Breaking News: Knicks caved in and gave Mozgov to Nuggets!
I'm watching ESPN and they didn't say it
Also, no mention here http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nba/news/story?id=6145912
I thought New York was interested in Sebastien Telfair. Minny could give him up as well as a future first round pick.
Knicks depth chart: Billups/Douglas/Telfair/Rautins, Fields/Walker, Melo/Azuibuike, Amare/Balkman, Turiaf/Ely
Definite hole at backup 4 and back up 5.
"I'm watching ESPN and they didn't say it" lol, you really go to ESPN for all your sports info, other websites have info out like hours before.
Not really, I went to SB Nation as well and pro basketball talk. NOTHING. So hop off my balls
That is funny. How long before Knick fans catch on that there is no difference between Timofey Mozgov and Shelden Williams? The Knicks got the best two players in the trade, and gave up a collection of mediocrity.
The only thing I might enjoy more than the Danilo apologists seeing what a real NBA starting small forward looks like is Anthony Randolph's brand of loser basketball teamed up with Michael Beasley's and Kevin Love's brand of loser basketball. So many empty numbers and ways to lose basketball games.
If you guys think Miami has a depth problem. The Knicks experience might be worse. Lets see what they do to take care of the problems. All in all, its about time for this to end. Glad to see Carmelo go where he wanted. Happy for him. However, now the East is truly BEAST.
I don't think Gallinari is that good. Chandler isn't irreplaceable. I don't see what all the hype is with Mozgov. Just another big body. Felton is having a great season playing run and gun, but we all saw what he was like with the Bobcats.
Basically, none of those players are irreplaceable. This is a good deal for New York. Melo is a top 10 player and the best scorer in basketball.
Mozgov most likely will not remain a Nugget for long. Sources have him being dealed, potentially to NJ, potentially to another team in a package deal in 3 team trade with Harris. Mozgov has good ability but the bottom line is, stars are what is necessary to compete at the highest of levels, and the Knicks got a star AND made an upgrade PG. Also don't be surprised to see Sheldon Williams provide some decent minutes for the Knicks. Mozgov simply isn't good enough to stop the Knicks from getting better now and potentially in the future, which they have done with this deal. Also the Knicks couldn't afford to have any other team potentially steal Carmelo and leave them flat on their face. Great deal for the Knicks, and the deal isn't yet complete for the Nuggets yet to grade but they have finally moved on which is what they needed to do.
Hence bringing the Wolves into the deal. Honestly, this seems like the logical conclusion for this whole circus. Melo gets his way, the Knicks at least get to keep Landry Fields and Amare Stoudemire, lol. Either way, Billups is still a better all around PG than Raymond Felton in my mind, plus he has a team option that the Knicks will more than likely use and than he is off the books for 2012. This leads to a likely ability to get some room to get Paul.
What Knicks fans and a lot of people did not get is that the Knicks/Melo did not have all of the power that people (even I) initially believed. The only way they could sign Melo for Max money would be through a sign and trade, but they had so little leverage since they could not sign him to a max deal regardless. They would have had cap room to hook up about 12.5 million a season, which is far below what he will make when he signs the extension of course. So, the Nuggets did the smart thing, which was to try and get the best deal possible while giving in to Melo's insistence on going to New York.
This deal by no means is equal value for Melo. The Nuggets are a significantly worse team, and in a sense are the Knicks last year with Nene (who will more than likely be on the move). Well, at least he is more of a Center (of the true variety) than the Knicks have at this point. But, they get some new starters and a couple nice young players, give rebuilding a chance. I know, the Nets package was probably much more attractive. But, Melo did not want to go to the Nets. He would not re-sign with them, so he got what he wanted while the Nuggets slightly less than they did. Still, while you are not going to get equal returning value in what is basically a sign and trade, the Nuggets did not do a bad job. If you are a Nuggets fan, just be happy it is over and hope that this is a nice step towards building a new team identity.
