I just don't see him to be good in the next level.
He has good athleticism, I'll give him that.
Bust besides that, he's got nothing.
The guy is a medicore shooter, he lacks size 6'4 as a G/F, he is not a defensive specialist, he hits 33% of 3's in college level, he gets little rebs (4.9), not a good passer, and no wonder ppl compare him with Danhty Jones, who was the other duke bust.
Firs thing we agree on. I don't even know if I'd personally consider him a bust cause I have absolutely no expectations for the guy. But technically speaking yes, he will be drafted high and do nothing making him a bust.
I'm a Duke fan and I'll agree that Henderson could be a possible bust in the league especially if he is drafted in the top 10. I think being a bust is usually dependent upon where you were drafted or expected to be drafted.
To me, Dahntay Jones isn't a bust. Most people with half a brain knew he was a 2nd-round pick. I have no clue why Memphis took him in the first. That was stupid. To Memphis fans he should be a bust, but for anybody that knows about bball he isn't a bust but just a bad pick by Memphis. I mean if he had been picked in the 2nd-round, which is where he should have been picked, he would be considered a halfway-decent pickup considering he starts for Denver now.
Anyway, back to Henderson. I think he's starting to put it together, but he's not to the point yet where he can be a two 2 or 3 player on a NBA team. He still has no left hand and is a streaky shooter. I really don't think he's worth a top 10 at this point. He could be a great defensive player in the NBA, but that isn't usually worth a top 10 unless you are Thabeet. Henderson should come back to Duke for one more year and work on using his left hand. If he can produce for an entire year the way he did the 2nd half of this year then I think he would deservedly be a top 10 pick next year. As it stands I say he will probably slide out of the top 10 and probably land between 11 and 16.
How can starting (Dahntay Jones) on an NBA playoff team be classifed as a bust? Explain, genius.
...that he may (MAY) become underrated by the draft.
Although, watching him play this year, I think you certainly have to hope that his style of play just fits the NBA game better than the NCAA if you are taking him with a lottery pick. Beyond his athleticism, he doesn't blow you away with his scoring ability, his shooting, his defense or his basketball IQ. All fine, but none great.
With that being said, drafting Dahntay Jones in the top 10 would certainly be considered a bust, since he is a relatively easy player to replace in the NBA.
ch15436...again I disagree. Dahntay Jones was drafted 20th in 2003 which turned out to be one of the strongest drafts ever. Guys drafted ahead of him included Troy Bell, Reece Gaines, and Marcus Banks. Michael Sweetney was also drafted in the top 10. I would consider him a bust. In 2004, Rafael Araujo and Luke Jackson were in the top 10. They're both busts. In 2005, Ike Diogu and Martell Webster were both drafted in the top 10...so far they're both busts. The 2006 draft are full of busts. Dahntay Jones, starting on a playoff team and being one of their best defensive players, is far from a bust.
Disagree all you like. Dahntay Jones was drafted ahead of Boris Diaw, Josh Howard and Mo Williams to name just three far superior players, if that is the type of argument that you would like to make. He played out his rookie contract with minimal contribution and/or success, and was let go.
Now, if I am the Memphis Grizzlies, I look back at the 20th pick in the 2003 draft, and consider that choice of Dahntay Jones a bust.
People knew what to expect out of Dahntay Jones when he was drafted, and this is about the career path you could have reasonably expected out of him. Now, if that is what you are looking for out of Gerald Henderson, then that is fine, but that means that drafting him anywhere in the top 20 is a waste of a pick. A Dahntay Jones-type career arc is fine, but it is not what you hope for out of a top 20 pick.
