides He is literally unstoppable. When teams try to double him from every angle, he splits it and scores on another double team or he dishes perfectly to the corner. He can finish over 7 footers with both hands and Will hit any 3pter that isnt highly contested. Best of all, He is a Winner, unlike many of the stars in the game today. He does Anything to win.
So, is he the next magic? NO, good luck trying to find one
Is he the most unstoppable PG (with winning) since Magic? absolutely
chris paul might be the perfect pass-first PG, but when it comes to putting your money down on a PG to Win against Anyone at any level, Rose is your dude
How is Rose the most dominant pg since Magic Rose and Westbroook are good, but when healthy Chris Paul is good too. Chris Pau averaged 21 pts and 11.6 assists in 2008 at 49% from the field plus he won 56 games with players like David West and Peja Stojakovic being the 2nd and 3rd leading scorers. I like how most ppl realize how great D. Rose is but can we please stop crowning him the most dominant since someone like Magic when Chris Paul was just as good arguably better 4 years ago.
Steve Francis anyone? That's all Westbrook is. and Derrick Rose is nothing more than D-Wade playing PG. Let's not get ahead of ourselves now. Let's see if these cats can sustain these numbers/impact for entire careers. Don't ever think Rose is anywhere in Magic's league. A.I. was more dominant than Rose and about 3-4 inches shorter.
Oh yeah and calling D-Rose a winner can we wait till he actually wins a playoff series
10 points and 3 assists....in the final 3 minutes of tonight's game against the Bucks.
2.5 games up on Boston.