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Am I the only one that sees a problem with Hayward being drafted before Babbitt

knicksfan7
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How is Hayward like CJ Miles.

How is Hayward like CJ Miles. Both have point-forward qualities and are shooters. They are active defenders, but struggle on defense. I am not throwing out black people.

sheltwon3
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How are they race baiting?

How are they race baiting? Explain. I am sorry if you get upset at me because i mentioned a white player. Would it be race bait if I talked about a black player. Okay I will start talking about black players. Most of the black players already get negative press. There is nothing I could say about a black player that has not been mentioned. Should I talk about Cousins. If he was not such a red flag player he could have gone number one. He has that ability. No one will say I am race baiting on that one. I put many black players in the second round but no one loses it on them. I said Whiteside will take like 3 to 4 years to develop and no one says anything. I think it is racist that I can not talk about white players without people thinking I am racist or race baiting.

nhlkdog411
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How are you race baiting?

Hmm lets see you've maintained your stance for weeks that Bird is desperate to draft white players JUST BECAUSE THEY'RE WHITE, despite me pointing out weeks ago that the Pacers have drafted like one white guy in the first round in the last 10 years. You constantly make posts implying that Bird is going to draft Hayward just because he's white, in this post specifically alluding to him replacing Danny Granger with Hayward, who as aforementioned is only being drafted for his whiteness. You make claims that white players ALWAYS get positive press and positive draft projections (really? because I remember draft expertst TEARING APART Tyler Hansborough and I can't count the number of times I've read that a white guy "isn't a good enough athlete"). You make posts that "ALL black players get negative press"...hmm...wheres the neg press for: Wall, Turner, Monroe, Favors, Paul George etc....oh they must not be black according to you I guess? Lets face it you're whole spiel on this website is getting old quick as evidenced by the negative responses in just about everyone one of your threads.

sheltwon3
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Hayward is not a NBA

Hayward is not a NBA defender. CJ Miles is for the most part but I dont see Hayward doing that they said he was getting killed on D at the combines. I also gave a comparsion and said Fransico Garcia but that was just type of head. Garcia may have longer wingspan. Garcia is closer Hayward size and he can handle the ball and he shoot. I dont think Hayward is that good of a shooter but some say he is. CJ Mile is a lot more athletic than Hayward and this goes beyond combines stats. Miles is more explosive.

Your comparison was not horrible though but it seems like a reach because I have seen Mile play quite a bit and I would not group those two together based on what I have seen of both.

Knickfans If I am wrong I will own up but since you opened your mouth I expect you to be the same.

I will admit I was wrong about Sessions even though I said I think he can be top 10 point guard if given a starting position. I though he would go to the Knicks and I know his numbers would have put him there. Sessions actually had better assists numbers than Jennings who many are raving about being at top 5 point guard. Sessions is not a better shooter but a more consistent one.

Session has to share time with Flynn who was going to get minutes since he was young and playing for a team not really going anywhere and on top of that, they have to run the triangle offense which is not a good offense for point guards especially ones like Sessions who is not really a scoring point even though he played spot minutes at the two. i will admit I had a lil bias in Sessions because I love playmaking point guards and I knew he could do wonders starting for a team with a fast pace and him leading the break but it did not happen. Would I call someone retarded because they don't like Sessions no. Would i tell you knicksfan you are racist because you dont like Sessions. That was my opinion. Right now it is looking bad but he has yet to start and never will in Minny.

JNixon
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Hayward is similar to a

Hayward is similar to a younger CJ Miles. Both had raw point-forward ability, good jump shots, wiry frames, and only average athleticism. The only difference is Miles was probably longer and didn't try as hard on D as Hayward did at the same stage. Miles just started trying to defend like in the last 2 years or so.

llperez
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sheltwon, you do bring race

sheltwon, you do bring race into a lot of things. Just a couple weeks ago, there was a thread about the one and done rule and people were debating it and no one brought up race, and then you jumped in with something about how the nba doesnt want to see black young people making millions but it is okay for white young musicians and actors to make millions and it is not fair for black people. I was like where the hell did that come from.

sheltwon3
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They tried to draft more

They tried to draft more player than were available. I don't forget. Bird was linked to taking Luke Jackson who went to the Cavs. Bird also was trying to get Morrison who went to the bobcats pretty high.

