[MrManalo43Participant]

I’m convinced Presti made the right move in essentially choosing Ibaka over Harden.

Elite shot-blocking/shot-altering with a solid jumper is definitely a better fit than another scorer (with attrocious defense at that)

scoring is easily replacable with the right pieces, which Presti has done, but as we can see from this game one against the Spurs, rim protection is not easy to come by.

This is the same team without Harden: second unit scores just fine without him (so mad Lamb’s development/playing time was cut short due to Butler)

Debatably better without Westbrook: Durant went MVP without Westbrook, and the offense flowed more, but Westbrook is still top (therefore debatable)

Completely different without Ibaka: can’t stop anything in the paint, and they HAVE to go small ball.

Thought?

 

 

 

[SmooveKRYPTParticipant]

 Let’s be real, they got killed in the trade. Basically Jeremy Lamb and Steven Adams (plus whatever they get with the Dallas pick this year) for James Harden. They banked on that Toronto pick being top 5 last year but when the Rudy Gay trade happened and Toronto became somewhat competitive, it fell out of the top 10 and they had to get the best defensive big left which was Adams.

But yes they were absolutely right in choosing Ibaka over him, players like Serge are so rare in today’s league and his impact is clearly missed when he’s not there. But to say the team and bench is as good without James is completely false.

[SmooveKRYPTParticipant]

 Let’s be real, they got killed in the trade. Basically Jeremy Lamb and Steven Adams (plus whatever they get with the Dallas pick this year) for James Harden. They banked on that Toronto pick being top 5 last year but when the Rudy Gay trade happened and Toronto became somewhat competitive, it fell out of the top 10 and they had to get the best defensive big left which was Adams.

But yes they were absolutely right in choosing Ibaka over him, players like Serge are so rare in today’s league and his impact is clearly missed when he’s not there. But to say the team and bench is as good without James is completely false.

[BennyWestsideParticipant]

 We cannot grade the trade yet. It is simply too early to determine whether or not Adams, Lamb and whoever the Thunder draft this year are of similar value to Harden. However I will say that not going into the Luxury for Harden was the right move. Every team in the league is finding that it is unsustainable to sit in the luxury for multiple consecutive seasons because of the limits in places on trades and additions to the team, and the Thunder would have been by now if they resigned him. Given that injuries have meant that the Thunder are massive underdogs the past two playoffs, I dont think adding Harden would have made the Thunder champions last year, and the same applies to this season. Therefore, the Thunder would have paid a lot of money and used one of their "luxury years" in vain. 

Also, while Harden may be more valuable than the draft bounty the Thunder got from the trade, everyone makes the mistake of transposing Harden as he is playing for the Rockets onto the Thunder’s current roster. If he was on the Thunder he would be a third banana, therefore would be getting much fewer offensive touches. Therefore, his impact on the game would be less than it is now, and his offensive talent would not be able to outweigh his defensive incompetency to the degree it does now. The players the Thunder got from the trade are more capable of contributing to team success without the ball in their hands.

[BennyWestsideParticipant]

 We cannot grade the trade yet. It is simply too early to determine whether or not Adams, Lamb and whoever the Thunder draft this year are of similar value to Harden. However I will say that not going into the Luxury for Harden was the right move. Every team in the league is finding that it is unsustainable to sit in the luxury for multiple consecutive seasons because of the limits in places on trades and additions to the team, and the Thunder would have been by now if they resigned him. Given that injuries have meant that the Thunder are massive underdogs the past two playoffs, I dont think adding Harden would have made the Thunder champions last year, and the same applies to this season. Therefore, the Thunder would have paid a lot of money and used one of their "luxury years" in vain. 

Also, while Harden may be more valuable than the draft bounty the Thunder got from the trade, everyone makes the mistake of transposing Harden as he is playing for the Rockets onto the Thunder’s current roster. If he was on the Thunder he would be a third banana, therefore would be getting much fewer offensive touches. Therefore, his impact on the game would be less than it is now, and his offensive talent would not be able to outweigh his defensive incompetency to the degree it does now. The players the Thunder got from the trade are more capable of contributing to team success without the ball in their hands.

[eyefortalentParticipant]

 would have just paid Harden and taken the luxury tax hit.

