[The GoatParticipant]

 Here’s my post in response to OhCanada’s call for more threads –

What the flying f is up with Markelle Fultz’s shot? I haven’t seen a lot of preseason and I just caught some highlights and he looks like a completely different player. His free throws look like Rodman’s! I hear he had a shoulder injury, but surely they’ll look into this. It’d be a huge blunder to trade up and still bomb out on a draft pick. 

 

[BeastMode716Participant]

 and he was getting to the Rim at will

I just think he’s not used to playing off the ball & Simmons was really struggling w/ keeping a rythym going on offense & I believe that was messing up the whole starting Unit – including Fultz

The NBA is a pretty simple game when all is said & done

If a player has elite size & quickness at his position & he can penetrate off the dribble 

you have the foundation to build a star (if he works hard to expand & improve his game) & Fultz has all those attributes

Fultz is 19 & he gets Anywhere he wants on the court & he can shoot the 3 & the mid range Jumper

Personally I feel like Fultz will eventually be the starting Phila PG & Simmons will settle into a point forward role

And w/ Embiid they will run a Lot of the action that the 2013 Miami Heat ran

But people have to chill out – he’s a Rookie who has not played a single NBA game yet & he has not played w/ Embiid on the court – that Phila squad is an Entirely different unit w/ Embiid on the court – there is So much open space & the ball movement & rythym is tremendous. 

So wait until Fultz plays in the regular season & these kids get some games together under their belt

Ball struggled in preseason & we got people here in LA jumping off bridges 

CHILLAX

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[whiteflashParticipant]

 The problem with that is he doesn’t have elite size or quickness for his position. He’s just not a pg, and even though today’s backcourt positions are interchangeable he isn’t big or athletic enough to give most 2’s problems on D. He gets to the the rim off of of hesi’s and (predictable) spin moves and has trouble finishing once there. Said before the draft that he and Ball had the biggest bust potential, and I stand by that. 

[GBeeParticipant]

 What makes him not a PG?  He has the handle, IQ, passing, playmaking and unselfishness to be one. If you’re questioning his ability to defend PGs then you should be questioning Ball’s position too. The name of the game offensively for an NBA PG is still pick and roll and Fultz was a wizard in the PnR game, being the 2nd most efficient prospect in those situations in college basketball. Being an NBA PG is way more than beating a defender with straight up quickness off the bounce.  He has the handle, deception, change of pace, ranginess, the body strength to maintain his line and the threat of the shot (if he can at least get his jumper back to his college level) to beat defenders off the bounce from the perimeter.  That’s not even an issue.  PG defenders get beat off the dribble all the time, even by ball-handlers with less than ideal quickness because of how neutered perimeter defense is.  It’s what they can do once they beat the initial defender that seperates the mediocre from good.

Basically, he IS a PG until proven that he’s not and at that position he has exceptional size.

 

[whiteflashParticipant]

 Unselfish? Dude, he took a team ranked top 25 in the pre-season in a weak conference to less than ten wins all while padding his own stats. There’s nothing unselfish about him. I agree with you that today’s perimeter defense is neutered  (great phrasing, by the way) but he still has to finish if he gets by his man, and he hasn’t shown he can consistently do that. He’s long, I’ll give you that, but otherwise has no outstanding physical attributes or nuances to his game to make him effective at the moment. There’s a reason Boston had NO PROBLEMS giving up that pick.

[GBeeParticipant]

 Preseason top 25 according to who? Maybe if they brought back Chriss and Murray, but no. But just to indulge you, I fact checked and looked at the 2016 preseason AP, USA Today Coaches, SI, KenPom and TeamRankings polls and Washington wasn’t in any top 25. SI had them at 63rd, TR had the73rd and KenPom ranked them 80th.  They still underperformed, but they were not expected to be good, certainly not top 25 good.  They lacked depth, no one even close to top end talent outside of Fultz, had a horrible coach and were one of the worst defensive teams in the entire nation.

Despite being on a bad team Fultz still performed well with defenses focusing on him every night. He was efficient, scored on AND off the ball while also having a 36% assist rate, which is the 2nd highest assist rate of any player taken in the previous draft (Jawun Evans was the only one higher). Beyond statistics, IDK how you could’ve watched any of his games….in any setting going back to HS and come to the conclusion that he’s selfish.  He’s a more than willing passer with excellent vision, either via making the simple pass, moving the ball or playmaking AND he’s just as comfortable working off the ball where he excelled at catching and shooting or coming off screens and shooting (1.15 and 1.13 PPP respectively in those situations).  How many selfish players do you know are equally as effective scoring off the ball?

As far as what he can do after he gets past the initial defender, he has a tremendous handle, body control, footwork, huge hands (ball control at the rim), 6’10 wingspan, change of pace, decent foul drawing instincts, strength to absorb contact to go along with natural playmaking ability. Despite having defenses keyed in on him, he shot 62% at the rim while having to create the overwhelming majority of those takes while also displaying one of the best pull up games in college basketball.

[whiteflashParticipant]

 You just took three paragraphs to write "he padded his stats in a weaker conference and had his best games against non-conference nobody’s while leading his team to 8 wins". Again, despite what you think he hasn’t shown the ability to finish against NBA length and he was a 63% ft shooter in college. On a losing team. In a weak conference. He now looks pretty lost out there, has been relegated to the bench and was given up as a pick without hesitation. You can glorify it any way you like, but the facts don’t lie.

