Bulls thinking things that don't need a lot of thought: Melo
The Chicago Bulls are interested in trading for the Denver Nuggets' Carmelo Anthony and are discussing internally including Joakim Noah as part of the deal, according to a league source.
According to the source, the Nuggets are hesitant to take back Luol Deng as part of a deal with the Bulls because Denver is leery of taking on long-term contracts with the collective bargaining agreement set to expire on June 30, 2011. Deng is two years into a six-year, $71 million contract.
Noah will make $3.1 million this season in the fourth year of his rookie deal. He would become a restricted free agent next season unless the Bulls extend his contract.
Yahoo! Sports reported Wednesday that an NBA source with knowledge of Anthony's wishes told him Anthony still hopes to convince Nuggets general manager Masai Ujiri to trade him, and he prefers a move to the New York Knicks or Bulls.
The Nuggets offered Anthony a three-year, $65 million extension through 2014, but if he rejects it, the team will have to consider trading the forward who has guided them to seven straight playoff berths.
"I think I'm going to convince him to be a Nugget," Ujiri said on Aug. 31. "No, I don't know, I can't make a judgment on that. Like I said, it's a process and until he tells me that ... we want him back, the city wants him back, ownership wants him back."
Anthony has never come out and said he wanted to be traded, however.
At his basketball camp this summer, Anthony dismissed all the speculation of his impending departure from Denver: "I've been hearing that for five years. I'm a Denver Nugget. I'm here, I'm with the Nuggets. I don't become a free agent until next year, if I decide not to take that extension."
Carmelo or limited, try hard Joakim Noah? Are you serious? It should be done in a heart beat. Noah is nice to have on the rookie scale, but I would not want to be the team that invests a ton of money in a guy that the opposition wants to see touch the ball offensively. He has a defensive reputation because he gives effort, but he isn't great on that end. It is easy to support the try hard guy, but he is an easy guy to sell high on.
u have replace Noah with somebody similar to him...I'd pull the trigger if they gave me Birdman...
@ Scare Crow
Great call, they need a defensive big to pair with Boozer.
The Bulls already picked up another big, try hard, unskilled big man in Omer Asik. Birdman would make no difference. With Asik, Gibson, and Kurt Thomas, they would be fine at the 5 spot. Boozer is already a rock a the 4. Now, they have the opportunity to bring in an elite scorer. If the cost is only going to be Noah, Deng, and maybe a first or two, they have to do it.
I couldn't agree more, I believe Omer Asik is a great find, but i believe Noah is more valuable than those players you named there. Gibson is a quality big, but not a 5, he is undersized, as is Kurt Thomas. I think Noah really solifies their 5 spot. He brings a lot of intangibles and for a chunk of the season last year, led the league in rebounding.
Now with that being said Carmelo Anthony is still Carmelo Anthony. I would go after him in that trade in a heartbeat, however, like Scare crow said, I believe that addition of Birdman really helps their frontcourt.
I agree with you one hundred percent that Boozer is a "rock at the 4." I think he is one of the best power forwards in the league.
All I was saying, is this:
future first rounder
looks like a more even trade then:
Not to overlook all the things that Noah brings to the table, but this is a no brainer if Denver gives them a chance. Noah has been very good the last two years but he is not a star. Carmelo is one of the ten best in the league, and as weve learned in recent years, getting the great players is the hardest part of building a championship team. Having Melo, Boozer, and Rose would make them one of the best free agent destinations if they werent already. Great vets would take less money to come there like we're seeing in Miami and Boston. Love Noah but its a no brainer
I'm shocked Denver would really take back Deng's contract. I thought the idea was to move Melo and begin a rebuild.
If they move Melo for Deng and Noah, that's a good deal but it REALLY pushes Denver down the West.
If Chicago could get Melo for any sort of deal then they will look at it but moving Noah would create a big hole at 5 and come play off time up aganst say Orlando, Boston etc before you get to the West then there could be a size issue. Also can anyone say that Melo, Rose and Boozer are a better threesome than LeBron, Wade and Bosh. t has another dimension with a potentially great PG in Derrick Rose but elsewhere it doesn't quite match up.