Well actually to again correct you, ch15r36, Diaw, Howard and Williams were all considered pleasant surprises by the teams that drafted them. Again, Sweetney is considered a bust so if you're equating Dahntay Jones to Sweetney then clearly you know very little about basketball. Jones was drafted by Boston who traded his rights to Memphis for a group of players that included Kendrick Perkins. So blame Memphis and their ineptitude for first trading away Perkins and second not utilizing Jones effectively. Last what do you expect out of a top 20 pick? I can list players in the 10-20 and I'll bet you over half of them aren't even starting in the NBA right now. No one from the 2006 draft is starting. Juluius Hodge was drafted 20th in 2005 and he's been out of the NBA for 2 years! So Julius Hodge = Dahntay Jones?
I couldnt agree more I would be shocked if he was a top 10 pick. I just dont see him succeeding at the next level. He has bust written all over him
Michael Jordan wasn't a bust, so if you are equating Dahntay Jones to Michael Jordan, then clearly you know very little about basketball.
Good stuff, man.
If Dahntay Jones is what I am getting out of my 20th pick in the 2003 draft, I'd rather save the time, money and effort. His 5 pts, 9.0 PER and 18 min per game don't prove anything. Neither does Julius Hodge's draft position.
Get off my mans back, he will be good. And like I said before I can easily see him doing just as much as Richard Jefferson does. And since when cant he play D? And since when is 5 rebounds for a guard in the college game not a lot , there isn't that many SG in the NBA that average 5 boards a game.
A player not being talented as guys who were drafted ahead of him does not make him a bust. Henderson is not hyped so he can't be a bust unless he does absolutely nothing. If he is decent which I feel he will be, he should not be considered a bust. My thing is I believe that this argument is about the definition of what you call a bust. I ask you to both define what you call a bust that would help you converse with each other better. I actually believe that Henderson can be a poor man's Jason Richardson which would make him a decent athletic player but I also do not see him as top 10 and if he goes that early against players that have been talked about more and fall short than maybe he could fall in the bust mode or else you could say that the GM on that team was stupid.
Also for your argument on Mo Williams and Diaw. Neither one was that great in the first 2 or 3 years they were in the league. Diaw name blew up in Phoenix. While Williams showed promise in Utah, they let him go and he played well in Milwaukee and now Cleveland. Jones to me is a solid pick. He is a dirty worker that does the little things and plays D. He isnt spectacular but he is solid. Some teams need that. Bruce Bowen is that kind of player and people were hyping him when the Spurs were winning. Everybody on a team can't be a Jordan. A team needs to have players that know the game and can fit their role. Jones does that. Also for a 20 pick to be starting in the league for the best record wise team in the West says a lot. I will ask you this based on what information, are you saying this guy is going to be a bust. Are you someone who looks at a player and say hey he doesn't look like an NBA player so he will be a bust. This guy is not even that Hyped and he may have had a higher position earlier because this was looking like a weak draft but now it isn't. There are more 2 guards to look but I will say Henderson is a solid pick, most Duke guys tend to be solid players. Coach K teaches his players well and the ones that did now do well did not have the athletecism that Henderson has. He will be a solid player who could turn himself into a Raja Bell type player if he works on his 3 pt shooting.
then he certainly wouldnt be a bust in this weak draft..
but he would be a reach in top 10... definitely.
I will admit, I'm a Duke fan but how is Dahntay Jones a bust? He was NOT a star at Duke, and wasn't a lottery pick this is just more of the same Duke hatred that makes the world go round. To be honest, the Duke Bust thing is somewhat of a myth. Duke is a college basketball program first, not an NBA factory. Corey Magette is a decent player, Elton Brand (when healthy) is among the games best at his position, Boozer is an elite level player, Grant Hill is a decent player, and before injury was a certain hall of famer, Christian Laettner was never among the games best but for the first 8 years of his career he averaged double figures. Dunleavy isn't a superstar but averages 15 a game. Duke players are consistent not superstars but how many colleges routinely produce superstars? NOT EVEN CAROLINA FOLKS. As for Henderson, he won't be a bust he'll be a decent NBA player in my opinion. He'll probably average around 14 a game, but the draft is terrible this year so he'll get drafted higher than he should be and people will be ready to call him a bust. That's unfair!