You pointed out facts but your facts mean nothing because they did not have success in drafting all the players they wanted or tried to get. They was able to take Hansbrough because no one else was going to take him earlier. Do your research a lil harder next time. Nice try though but not good enough. I am not race baiting. I am sorry if the truth offends you. I am not going to refrain from saying what is true because the truth hurts. That is life.

sheltwon3
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Dude that is true. I am sorry

Dude that is true. I am sorry for not being politically correct but everyone knows that it is because of the make up of the NBA. Are you serious? Some of you on here are really naive. What reason do you see it as. You honestly believe that if the NBA was 75% or 80% white people this would be an issue. I am sorry if the truth comes across to you as racism. You know what you guys are the future. I am a old dude. I am going to keep it strictly basketball and not even get on those debate anymore because it is pointless. Some people will learn the hard way.

llperez
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sheltwon, im not calling you

sheltwon, im not calling you a racist. BUt you do bring race into a lot of things. To me, the great thing about the nba is that it transcends race. You have black owners, gm's, coaches, players, announcers, refs, everything. Black players are treated in no way unfair. SO as soon as one team drafts a white guy or something, im not seeing how you can pull race into it. As for hayward, i didnt even know this site had him going 10th until you brought it up. I just see players man. Call that naive if you want.

As for the one and done, it's all about green baby. GM's got tired of investing millions into kids straight out of highschool. They want ONE year of watching them play at a higher level so they develop and they get a better chance to evaluate them. Please dont tell me you think david stern and the nba billionaire owners are doing this becasue they dont like paying black people who are young. That's silly man.

IndianaBasketball
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I wasn't calling him racist

I wasn't calling him racist either. I'm just getting sick and tired of him bringing race into it whenever he discusses Hayward, Bird and the Pacers. To be honest... I wasn't even going to respond to this thread until I read what he said about Bird replacing Granger with Hayward. That was just wrong. Hayward isn't better than Granger and never will be. So what other reason would Bird replace Granger with him? What are you trying to say Sheltwon?

If Bird does draft Hayard, it won't be because he's white. I've said previously that the Pacers didn't need another wing, but the truth is... We need scoring on the wing. Other than Granger, we don't have a reliable scorer on the wing. Jones is a better scorer than everyone thought, but he's a defender. Rush is somewhere in between a defender and a scorer... He's not confident enough offensively. Dunleavy Jr. isn't the same anymore since his career threatening knee injury. We could use some scoring and good decision making on the wing. You have to think that Henry, Hayward and Babbitt are all on Bird's draft board along with Bradley and a few bigs. To be honest... We need to take the best player available.

And Sheltwon... Please post the source where you read Hayward was getting killed on defense at the combine.

I may be a little biased towards Hayward. That's because I've seen him in games and watched him compete against tough competition during training sessions. He's held his own against Courtney Lee, Eric Gordon, George Hill, Rodney Carney, Robert Vaden (overseas), Carl/Marcus Landry, Dominic James (overseas), Justin Cage (overseas), Jeff/Marcus Teague, Luke/Tyler/Cody Zeller and many other players that train with St. Vincent's Sports Medicine and 100% Hoops. I've watched him give some of these players the business. Hayward can play... And he's tough. He has a nastiness about him. I wouldn't be high on him if he was a bum.

We'll see who ends up being better between him and Babbitt. I don't know. Babbitt sounds like the better prospect. A lot of it will depend on where they're drafted. I wouldn't be mad at all if Babbitt went higher. The lower Hayward goes, the better to me... I hope he gets drafted to a team like the Spurs, Celtics, etc. Great organization, players and coaches.

PurpleMonkeyDis...
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ButlerDog

Baby Jesus is good.... thats the bottom line. Enjoyable to watch.... was the best player on the floor every game he played last season.

NathanStacey
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The difference is Gordon

The difference is Gordon Hayward led his team to the National Championship game.

skip-bayless-is...
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ive wanted to say this for a long time

sheltwon: is your keyboard broken or do you just forget how to spell all the time. it is impossible to read your giant paragraphs when it is riddled with grammar and spelling errors. im not making fun of you, but i usually just skip every thing you say.

p.s. stereotyping is not the same as rasicm. if i say white people suck at basketball that doesn't mean i hate white people. if i say BLACK PEOPLE ARE RUINING AMERICA then i am being rasict.

NathanStacey
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If your going to criticize

If your going to criticize Sheltwon, you need to have a picture ID as your avatar and tell everything about your personal life for him to listen to you. Otherwise, its just a waste of time.

cyclo
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The Pacers need a SG, not SF

With two very good natural SFs on their roster, Danny Granger and Mike Dunleavy, the Pacers and Larry Bird won't be helping themselves if they draft yet another SF Gordon Hayward.

The Pacers should be looking at a starting SG. I like Xavier Henry for them.

IndianaBasketball
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Bird thinks Hayward is

Bird thinks Hayward is similar to Dunleavy Jr. in the fact he can play the two and three.

skip-bayless-is...
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as a pacer fan and genious

i would rather have hayward on our team. the pacers need some playmakers and babbitt is like a poor mans troy murphey so why would we want him. what they really need is some one who can comepletely change the way they play offense. an explosive pg or a two guard with good ball handling would be nice.

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