If Chicago could keep Noah maybe by offering Gibson and Johnson along with Deng then I'd love the deal and Chicago could send future first picks as well. They do have a lottery protected pick due from Charlotte for 2012 via Tyrus Thomas trade so could send that plus their 2011 and 2013 first rounders to Denver.
Yeah not sure what Denver is thinking if they take this deal Deng's contract is awful.
The Bulls don't have any young players with great potential except Rose.
Gibson, Noah, Johnson are nice role players thats it, Nuggets need to get more for Mello.
I'd really hate to see Noah go, I feel his energy, athleticism and defense are extremely valuable. I'd love to see Melo in a Bulls jersey, but not at the expense of Noah. The Bulls have 2, 20 point scorers in Rose and Boozer, adding a 30 point scorer to the mix would probably work, but what happens when Chicago plays Orlando, Boston, or LA.....they get destroyed in the paint and hope they can put up enough points to make up for it. That doesn't sound like Thibedeau
Kurt Thomas will bang and has done so for fifteen years. Omer Asik has showed in the WCs that while he might not have a single basketball related skill he will hang around the hoop, be big, play big, and be active. Taj Gibson is probably exploitable because of his lack of strength against teams with centers over 250 lbs. but he can give minutes there in most instances. Plus, Louis Amundson still hasn't been signed. Rasho is still around. Brian Skinner is a phone call away. Sean May was just released. They still have to fill out a roster anyway, and there are guys out there who can offer bulk and experience.
There are servicable guys, but after hating him in college, Noah really won me over as a Bulls fan. I understand you have to give up talent to get it, but a guy with his energy and athleticism and is only 25 who's gonna average 11+ rpg and 2 bpg is rare, as rare as a guy who can drop 28 a night like Melo. If there were anyway to do the deal without dropping in Noah i'd be gung ho, but that is one guy I want to be with the Bulls for a long time.
I think it is being put out there but Denver has not really bit on it so to speak.
Everyone here who is ready to throw Noah away and claim that he he is nothing special and doesn't have a lot of skill and that they could EASILY find another guy to replace him with....you guys are fools....and clearly didn't watch any Bulls games last year....especially the playoffs when he went for 15pts 13reb 2.6ast and made 18/19 free throws in the 5 game series against the Cavs.
And his April numbers when the Bulls fought for that playoff spot....14pts 13.4reb 3.5ast 2blk
The guy is much more than just heart and energy. He may not have the best shot around but his basketball IQ is off the charts.
Melo is a great player but I am not ready to give up Noah as part of the deal.
Give them Deng, Taj, Johnson and the next 5 1st rd picks....keep Noah.
is going to want to get paid unless you can lock noah down at a decent contract. but he might want more money than he is worth. noah is good but how much is he worth is a big question. trading for melo gives you a guaranteed max player worth every penny. to shed dengs contract which isnt as bad as everybody thinks it is it would be worth the upgrade especiallys somebody who would fit well with boozer and rose.
Man that's tough. Melo is much better then Noah but they have zero channce against the heat Boston or Orlando with aski or Kurt Thomas in the middle with no defense boozer at the pf. Some how they would have to get nene. Then remember rose defense is bad as well so if no wait when you drive last rose you aren't gonna be afraid of boozer or any other big man on that team. Add deng and take back nene and it's a deal
I dont know about this, this sounds like a very risky move for chicago on denver side of town thats perfect to rebuild with but as for chicago say when his contract is up and he opts to re-sign in another city that leaves the bulls with just Rose and Boozer for years to come as of now Bulls have a complete starting 5 and can compete if I was Gar Forman im not giving up Noah take deng and some potntial of the bench but not Noah.......
Here's the thing, Carmelo is on the NUGGETS, and they decide where he goes.
Sorry to say, but Melo IS NOT going to the bulls if they don't give Noah.