[GBeeParticipant]

 Lemme get this straight, he’s not a PG because he played for a bad team, that was never expected to be good despite your false assertion that they were a preseason top 25 team.  You then call him selfish despite him having one of the best AST rates among all draftees and contrary to his actual style of play as well as every single scouting report on him. Now you shift the goal posts even further by calling him a stat padder. What was he supposed to do on a bad team? Not put up good stats? Stat padders aren’t usually efficient bc they’re busy chucking the ball with no regard for continuity.  Stat padders usually don’t give up the ball, and certainly don’t prove to be as effective without it.  Furthermore, his stats didn’t change much at all from non-conference to conference play. In fact he actually scored more in conference play (23.2 on the season, 24.2 in conference play with basically the same aux numbers) having some of his best games vs the likes of Oregon, Arizona, UCLA and Utah.

Yeah he looked like sht in the preseason, but he also hasn’t been able to practice or play much because he’s dealing with a knee and shoulder injury (which he admitted was the reason his shot form was what it was).  TBH, if he was banged up to the point of changing his shot, he probably should not have been playing at all and would be better served starting the regular season in street clothes.

But you keep shifting the goal posts bruh. You suck at analyzing players as much as you do constructing arguments… and sentences for that matter.

[whiteflashParticipant]

 How have I "shifted the goal posts"? I called him a stat padder from the very beginning. And, in case you missed it, putting up good numbers on a bad team with little emphasis on winning is called "stat padding". Also, I was confusing Simmons and Fultz college pre-season rankings, but Washington was still thought to be a possible tourney team and, again, they won 8 games. Did you get your feelings hurt? Not sure why you’d throw out personal attacks, especially considering my track record of analyzing players on this site is actually pretty spotless. You say I’m "shifting goal posts" yet you bring up shit that doesn’t matter ’cause your argument doesn’t hold water. Classic deflecting. 

[The GoatParticipant]

 To clarify, I still think he is very talented, just lacking confidence. " Bomb out on a draft pick" is too strong statement – my b ad – obviously worst case scenario.

 

 His shot is messy all of a sudden, so I hope the adjustment was just because of the shoulder. a lot of young players can let the pressure and things like this get to them. 

[MopgrassParticipant]

 Fultz’s shot looking so far off base is the concern. If it really just is an injury thing, all will be well. The bigger concern is if it’s all in his head. If he’s an over-thinker and felt like tweaking his shot significantly (without the ok from Philly) and it’s not a truly a big shoulder injury, then it’s all on his head. That would be a red flag. Brett Brown sounded annoyed that Fultz made changes without consulting them. 

Lonzo Ball underwhelmed in his 2 pre-season games, he didn’t play poorly. He didn’t play summer league style. He still lead the team. His shooting is wonky, but we knew that. He still looks like a top, if not "the" top pick. 

 

 

[The GoatParticipant]

 It looks like a lot of potentially very good players from this draft, including Fultz. Even guys that went later – John Collins and Semi Ojeleye come to mind – look like they could become very good contributors if not more. So, still a surprise to me that Philly traded up for Fultz, especially using that draft pick. That leads me to a new question. Seeing what Boston eventually gave up, (and obviously timing and matching salaries are everything), but do you think Cleveland would’ve gone for something like the #3, Covington, Okafor and the Nets pick them instead of IT, Crowder, Zizic and the Nets pick..?.

[Meditated StatesParticipant]

 Move scouted by Smart and had the ball taken right out his hands of the spin when Marcus read it. He will need some time to develop, and I was not impressed b4 the draft either.

[Andv1 WaitingParticipant]

Futlz is a hard one to fully gauge:

Is it injuries or is it a mentallity thing that is screwing with his game..

Injuries -Knee swelling/soreness and shoulder if these come right and he comes right then its no big deal …Personally if I was the 76ers Gm I would be taking a long look at my training staff at this point if this keeps up…

or 

Is it he can’t handle not being the man on this team and is mentally crumbling because of it..

Me personally I would have Drafted Taytum over Futlz as I think he fits the 76ers a little better-Can catch and shoot,has height and length to go along with Simmons and Embiid..He also seems a little more likely to mentally handle it a little better than Futlz playing there..

Don’t get me wrong both Futlz+ the Fans believed he filled the only glaring hole for them, made sense for them and he could still turn it around.

 But personally  the mentality/drive with Futlz was always a concern for me with him..By this I mean how will he handle not being the number 1 option and could handle not getting his way with things,as he has always been the number 1 option on most of his teams..I really hope he doesn’t turn into the next Jimmer F as that would be kind of a sad ending to the Drafting Process for the 76ers..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[220Participant]

Fultz adjusted his shot without team approval which isn’t helping anything. He’s also been slowed by injuries to his shoulder and knee. Hopefully bringing him along slowly off the bench will help him adjust to the NBA. He looks worse than he did in Summer League by a lot. He seems to be struggling playing alongside Ben Simmons especially. Even when he’s at the point guard position he looks somewhat lost and out of control. The only thing he’s looked solid at is attacking the rim.

It’s concerning to say the least especially seeing how well Tatum is performing. The only positive is Bayless is back and is playing well so the 76ers aren’t immediately counting on Fultz to be great.

 

 

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