[eyefortalentParticipant]

 would have just paid Harden and taken the luxury tax hit.

[OhCanada-Participant]

 The trade was about money and Harden not taking a paycut and establishing himself ae an elite player.

They recieve Adams who looks like he will have as long an NBA career as anyone in his draft class. May not be the most talented in his draft class but will likely go down as one of the best in it and is exactly what OKC was looking for when considering selecting Adams, Olynyk, Nogueira or Plumlee.

Jeremy Lamb is such a smooth player and he took alot of large steps forward this year. His situation reminds me alot of Terrence Ross and oddly enough they have similar stats. Both players have shown uncanny scoring abillity yet have not been given the green light to create or shoot at will. With Lambs length athletisism and abillity I could see him developing into a 18ppg scorer one day just not in OKC.

[OhCanada-Participant]

 The trade was about money and Harden not taking a paycut and establishing himself ae an elite player.

They recieve Adams who looks like he will have as long an NBA career as anyone in his draft class. May not be the most talented in his draft class but will likely go down as one of the best in it and is exactly what OKC was looking for when considering selecting Adams, Olynyk, Nogueira or Plumlee.

Jeremy Lamb is such a smooth player and he took alot of large steps forward this year. His situation reminds me alot of Terrence Ross and oddly enough they have similar stats. Both players have shown uncanny scoring abillity yet have not been given the green light to create or shoot at will. With Lambs length athletisism and abillity I could see him developing into a 18ppg scorer one day just not in OKC.

[tuck243Participant]

 The issue with Ibaka is that he doesn’t protect the basket all game…  He doesn’t change shots…  It’s cool to have him but he hasn’t progressed that much as a player…  There were games this playoffs he didn’t even score 10 points and no one noticed…  I always felt a 6-10 player with a 18 foot shot isn’t that hard to find…  His shot blocking along with that is though…  Ibaka would’ve help them some, yes…  But Ibaka wouldn’t helped that much…  They gave up 122 points…

Also, Sam Presti isn’t that great of a GM…  I say that because outside of the draft he hasn’t made any big trades for players since Perkins…  That’s what 5 years ago??

[tuck243Participant]

 The issue with Ibaka is that he doesn’t protect the basket all game…  He doesn’t change shots…  It’s cool to have him but he hasn’t progressed that much as a player…  There were games this playoffs he didn’t even score 10 points and no one noticed…  I always felt a 6-10 player with a 18 foot shot isn’t that hard to find…  His shot blocking along with that is though…  Ibaka would’ve help them some, yes…  But Ibaka wouldn’t helped that much…  They gave up 122 points…

Also, Sam Presti isn’t that great of a GM…  I say that because outside of the draft he hasn’t made any big trades for players since Perkins…  That’s what 5 years ago??

[omphalosParticipant]

 I think OKC still won the trade. They set the tone for the franchise that they weren’t going to be bullied in contract disputes, and both Adams and Lamb have the potential to be excellent players at their positions.

Once we get a better look at Lamb (read: Derek Fisher retires) we’ll be able to say for sure, but Jones III, Lamb and Adams all have a lot of upside that will reassure Durant that this team is well set-up for the future, it’s not like Orlando and Cleveland where they had no young talent.

I think Lamb is more than capable of doing what Harden did for this team, and Adams could develop into the low-post player they’ve been searching for, and also complements Ibaka perfectly.

Yes, Harden has produced on his own, but he wasn’t as valuable to this team and was still a minus defensively.

It’s too soon to tell for sure, but I think Presti made the right move.

If Adams and Lamb make a big jump next season (which they should), then I think OKC could win a string of championships if they can just stay healthy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[omphalosParticipant]

 I think OKC still won the trade. They set the tone for the franchise that they weren’t going to be bullied in contract disputes, and both Adams and Lamb have the potential to be excellent players at their positions.

Once we get a better look at Lamb (read: Derek Fisher retires) we’ll be able to say for sure, but Jones III, Lamb and Adams all have a lot of upside that will reassure Durant that this team is well set-up for the future, it’s not like Orlando and Cleveland where they had no young talent.

I think Lamb is more than capable of doing what Harden did for this team, and Adams could develop into the low-post player they’ve been searching for, and also complements Ibaka perfectly.