I love the more detail you brought to this, I know Duke players but I don't know everything about them but Duke does continue to put up decent players in the league. The ones that did not make it were not athletic enough and that is not a problem Henderson has.
Let's break this down.
Dahntay Jones is indeed starting for the Denver Nuggets, where he plays 18 minutes a game. That is 10th most on the team. So, in his 5th year in the league, he is essentially the 10th most important player on a pretty good team. He fills a role for that team, but he is certainly replaceable, and I doubt the Nuggets would have fared much worse this season if they were unable to sign Dahntay Jones.
Now, given that he was the 20th player chosen in a very good draft, significantly better options were available behind him, he was given ample opportunity to prove himself on a bad team, and he was not signed beyond his rookie contract, I would consider that draft pick a bust. The Grizzlies spent 4 years trying to develop a player they were paying $5-$6 million for, and he never contributed to their team in any significant way.
I would consider that a bust.
I hope you expect more out of a player you acquire with the 20th pick in any draft, and certainly as deep a draft as 2003.
Ch15r, you're right
The man has a point. Every draft is different it is not as black and white as saying; "At the 20th pick you can't be a real bust anymore as long as you contribute"
If Dahntay Jones was in another draft class where it wasn't so deep. It would be a different story.It must be put in context. He looks much more like a bust because this draft class was so deep. If he was drafted in different, weaker class he won't be labeled as big a bust. Either way, Dahntay Jones is like 90% of other #20 overall draft picks,a bust. If there is more talent behind the person and they completely underachieve, it's a bust. There are 2 all-stars behind Dahntay Jones in that draft and at least 7 players just plain better.
A line of disppointments:
Christian Laettner (3)
Mike Dunleavy Jr. (2)
JJ Reddick (11)
Shelden Williams (5)
Other Duke players such as Brand, Deng, Maggette, Hill, Battier, etc were drafted in their level of skill, so they are labeled as neither disppointments nor suprises.
But this shows a 5:1 ratio of duke bust history
One thing to remember when you say "Duke bust" is that there are general managers making these picks. Laettner was an NBA All-star at one point, while Dunleavy has averaged 19 ppg in a season. These are good players, but we must remember with many of these supposed busts that there are stupid general managers who merely overrated the players. These players have no say where they are drafted and draft position relative to performance is what indicates a bust.
Redick was the 14th pick overall, while McRoberts was a 2nd round pick. I wouldn't say McRoberts is a bust at all. What do you expect from a 2nd rounder? Redick probably should have went lower, but he's showed some good stuff this season and is starting to come along. Williams, we all know that Billy King is a moron and everybody knew Williams should not have been drafted 5th. That is not his fault that some general manager overrated him.
Anyway, I wouldn't say Dunleavy and Laettner are busts. Laettner's college hype was just so much that he would have had to have been Jordan to not be considered a bust by many people. Dunleavy was overrated by Golden State. Now Williams is certainly a bust so far, but Redick still has time to turn things around. He was only drafted 14th.
Please go back to practice, and focus on next year's draft, because the logic behind your post makes no sense.
You can't mereley mention 5 highly successful NBA players and then completely discount them in your "analysis."
I think he could be a reach in the top 10. I think he will be a solid player but a reach in the top 10.