The Timberwolves in the mean time seem to give up one of their many wings for Anthony "Potential" Randolph and the expiring contract of Eddy Curry. Curry is known around many circles as "The Darko Stopper", so he will hopefully be a hugely important piece in T-Wolves practice. Just kidding, his contract will probably expire and I have a feeling he could end up on some other team, but more than likely not the Wolves. Maybe LeBron will light a fire under Eddy's butt and he will take Jamaal Malaloire's spot. All we know is that the Knicks did not get their money's worth, even in Eddy's "All-Star" (He was really pissed a couple years ago that he was not selected. No, Eddy Curry was never an All-Star) season, he was not worth what he signed for. Anthony Randolph of course will remind some people of Michael Beasley in that "he needs to find the right situation", but so far, he is a lot of potential and very little sustained production. You would think a player as versatile as Randolph would have excelled in Nelly or D'Antoni's systems, he is a good athlete and of course has a nice skill set. He is however, not incredibly strong and you just have to wonder why it hasn't clicked, is it the mental game or his work ethic? Well, he should be a nice back-up for Kevin and should more than likely play with he or Love as the Center at times. Should be interesting to see, and the important thing is, will he help the Wolves win some games? Should be interesting to see, but giving up Brewer alone for Randolph seems to be worth it and looks like a win for the Wolves.
New York of course is the big winner with getting their guy, but they more than likely will not be a contending team until they land that last part of the puzzle in 2012. They were very lucky to have chosen a winner in Landry Fields, and he will more than likely be in their future plans as well, or could be possible leverage for a trade to land Paul or D-Will if they do not have the cap space. Well Melo, was this really better than the decision? Everyone handled this pretty badly, but I feel like Melo was pulling his version of a Vince Carter for the last little bit of the season. He may not have flat out gave up like Vince did with the Raps, but he was a distraction and I think he sucked at handling this and should have been more up front with his demands. Since Felton was involved, it would have taken a while until he was eligible for a trade, but as a fan of a team I would want the person traded ASAP. Well, ACTDAP (As Close To the Deadline As Possible), was more of the deal here. Glad it is over, let's get on with the NBA season. Congrats to the Knicks, sorry and good tidings to the Nugs, good luck to the Wolves. This is a trade that makes sense for all the teams involved, people making ESPN trade posts may want to take note. For the stipulations and context of the deal, it worked.
Currently, Denver didn't make out great. But I say currently because the trade is incomplete as of right now. The only player I think is safe from the trade to Denver is Gallinari. According to what I've read the Nuggets could be going 100% rebuild mode now, and look into trading the rest of their veterans. The roster the Nuggets have now is maybe a .500 team at the most. The Knicks I think realistically now have for sure put themselves as solid #6, and *potentially* on Chicago/Orlando level.
The only thing with getting rid of mozgov is you lose a guy that is 7'1 and can run the floor and is content with getting all his points off dunks. Amar'e made him a better player simply for all the attention he got. I will miss Mozgov cause he could runt he floor well and get rebounds. Otherwise, not a big loss. Knicks got the best of the deal. Yeah they don't have depth, but they will get depth for next year, the goal wasn't to win it all this year.
Indianabasketball I disagree with Ty lawson, Afflalo, Chandler, Gallinari, nene, mozgov, felton, birdman, k-mart and etc. They lost Carmelo, but got back a whole bunch of depth with draft picks and cash. This team is dangerous if they're able to get a franchise player to replace Melo and even without him they're a good team with lots of depth
"Knick should've waited for free agency to sign Melo.....its not like this trade puts them in top 3 in the "EAST"...they gave up too much."
They gave up nothing. They aren't top four in the East, but they are no longer a team dying to fall below .500.
"Indianabasketball I disagree with Ty lawson, Afflalo, Chandler, Gallinari, nene, mozgov, felton, birdman, k-mart and etc. They lost Carmelo, but got back a whole bunch of depth with draft picks and cash. This team is dangerous if they're able to get a franchise player to replace Melo and even without him they're a good team with lots of depth"
That is broken logic. The Cleveland Cavaliers are one franchise player from being a good team too. The Nuggets have invited Nene to leave this summer, which means they are going to look a lot like the Knicks team that won 29 games in the East last year.