Yes, Harden has produced on his own, but he wasn’t as valuable to this team and was still a minus defensively.

It’s too soon to tell for sure, but I think Presti made the right move.

If Adams and Lamb make a big jump next season (which they should), then I think OKC could win a string of championships if they can just stay healthy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Neggedpastor]

harden is a great player Houston because they had nothing before him lol.  he helped them reel in howard

Okc didn’t do terrible because  harden wouldn’t have the offensive freedom in okc he has on Houston and harden is a liability on defense.

I feel as tho they could have traded harden some where else and got a better deal

they where banking on kevin martin to pan out but he didn’t , lamb to bust out but he didn’t …yet and now adams is doing good. I will say this they should have also moved perkins in the deal for omer asik I don’t know how that wasn’t included  To have asik starting and adams or another prospect  off the bench  is better then having perkins and adams.

 

I feel as tho they should have slowed things down and do what any other team would do after losing a championship cut the weak links  harden made has disappeared but he still was young  they should have either amnestied perkins or rocked out

 

 

ONE MORE THING OKC SHOULD HAVE NEVER TRADED ERIC  BLEDSOE  just to take a reggie next season

if that necer  happen the next draft instead of taking reggie Jackson they probally would have took a wing(jimmy butler or a big  or a trade the next draft

I feel as tho okc rushed a little like many ppl and  neglected all assets outside kd,and russell they wont ever again for sure.

[Neggedpastor]

harden is a great player Houston because they had nothing before him lol.  he helped them reel in howard

Okc didn’t do terrible because  harden wouldn’t have the offensive freedom in okc he has on Houston and harden is a liability on defense.

I feel as tho they could have traded harden some where else and got a better deal

they where banking on kevin martin to pan out but he didn’t , lamb to bust out but he didn’t …yet and now adams is doing good. I will say this they should have also moved perkins in the deal for omer asik I don’t know how that wasn’t included  To have asik starting and adams or another prospect  off the bench  is better then having perkins and adams.

 

I feel as tho they should have slowed things down and do what any other team would do after losing a championship cut the weak links  harden made has disappeared but he still was young  they should have either amnestied perkins or rocked out

 

 

ONE MORE THING OKC SHOULD HAVE NEVER TRADED ERIC  BLEDSOE  just to take a reggie next season

if that necer  happen the next draft instead of taking reggie Jackson they probally would have took a wing(jimmy butler or a big  or a trade the next draft

I feel as tho okc rushed a little like many ppl and  neglected all assets outside kd,and russell they wont ever again for sure.

[machu46Participant]

In my opinion, they made the right decision, but didn’t "win" the trade.  Choosing Ibaka over Harden has turned out to be a decent decision for them.  Up until this year, Ibaka was really just a shot blocker without being a great defender, but he’s taken some big steps forwards in that regard this year.  On top of that, he’s become a very good shooter for his position, so he’s essentially a stretch forward that is also an elite shot blocker and an above average defender.  That’s a really rare asset to have.

Having said that, as others have pointed out, getting Adams, Lamb, and a guy like KJ McDaniels (just an example of the type of player they can get at 21) isn’t really that great of a haul for James Harden.  At the time, I thought it was a pretty good trade for them, but things haven’t worked out quite as expected.

There’s still plenty of time for those three guys to develop though.

 

 

[machu46Participant]

In my opinion, they made the right decision, but didn’t "win" the trade.  Choosing Ibaka over Harden has turned out to be a decent decision for them.  Up until this year, Ibaka was really just a shot blocker without being a great defender, but he’s taken some big steps forwards in that regard this year.  On top of that, he’s become a very good shooter for his position, so he’s essentially a stretch forward that is also an elite shot blocker and an above average defender.  That’s a really rare asset to have.

Having said that, as others have pointed out, getting Adams, Lamb, and a guy like KJ McDaniels (just an example of the type of player they can get at 21) isn’t really that great of a haul for James Harden.  At the time, I thought it was a pretty good trade for them, but things haven’t worked out quite as expected.

There’s still plenty of time for those three guys to develop though.