Who watches the All Star game and the Olympics games. Some players has roles. If you are not the first option you will not put up a lot of numbers. Jones plays little minutes because JR Smith is behind him and should be starting except the coach likes to bring him off the bench. Jones plays his role well and does not complain. there may have been some Star players behind him but that is GM fault for letting people slip. Jones was not hyped. He was picked to fill a need and when the team change direction, he did not get resigned. Noone expected anything from him that he did not show. You can't be a bust because someone picked you earlier to more talented players that did not receive any hype. In the end of the first round there does not tend to be talented players but solid players that you can add to successful teams. Also Jones was picked higher because of a draft day deal. Morrison can be described as bust because he was drafted high and came with much hype. A lot of people wanted him because they thought he was the next Larry Bird lol. Sheldon Williams is a bust because some stupid GM picked him earlier than he should. He is still a solid forward just not lottery worthy. On every team that Dahtay Jones has been on, he played his role well. I look at him as Raja Bell before he got some range on his J. Noone really knew too much about Bell until he started shooting 3's. Noone knew about Doug Christie until he went to the Kings after showing promise in Toronto. It took 5 years for Jermaine O'neal to become an All Star but he is not considered a bust well right now he is looking bad with those injuries but anyway the point is unless you are a star at the shooting guard and small forward position, you can be replace because more people fit into those positions but most team do not expect to find talent that late in most first rounds, Josh Howard was a Steal. Noone understand how he sink that low well now they may do but skill wise he should have been lottery)
plain and simple, youcan't call Dahntay Jones a bust if no one EVER expected him to be more than he is. Even at duke he was a athletic blue collar defensive role player like green from UNC. No one drafting him expected him to be a superstar at the next level. And what is he on the uggets? a blue collar defensive role player. So he translated well. Hes in the playoffs guarding chris paul. Shelden Williams is a huge bust and far from solid. His current claim to fame is getting candace pregnant. Boozer was a surprise which is why he went in the second round and was just considered a hard working forward up until he got to utah and has been injured the majority of his career there. Magette is a diva scorer who hasn't done anything on a good team. Deng had 1 solid season. JJ reddick will never amount to his hype since he can't defend, can't create his own shot and has no personality that earns him camera time.
Boris diaw SUCKED until he got to the suns and was allowed to gun (kinda like nash was average on the mavs and then turned supersar when he got to the suns) And diaw was only good for 1-2 seasons there and then got fat. Mo williams has beenn nothing more than a gunner his whole career and is just now getting hype because hes gunning beside lebron. Josh howard being picked so low is more to blame bout people think college seniors are maxed out of their potential and completely ignoring that he was acc player of the year. Your theory is kinda slow if ur sayin someone is instantly a bust if someone drafted behind them is better. 90% of the draft is situation. Look at tony parker or Agent Z...are they steals or is anyone drafted ahead of them suddenly busts if they didn't meet the same levels of success that these 2 did?
He wasn't even as good as Green.
He's only a bust because he was drafted in the first round and washed out from his first team. I mean have you guys seen him play? I try to follow ACC players but oh my god he has been worse than Fred Jones for the majority of his career. Unless someone is throwing him an alley on a wide open break he absolutely cannot score. I think the only reason that he even gets playing time (let alone a starting job) at Denver is because the coach and JR Smith absolutely cannot stand each other. Also, he's one of the few people on that team (other than Chauncey, the new guy) to play ANY kind of perimeter defense.
Look at his career stats. I mean geez, if you can't shine at Memphis then you just won't be able to do it anywhere. Especially back in those days.
Look at Dahntay now. He STILL can't shoot. He's a role player on a team where no one else wants to play that role. Its okay, he's a bust. Memphis drafted him based on potential and he just didn't live up to it. Thats what a bust is.
...and I think Gerald Henderson will be just a little bit better by the way.
I think all guys got some good points. I think the term BUST can be about perspective..... Personally I want a solid starter for the 20th pick in a draft, but you never know how a player is gonna turn out. So players get better with age or situation.
Face it, you can't call Christian Laettner a bust when he was the 3rd or 4th most productive player that came out in '92. Look it up, who else produced more than him? Jimmy Jackson? LaPhonso Ellis? Todd Day? Tom Gugliatta? Adam Keefe? As someone already mentioned Laettner performed at an All-Star level for a while and was certainly a solid starter for at least half is career and a solid bench player for the other half.
Dunleavy is no bust either he was drafted 3rd and he is probably in the top 5 o 6 realm of the 2002 draft. A lot of this is Duke hate! To consider McRoberts a bust is absurd he was drafted in the second round and no self respecting basketball fan expected anything but warming the bench and handing out towels to the guys who actually are getting time from him.