That just adds to the win for the Knicks, as he should fit that system very well and give them a defender on the wing as a backup. Also, as for the Nuggets, they did what they needed to do, but lets not go crazy either about what they have now. They do not have a #1 option and it's beyond clear you need that to be successful consistently. Will Nene be motivated in a rebuild situation? Will be leave during the offseason? What will they get back after they do more wheeling and dealing until the trade deadline? The win for the Nuggets would have been the Nets deal, this is an incomplete grade. The Knicks win because they got the two best players of the deal, and got the NY born superstar.
yes ima knick fan n i wanna say sorry to donnie walsh because i made a post @ draft time sayin plz fire donnie walsh for picking landry fields n andy rautins lol..he did a good job on this but i will miss wilson chandler game n didnt really want them to trade mozgov but o well we cant have everything
BTPH, said the exact same thing about the Nugs. They are in rebuilding mode though, but it will be a while before they are good. Was my cap room knowledge right at all, it is just something I thought was kind of the deal here. Knicksboy and others always were saying to just wait for the off-season, but it definitely did not appear to be that easy or too make sense. I do agree that the Knicks gained much more than they lost and the best two players in the trade.
Very glad this whole thing is over, and Quentin, do not be too down. The expectations you had on the Knicks ability to maneuver in this situation was not realistic. You got Melo man, and I think you will get a top flight PG in 2012. Who knows if that will make them a contender, but I think it will certainly make them a better team than if they held the course.
And so it begins....
I'm really torn on all of this. So many variables to consider. First off does anyone in Knicks nation believe that Mr. Thomas didn't have his grubby little hands all over this trade? It smells like a Thomas trade.
Denver made out like bandits, especially when you consider trade deadline deals of yester year. Paul Gasol was had for a bag of chips. Shaq was traded for Butler and parts. I'm actually really impressed with Denver's ability to get as much as they did. Melo is not Lebron, or Wade. He is a star player, but not a superstar.
When you think about it NY really only gave up Chandler and Gallo. Felton and Mozgov were free agent signings this past offseason. I would have really loved for for NY to hold onto Mozgov. When Amir Johnson can sign for 35 mil you know centers are a tough commodity. Mozgov is signed for another 3 years at a really cheap salary. For all of you saying "he's not that good"... just wait. He's a rookie, in a new country but he will be a Very servicable starting center down the line. I'd much rather have Mozgov then Brook Lopez.
NY doesn't need to worry about picks. Every draft there are picks available in the 20's for cash. NY still has its own 2011 pick and a first round exit is likely. Billups will provide a timely expiring contract for the summer of 2012 when Howard (currently) Williams (definitly) and Paul (better then 50-50) can become unrestricted free agents, provided he doesn't decline his option for next season.
Denver did really well. Gallo played Melo straight up in games in the past and held his own. Chandler is a jack of all trades player who is very athletic. Felton has proven he is a starting caliber PG. Mozgov is oozing potential and will likely be a starting center in the future.
I'd give Denver an A+ for this trade. The turned a player who was certain to walk if he continued to say he wasn't signing his extension into a really nice haul of players and picks.
NYK get a B-. Yes they got Melo, and Billups will be an excellant fit on this team (mentoring Douglas will be helpful) but they gave up wayy to many quality assets for a "star" player and a rental. Thomas and Dolan have no balls when it comes to a poker face. Where was the continued patience?
How exactly are the Knicks losing depth? They are trading three starters, but getting two better starters in return. Not to mention the Brewer trade adds another athletic wing defender coming off the bench. I wouldn't be surprised if you saw Melo playing the four spot for a few stretches during games. His ability to post up or hit the jumper in the Knicks offense is going to be deadly.