Denver isn't obliged to trade melo to the bulls. They'll look for another team to talk to that will offer more for melo's services.
agree. There's alot of other teams that can offer better things. If you have a couple first rounders you have a great chance to get him. The problem is resigning him
I'm wondering if people are forgetting what Noah can do. Sure he is not a top 10, top , 20.... you get the point. The guy can play and is extremely valuable. Part of that is due to his abilities vs. That of other centers. I also see him being the center piece of the bulls defense. What go is a great defensive coach without defenders and disruptors. The guy not only plays hard, but he produces and aspects of his game are getting better. I truly think he is the heart of the bulls. Everyone forgets how well the bulls were playing before Noah got hurt last year. After that they had a yard sale to prepare for free agency and still made the playoffs with an injured Noah coming up huge.
I think Kurt Thomas could be serviceable until they could get another guy via draft/free agency in a year
Hmmm that trade may just make the Bulls as good as the Heat. Both teams would have great gaurd play, great forwards and mediocre C's. Too bad the winner of that Eastern Conference Finals would have to play LA...
Yea Kurt can if they don't plan on challenging for a title. It will take a draft pick at least two years to be really effective. Then again it's easier to find another Noah then it is to find another melo
"Everyone here who is ready to throw Noah away and claim that he he is nothing special and doesn't have a lot of skill and that they could EASILY find another guy to replace him with....you guys are fools....and clearly didn't watch any Bulls games last year....especially the playoffs when he went for 15pts 13reb 2.6ast and made 18/19 free throws in the 5 game series against the Cavs."
You obviously don't have a sense of what special is in the NBA. If the Bulls want to compete for titles, the only guy they don't consider parting with is Rose. It is a star driven league. Role players turn over. Joakim Noah is a role player. If you can put him in a package to get a star, they are better for it. Period. End of story.
You don't trade rose or boozer. You aren't beating the top teams with just rose and melo. With that they aren't much different then Denver billups at least can soread the defense and plays defense so that equals out him
for mel. Any if the bulls players can be had other then those 2
Noah is such an X-Factor with Chicago last season... I really don't think the guy can easily be replaced... You can't measure what this guy can bring to the table... His winning attitude and his nastiness is what Chicago needs right now... I think Gar Foreman is a smart dude.... He's not just gonna bite on this deal because everybody is wanting to see how Noah would fair up with Boozer at the post... I think they really compliment each other...
Derrick Rose is 21, Melo is 26. The Bulls put all the chips on the table to assemble those two for the next decade. This isn't some fantasy like with the Knicks where some people think that Eddy Curry, Wilson Chandler, and a pick in 2047 has value. They have their own picks as well as the one from the Bobcats. Joakim Noah is an asset. Taj Gibson has some value. They have the assets to make it happen if they bring everything they have to the table. I don't see a reason to hesitate on this one.
He can't easily be replaced and he was a xfactor that's why if I'm the bulls I want nene as well. If not then I'd take melo. Because he is harder to come by then a Noah. Then I'd see if I could get daimper
First, he was the x-factor on a team that got shellacked by LeBron in the first round.
Second, the time is coming where they might have to pay him. It is really hard to pay a limited player as much money as Joakim Noah will likely be able to get next summer and compete for a title. If you have Melo, Boozer, and Rose locked in, they can find glue guys, role players, x-factors, and all the other cliche terms to give greater value to lesser players and have a real shot at competing for a title.
It doesn't matter if the Bulls have to pay him. They have a little room left under the salary cap this year. After they use that up or don't, this is basically the team they have barring trades, mid level exceptions and and bi-annual exceptions. It's going to become how much or if they are willing to take a luxury tax hit every year.
Obviously Deng would be a part of this trade. So you are telling me that you trade two of your top 3 defenders away when you have a defensive coach? Thibs has to be excited to get this team. He had a Boston team that was and is aging, now he goes to a young Chicago team. It doesn't make sense for them to get rid of Deng and Noah. I don't think that Boozer is going to look as good without Noah beside him as well. We know Boozer can play and he has been an all star, but one thing that always killed Utah was having a soft front line and Boozer isn't much on defense. Since everyone is talking about Miami, I really don't see the Bulls standing a chance against them if they make this trade and include Noah. Miami's biggest weaknesses are center and pg...Chicago has one of the best point guards in the league and one of the better big men, who's likely going to demolish the guys Miami has on t he boards. Bosh would eat Boozer alive and Lebron and Wade would get to the basket all day long.