J.J. Reddick, sure I guess you can call him a bust if you want to but not many people expected THAT much out of him and it was a terrible draft. EVERY SINGLE PLAYER drafted after Reddick, with the exception of Rondo has comparable numbers to Reddick they all are in the 5-6 ppg average. So you can't really call him a 'bust' relative to his draft. It was a weak draft.
Shelden Williams, sure you can say he's a bust if you want but look at the draft. The Hawks wanted to take a player with size, no other player with size has put up better numbers than Sheldon, and if they are better they still aren't any good. It's all about the quality of what's out there. There have been a lot of weak drafts which just goes to underscore the Laettner and Dunleavy point, if you can get a guy who will be productive and can stay in the league for at least 10 years you can't consider the pick a bust.
You cannot say just because a guy is contributing and improving, he is not a bust.
NBA players are suppose to contribute to a team, more or less, but if he does not live up to his high expectations,
and if fans talk about how disappointing they are, then it is resonable to label him as a bust.
Even in a weak draft, if there are tons of players better than him who are taken later, than he is disappointing.
Big men who put up better numbers than shelden who were chosen later:
I am guessing ptguard1 does not know about basketball
Sheldon Williams is a bust but my thing that I wrote was the fact that only Atlanta was going to pick that guy at 5. Noone else was going to do that and I have seen a few games he has gotten minutes. He is a solid bench forward. If he was drafted later in the draft, people would not be thinking so much that he is a bust. He did get a lot of college hype but noone thought he would be good NBA player but Atlanta somehow. Also about Redick, he is not getting the same opportunities and he is not the only guy in the NBA who does not play D.
Who is Leon Pown? lol. And there has been just as many North Carolina bust as there have been Duke bust. Whats May and McCants been doing lately? And Marvin is a bust in my eyes, because he is #2 pick and is not producing like it. And that was from one draft class. So you guys should give Duke a break for producing so many "bust". And if Grant Hill would have stayed healthy, he would have been supremely better than anybody other than Jordan from Carolina
Williams is not a Bust but he is not the Superstar many envision yet but then again it was the Hawks that made the call and on the average they suck at drafting in the lottery. Look at the history on Hawks in the lottery and you will see they GM's need to be shot. McCants is a quality player but he has not gotten the opportunity. May have been hurt and out of shape but the few times he has played not this year earlier years he shown quality skills for a big man. The only player you mentioned that could be considered a bust is May who has not been on the court enough to say that.
Sheldan Williams is a lucky &$#%#&@!,
that poor basketball skilled man is marrying Candace Parker,
damn that dude...
McCants is just getting outplayed by the people on his team. Because if he was that good he would be playing the 2 and Foye the 1, but obviously he is not good enough because the wolves are not making that move.
he should definitely be producing at a higher level, considering the tools he got but he is just too one dimensional.... and from a lottery pick you might want something more than 3pointers
My point exactly, and there are so many more bust from Carolina so I don't know why everybody is on Dukes back.
Stop making excuses for him
Its one thing when a player is stuck in a bad situation due to a miscommunication between the front office and the coaching staff (Like Reddick's situation) its a COMPLETELY different story when you suck on two different teams. If you're drafted in the top 5 - you're supposed to turn into a star. Shelden is arguably worse than Sean May.
At least McCants seems to be playing a Flip Murray-esque role on the teams he's played for. His biggest problem is his attitude and nagging injuries from his rookie season. Also the fact that Randy Foye is NOT a true point guard. But thats way off base...
Joseph Forte is a bust.
Dahntay Jones is a bust.
Shelden Williams is a bust.
Sean May is a bust.
These are facts.
But to call guys like Dunleavy and Felton busts is just retarded.
Great players from UNC are greater than the greatest players from Duke.
Just throwing that out there for the equally delusional duke fans.
(Because conference championships are greater than National Titles lolololololol)
Once again nobody but Jordan was better than Grant Hill pre-injury....
I don't know about that...
He was good, but not that good.