Turiaf
Amare- Sheldon
Melo- Williams
Fields- Brewer
Billups- Douglas
That's a lot better then what they had before
I dont see how Knicks screwed up when Fields who they drafted this year in the 2nd round became a starter and key player on their team as a rookie so they could possibly find other young pieces easily in the coming drafts. They are already said to be looking at Earl Barron. They have a young big oversees that is pretty athletic they also got in the draft this year in a trade with the Bucks. Brewer and others can be moved to get some other pieces. They could keep Brewer who could be a poor man Chandler. Shelden Williams can rebound and bang which is not bad consider they will not need any help scoring with Melo, Billups, and Amare playing. turiaf is still there for energy blocks and rebounds. Azubuike's contract can be moved and he has yet to play for them this season. Bill Walker can get more minutes and he has shown he deserves them and his contract is pretty cheap. The Knicks have the same problem with Melo they had before Melo and that was get more size. All in all they got a superstar in his prime and they dont have any terrible contracts to get rid of.
Denver is good too because they can now rebuild because even with Melo, they were the 4th at best and mostly the 6th best team with younger teams like OKC and Portland leapfroging them.
The interesting thing will be will they still make the playoffs.
Also New York Knicks was already a lock for the 6th spot.
I mean seriously you really thought Philly or Indiana was going to overtake them lol.
I think they can actually catch ATL right now.
I wonder if Billups has trade value to wear Okc, ATL give up one of their young points they are not playing much like Maynor or Teague. New York could always wait for Kemba Walker or Nolan Smith late in this upcoming draft. Either one could push Douglas or make him expendable.
Minny did well because they were going to let Brewer go anyway and got another young talent because they had cap room.
Kahn is not that smart but he is showing me that he is not as stupid as a lot of Gm's which is not saying much but still they have tons of young assets and cap space and they have some excitement especially if they can convince Rubio to come over.
Is a free agent at the end of the year also, and most likely would not have been retained by the Knicks. Felton has one more year on his deal after this and obviously, the Knicks are putting their chips in the table for one of the elite PGs in 2012. And Gallinari's position, the #3/4 spot, is now taken by Carmelo Anthony and Amare Stoudamire. So when you are looking at the future of the Knicks, they've actually helped themselves immensely, and their roster this year is improved as well. They are the big winners here.
I know Billups is old but he still is playing at a high level and it'll be interesting to see what kind of numbers he can put up in Dantoni's system. He has never really had a chance to run and gun before.
Yes, Felton was having a good season but Billups is still the better PG right now so the Knicks managed to upgrade not just one but two positions on their team. The East is starting to look even more crowded right now.
Let's break down this again.
The big Russian just now starting getting minutes but before that he was on the bench
Billups replaces Felton
Melo replaces Gallo and despite your love for Gallo, Melo is better as of right now and maybe for another 2 years at least if Gallo finally gets it and becomes Dirk part 2 then they will be head to head with Gallo getting the edge in my mind but hey that is two year at the at the least away.
Brewer could replace Chandler with a little help from increased minutes by Walker
Randolph and Curry did not play much
You add Carter, Shelden Williams(banger and rebounder/also mr Candace Parker), and some other bkup
Earl Barron is supposed to be signed to replace the Russian until the Knicks do it again and find another international player that is big and tall that no one knows about plus they have this 2nd rounder Jerome Jordan who is athletic but needs to learn the game but who is a legit 7 feet.
They have trade pieces to make some moves and they could also sign Patrick Ewing Jr if they need more forward help or possibly Sean Williams who would be a beast in Mike D system for 10 to 15 minutes.
This is a crazy thought, I wish Steve Nash would ask a trade because Billups contract and other would be perfect to make the deal. Nash deserves the chance to play on another upcoming playoff team. I really want Nash to get a ring bad but it looks like it will never happen. He may never play another playoff game with Phoenix because they suck compare to at least 7 teams in the west right now but could sneak in this year beacause Utah and Denver may pack it in, leaving GSW and Suns a spot if they want it bad enough
Here is the trade breakdown:
New York gets:
Carmelo, Billups, Balkman, Williams, and Carter
Denver gets: Gallinari, Mosgov, Felton, Chandler, 2014 New York 1st & two 2nd round picks
Minnesota gets: Anthony Randolph and Eddy Curry
I can't believe New York caved in and trade Mozgov to the Nuggets...