 

 

[FourParticipant]

I suppose that I fall into the "wait and see" camp as well because Lamb and Adams could blossom.  Of course by the time they do OKC may have squandered a few of the best years KD and Russ could give them.

But in the short term I don’t fault the decision that much.  Ibaka means more to this team than Harden would simply because of the duplication of skills that Harden brings – he’s too similar to KD and Russ.  Plus I am a bit tainted because I’m not a "Harden guy."  In the two years where he has been "the man" in Houston he has shot 44.6% from the field, been at best a lackadsical defender, shot well under 40% in the playoffs and has not been out of the first round, even with home court advantage this year.

I think OKC "lost" the trade but I’m not of the opinion that they got killed…at least not yet.

[FourParticipant]

I suppose that I fall into the "wait and see" camp as well because Lamb and Adams could blossom.  Of course by the time they do OKC may have squandered a few of the best years KD and Russ could give them.

But in the short term I don’t fault the decision that much.  Ibaka means more to this team than Harden would simply because of the duplication of skills that Harden brings – he’s too similar to KD and Russ.  Plus I am a bit tainted because I’m not a "Harden guy."  In the two years where he has been "the man" in Houston he has shot 44.6% from the field, been at best a lackadsical defender, shot well under 40% in the playoffs and has not been out of the first round, even with home court advantage this year.

I think OKC "lost" the trade but I’m not of the opinion that they got killed…at least not yet.

[mixtape2003Participant]

They would rather revist the Jeff Green for Perkins trade, even though Green missed the next year with his heart condition, they matched up better with the Mavs the year they made the trade and he would of been huge for them the past 2 years.

[ThunderHog35Participant]

Things have changed.  That Perkins deal was huge because up until that time there so no defensive fire anywhere on the team.   Nenad Krstic was the starting center and Ibaka was stuck behind Green.  They needed a way to get Serge minutes so he could develop.

The other big thing here was the way the league looked when the trade happened.  The Lakers were starting Bynum and Gasol, who had knocked the thunder out of the playoffs the previous year on an off rebound.  Denver had Nene, Dallas had Dirk and Chandler, and the Grizzlies were rapidly improving while sporting a front line of Gasol and Randolph.  The Thunder looked around and knew they needed a big post defender that could instill some of the defensive intensity that Presti had been preaching since he took over in Seattle.  What athletic ability he had may have disappeared quickly but he was still a necessary part to the growth of the team.

 

 

[ThunderHog35Participant]

Things have changed.  That Perkins deal was huge because up until that time there so no defensive fire anywhere on the team.   Nenad Krstic was the starting center and Ibaka was stuck behind Green.  They needed a way to get Serge minutes so he could develop.

The other big thing here was the way the league looked when the trade happened.  The Lakers were starting Bynum and Gasol, who had knocked the thunder out of the playoffs the previous year on an off rebound.  Denver had Nene, Dallas had Dirk and Chandler, and the Grizzlies were rapidly improving while sporting a front line of Gasol and Randolph.  The Thunder looked around and knew they needed a big post defender that could instill some of the defensive intensity that Presti had been preaching since he took over in Seattle.  What athletic ability he had may have disappeared quickly but he was still a necessary part to the growth of the team.

 

 

[mixtape2003Participant]

They would rather revist the Jeff Green for Perkins trade, even though Green missed the next year with his heart condition, they matched up better with the Mavs the year they made the trade and he would of been huge for them the past 2 years.

[hbomb3300Participant]

I think too many people look at this trade with 20/20 hindsight…  Presti made the best trade that was available to him.  People forget that the league didn’t look at Harden as a can’t miss superstar while he was trying to trade him.  Presti tried to do better trades like Harden for Bradley Beal, Harden for Klay Thompson,  or Harden to the Cavs, and none of the teams would bite.  He made the best trade available  at the deadline that was set for him. 

[hbomb3300Participant]

I think too many people look at this trade with 20/20 hindsight…  Presti made the best trade that was available to him.  People forget that the league didn’t look at Harden as a can’t miss superstar while he was trying to trade him.  Presti tried to do better trades like Harden for Bradley Beal, Harden for Klay Thompson,  or Harden to the Cavs, and none of the teams would bite.  He made the best trade available  at the deadline that was set for him. 

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