You say he's not but you don't tell me somebody from Carolina who is. You're a funny guy. He was a triple-double threat every time on the court and was an absolute HoF'er if he would of stayed healthy.
im sorry but sheldon williams is a bust ..word is he wont even be in the leauge after his contract is up being picked that high and then barely being in the leauge...bust....marvin williams isnt a bust though..he was picked off of potential after playing a year in college and every year he has definatley gotten better no doubt...and leon powe is a very good 6th man who plays well when hes in the game..thats who he is..watch a lil more basketball
Okay okay, there is a line b/ being a bust and being a disappointment, here it is:
Brandon Wright- disappointment (Nelson's fault)
Huestis please pay attention to my post before you come with unwarranted criticism.
1) I never said Sheldon Williams wasn't a bust. I was simply stating that UNC has had their fair share of bust as well.
2) I asked "Who is Leon Pown" because the guy spelled Leon Powe wrong. So please read before you write.
And to my friend Aminu..... The future bust.
If you are going to blame Nelson for Brandon Wright's turnout, why don't you blame Van Gundy for Reddick's turnout? When Reddick plays, he plays pretty good except on D, but there are a lot of shooters who can't play D and get more praise. i.e. Korver and Kapono.
Korver and Kapono are 6'8ers,
Reddick is simply small, even though he tried to play D.
Don Nelson is just an incompetent coach, at least for this season .
Promising guard Marcus Williams didn't get any minutes entire season,
Wright and Randolph didn't get enough playing time,
captain-jack wasted so many shots and possessions,
and look at the warriors, they are losing.
It's only Reddick's third year in the league yet you're calling him a bust (yet it's Brandon Wright's second season but somehow it's the coaches fault and he just a disappointment). Steve Kerr started making contributions for the Bulls in his 8th season in the league so it's too early to call Reddick a bust.
Steve Kerr was 50th pick in the 1988 draft !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
you don't have the same expectations for a lottery pick and a late 2nd round pick, WT Heck !!!
Okay Aminu, they are 3 inches taller. What is your point? Reddick is a more polished offensive player than Kapono and Korver.
That 3 inches can completely change how the college game translates into the NBA, especially if one greatly lacks athleticism.
That additional 3 inches can allow a player to play SF, instead of SG, which for SOME players may be an offensive advantage because many SFs lack the defensive quicknesses that SGs have.
I'm just curious, why? What helped you determine this? Was it others? If you break Henderson's game down to a season by season basis, you will quickly notice how he's improved. If you watched him play earlier this season, he's become an animal compared to what he started out as. The thing that is so enticing about him, is the fact that he's still so RAW and still so INCREDIBLY EFFECTIVE.
Personally I'm not saying he's great, but think about this..
- has the size (remember wingspan counts in this)
- smooth effortless jumping ability
- ability to get his shot ANYTIME he wants it
- no left hand (or handles) but is still EFFECTIVE
The last one, is what I find intriguing about Henderson. He's a player who can only GO RIGHT and has NO BALL HANDLING SKILLS. Think of the improvement with some development in these areas. You have to look at him, from fresh to what he is currently, which is much much better. Sure, he should be ahead of his current progress. We all know this, but what people should take notice in, is the fact that he's improved every year (many just never do). So all in all, we know he's trying to get better and thats what it takes (and that should mean something as well).
What you are not understanding is that Reddick is better than Kapono and Korver, but they are still considered "great role players", while Reddick is deemed as a bad player. If he was in the right situation he could easily average 14-15 ppg.
You cannot blame Van Gaudy for not using enough JJ because the Magic wins games, unlike Nelson, whose warriors lose and does not use Marcus Williams and Brandon Wright.
Reddick had his chance to prove himself, but he did not play as well as Van Gaudy liked him to,
and that's why rookie Courtney Lee is playing 36 MINUTES a game in the playoffs, while JJ is not even part of the rotation.
Think this way, if JJ were to be able to play, then he would at least share minutes w/ Courtney Lee for 18 minutes a game, instead of the DNPs.