I also want to say I like Melo a lot, but he's really not the most efficient player in the world and not much of a defender. A trade like this is going to give Chicago a Swiss Cheese defense.
Of won't be a problem for Miami because they can just put Wade on rose and we all know rose can't play average defense. I'm sure the bulls wanna keep Noah but melo is melo. I like Noah but if you can get melo and sign dampier you are in very good shape. I don't believe you can plug in Kurt and aski and think that's gonna replace Noah because it won't. And you don't make that trade unless melo signs the extension and does a sign and trade because he could easily decide once the season ends , to test the market and go somewhere else
Noah is a top 3 center in the East. the bulls already have two of the best at the pg and pf positions, and replacing a very serviceable sf with melo does not improve them enough to make up for what they lose with Noah. Argue all you want about role players and stars and who is which, but it makes no difference if the pieces don't fit.
I love melo's game, and it's really hard to argue against what he brings on offense, but this team is built around defense, and that defense is predicated on Noah's presence.
If they could get Melo by giving up Deng, Gibson, Johnson, and some picks, i'd be for it. But Noah is too valuable for this team.
I'm up for the Deng, Gibson, Johnson and some picks scenario. It's not like there are a bunch of teams that are going to be able to offer Denver much. Because when it comes down to it, it's Denver's choice, but if it's Melo's pick then it helps in the cause. Everyone knows Deng is overpaid, but after some of the contracts I saw his isn't looking as bad. Besides, he's still pretty young and I think he's always going to be tradeable.
Top 3 Center I don't think so not with his lack of an offensive game.
These Centers are better than Noah
Here's a list of the Centers in the East that Noah is better than
Knicks Turiaf, Mozgov, Curry
Wizards Blatche, Mcghee, Armstrong
Raptors Alabi, Nesterovic, Anderson
Celtics Perkins, Shaq
Cavs Varajeo, Hollins, Hickson
Heat Anthony, Magloire, Big Z
Bobcats Dampier, Mohammed, Diop
Pacers HIbberts, Foster, McRoberts
Pistons Ben Wallace, Wilcox
76ers Hawes, Elson, Battie
Actually there are teams that can offer better because if draft picks. Like I said Noah is a good xfactor but he's alot easier to find then a melo. The bulls are in a win win situation if the rumor are true. But as of now they are just rumor nothing more
Sometimes a team can have too many chiefs and not enough indians..
I dont think that I would trade Deng and Noah for Melo... I mean, like has been said 100 times before, Deng is a guy that is going to be very solid and will give you something that looks like 16, 7, and 2.. He will also guard guys like Anthony and James and want to do that.. Noah is a guy that gives you a sure fire starter at the C position and gives you 11 and 11 with a couple blocks and countless changed shots and hustle plays..
Lets look at numbers since so many people want to see the numbers..
If the trade was this:
Then the Bulls are giving up 30 points, 18 rebounds, 4 assists, 2 steals, and 3 blocks per game by losing Deng and Noah..
They would be receiving 34 points, 12 rebounds, 4 assists, 1 steal, 2 blocks per game by taking back Melo and Anderson... However, Anderson has just had patellar tendon surgery and that is something that takes away lots of explosion and a long time to heal.. Anderson is not a proven starter and is only going to decline from here on out...
But, that means that the Bulls, by making this trade would be:
That is if Anderson makes a recovery.. Then, the Bulls dont have a proven center and they have a guy that is going to take shots from Boozer and Rose..
Lets just see if Deng isnt the perfect complement to Boozer before we start trying to condemn him to hell...
My problem is this. The Bulls trade away Deng, Noah, Gibson and draft picks for Melo.
Melo stays for one year and then goes elsewhere in free agency.
The Bulls are back to a mediocre team because they traded their core for a one hit wonder.
And saying a replacement for Noah would be a guy like Kurt Thomas or Dampier is ridiculous.
Can't use the numbers because those are without boozer. With boozer I'm
sure Noah scores less and gets less rebounds the same with deng. And dampier isn't better then Noah but you don't need someone better then Noah is you're adding melo just need a big active body who will play defense. Dampier can get at least ten and eight and a block and that's all you need